I still haven't tried pluid but I really want to try the AO. Sounds delectable 
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Yeah, I realize - and it is funny as hell! I couldn't stop laughing - OMG, my stomach hurt so much!
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I still haven't tried pluid but I really want to try the AO. Sounds delectable
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I had the opportunity to drip some AO; its good stuff. I think I like pluid a bit better, but its very good for a bit of a change.
Got a neighbor that is now wanting a ProVari mini...missed out on the one this morning by...this much..lol.
I absolutely love orange flavors and while I haven't tried pluid I hear it is a very complex flavor. This excites me for AO. To be honest I haven't tried pluid because I'm too afraid of it. It glows, destroys most materials less fragile than my lungs, and apparently makes your tongue numb? Is no one else concerned by these things? Should I just give in and try it? Problem is I know I will love it because I love the taste of absinthe and black licorice.
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If youre scwred of pluid better stay away from citrus fruits and cinnamon cause both citrus and cinnamon oils will eat plastics. Add peppers and tomatoes to that as well. Peppers and tomatoes will eat certian metals. Better steer clear of water too, dontcha know it causes cancer? Show me one person whos had cancer that didnt consume water.
Sarcastic rant over.
Sarcastic rant over.
I suppose so. Just seems to me, at least from what I've read, pluid does it faster and is more aggressive at corroding things. I don't know this with certainty because like I said I haven't tried it.
I'm aware of all of that and do tend to stay away from cinnamon and I tend to moderate the citrus intake. But to be honest that rant reminds me of something smokers would have said before the science was solidified. Shouldn't we be able and willing to make these kinds of inquiries for the benefit of all vapers? It isn't as though I was being an alarmist.
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totally agree. i said something similar in another post and got chastised for it.
That's what I thought would happen which is why I hadn't posted about it until now. But I think being attacked for raising legitimate concerns defeats the purpose of this forum so I posted it anyway. It isn't as though pluid is the only juice out there that concerns me. There are many and I feel it is better for our community when we address these issues and advocate for proper research, rather than just assuming that because we aren't smoking there isn't any danger.
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Hey all.
Just checking in.
Faceless, I'm soooo glad to hear your little ones are feeling better.
Just checking in.
Faceless, I'm soooo glad to hear your little ones are feeling better.
Look, that's legitimate, although I think it has become a little exaggerated over time.
Pluid doesn't glow and doesn't make your tongue numb. It doesn't eat through materials that 'fragile', but rather targets certain chemically unstable plastics that shouldn't be used to store foodstuffs anyway. It doesn't eat through paper, for instance, or through plastics that are recommended for use with chemicals and foods, such as HDPE or PP (as far as I know).
BUT:
I.
My problem with ALL commercial e-liquids, Pluid included, is that they don't come with a list of ingredients. Well, most... You can obtain such a list for Dekang liquids and from V2 Cigs, probably others but these are the ones I know.
Do you realize that no other consumer product intended for ingestion or inhalation shares this... mystery?
So, you know, even before AEMSA, I always said one should be worried about inhaling stuff that has no lab tests and no ingredient list behind.
That's why I went DIY.
II.
We know, actually know, that the basic ingredients of e-liquid - nicotine, PG and glycerin - are safe. So, then, the only way you can really tell yourself that you are doing a reasonably safe thing is if you vape unflavored. The next best thing is to add a little menthol - it is one of the few flavorants out there that has extensively been used for inhalation and is generally safe-ish.
The more flavorful an e-liquid, the more unknowns are added to the equation. LOTS of pre-mixed contain multiple flavorants which are complex molecules and many other additives - sweeteners, stabilizers, colorants, ethanol, PEG, and so forth. While one can hope (again, no ingredient lists) the vendors actually only use food grade / GRAS substances, we have NO CLUE what such substances do when inhaled rather than ingested. We do know that some sweeteners do break down when heated and release carcinogens and pro-inflammtory molecules and so forth. We don't know the amounts that make it into the inhaled vapor. But we do know that some such exposures often do not have a linear exposure-risk profile.
We also know that to be dangerous, a substance doesn't have to manifest specific physical properties. No, all poisons do not turn silver black. The opposite is also true - not all things that may corrode certain materials are dangerous just because of that fact.
III.
Polycarbonate and certain LDPEs and other plastics should not be used for vaping.
We know that they leech into liquids based on the pH. A lot of juices, in fact probably MOST commercial juices have a relatively low pH. We also know that PG is a very good solvent and should be kept away from anything it can dissolve at low pH. So Pluid aside, no one should still be selling polycarbonate tanks!
Some vendor who specifically targeted Pluid for their attacks, was also boasting that their tank material is bullet proof. However, that material is not even close to acid / corrosion proof. That just goes to show what kind of cognitively impaired people make and sell vaping gear...
Again, there are a lot of unknowns, but one should always apply a rule of thumb - if a certain material is recommended for storage of laboratory reactants, then it is possibly safe for vaping. Otherwise, not. Period.
What I really am trying to say is Pluid has been singled out for reasons that do not make entirely a lot of sense, but the same reasons could make sense in urging a little more caution with all / most e-liquids and with many storage and vaping implements. And my opinion, which is probably very unpopular, is that until and unless e-liquids are subject to at least the same standards as foodstuffs and beverages this discussion is going nowhere.
I think inquiry and caution should NEVER be stifled. On the other hand, it is a bit unfair to ask Murdock to release hisbirth certificate ingredients while no other vendor has to.
Pluid doesn't glow and doesn't make your tongue numb. It doesn't eat through materials that 'fragile', but rather targets certain chemically unstable plastics that shouldn't be used to store foodstuffs anyway. It doesn't eat through paper, for instance, or through plastics that are recommended for use with chemicals and foods, such as HDPE or PP (as far as I know).
BUT:
I.
My problem with ALL commercial e-liquids, Pluid included, is that they don't come with a list of ingredients. Well, most... You can obtain such a list for Dekang liquids and from V2 Cigs, probably others but these are the ones I know.
Do you realize that no other consumer product intended for ingestion or inhalation shares this... mystery?
So, you know, even before AEMSA, I always said one should be worried about inhaling stuff that has no lab tests and no ingredient list behind.
That's why I went DIY.
II.
We know, actually know, that the basic ingredients of e-liquid - nicotine, PG and glycerin - are safe. So, then, the only way you can really tell yourself that you are doing a reasonably safe thing is if you vape unflavored. The next best thing is to add a little menthol - it is one of the few flavorants out there that has extensively been used for inhalation and is generally safe-ish.
The more flavorful an e-liquid, the more unknowns are added to the equation. LOTS of pre-mixed contain multiple flavorants which are complex molecules and many other additives - sweeteners, stabilizers, colorants, ethanol, PEG, and so forth. While one can hope (again, no ingredient lists) the vendors actually only use food grade / GRAS substances, we have NO CLUE what such substances do when inhaled rather than ingested. We do know that some sweeteners do break down when heated and release carcinogens and pro-inflammtory molecules and so forth. We don't know the amounts that make it into the inhaled vapor. But we do know that some such exposures often do not have a linear exposure-risk profile.
We also know that to be dangerous, a substance doesn't have to manifest specific physical properties. No, all poisons do not turn silver black. The opposite is also true - not all things that may corrode certain materials are dangerous just because of that fact.
III.
Polycarbonate and certain LDPEs and other plastics should not be used for vaping.
We know that they leech into liquids based on the pH. A lot of juices, in fact probably MOST commercial juices have a relatively low pH. We also know that PG is a very good solvent and should be kept away from anything it can dissolve at low pH. So Pluid aside, no one should still be selling polycarbonate tanks!
Some vendor who specifically targeted Pluid for their attacks, was also boasting that their tank material is bullet proof. However, that material is not even close to acid / corrosion proof. That just goes to show what kind of cognitively impaired people make and sell vaping gear...
Again, there are a lot of unknowns, but one should always apply a rule of thumb - if a certain material is recommended for storage of laboratory reactants, then it is possibly safe for vaping. Otherwise, not. Period.
What I really am trying to say is Pluid has been singled out for reasons that do not make entirely a lot of sense, but the same reasons could make sense in urging a little more caution with all / most e-liquids and with many storage and vaping implements. And my opinion, which is probably very unpopular, is that until and unless e-liquids are subject to at least the same standards as foodstuffs and beverages this discussion is going nowhere.
I think inquiry and caution should NEVER be stifled. On the other hand, it is a bit unfair to ask Murdock to release his
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