limiting further drop....kinda self evident
. Just because you have one known weak point, doesn't mean we shouldn't try to eliminate ones we can do something about.The (polite) Clone/Authentic discussion! :D
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limiting further drop....kinda self evident
. Just because you have one known weak point, doesn't mean we shouldn't try to eliminate ones we can do something about.
I hate the Igo-W personally, it's terrible, and the CLT kicks the crap out of it in almost every way. (It's a decent atty for those that like it don't get me wrong.) I simply find the best performing atty I can find to put on top of it
That at the moment is the (authentic) Asmodus rda, and it's a KILLER setup. Even if the asmodus clone was known to be just as good, I'd still end up buying the original, because I believe Asmodus has an amazing design, that is different than the run-of the mill atty.
To me, this is where we may differ brother, just because an atty is authentic, DOES NOT, guarantee that it's better/more impressive in any way. The Igo's are a perfect example of that ironically, they are all authentic, but frankly I've never liked any of them besides the Igo w14 & original w2 (discontinued), and even that had a post that would spin when I built hard on it. They are an original company, that sell mediocre atty's. 90% of the clones I've ever bought we're all miles better than the Igo's I've tried.
I'm an authentic LOVER, there's nothing I like more than an original design, in which I can pay tribute to the creators of that intellectual property. But if the quality standards don't pass my rigorous tests, and I deem it to be "over-priced", then I'll most likely end up trying the clone for a better price (if aforementioned clone passes my standards as well, I won't buy a crappy product, no matter the cost.). Some recent authentics that have blown my MIND for price to quality ratio recently are the; Odin RDA, and the 454 block. AMAZING atty's for under 80$!
I'm not cheap, I just research my .... off to find the best, period. But if for some reason a $20 atty is my ultimate favorite at the time, you bet your bottom dollar I'll put it on top of my 500$ atty. I mean why not if it's your favorite atty? Are you afraid someone will scoff at you, or it'll ruin the "coolness" of your setup?
The regular igo-w isn't great, but the igo-w5 is much better IMO, are they great? No, but for a $15-30 RDA it.For spinning post, that's because their insulators don't do too well with low sub-ohms, but after time even a high end RDA can spin.
It is providing more conductive metals, to help reduce more voltage drop and provides a harder and more consistent hit, without feeling a significant amount of drop off in power, where it is noticeable especially when using lower sub-ohm builds. Mods don't all hit the same, if they did everything would have the same exact contacts and or springs or magnets.
I have a silver plated spring in my mod, that obviously helps reduce voltage drop caused from the spring since silver is the most conductive metal and I have silver plated copper contacts. and my mod hits hard and harder than my other copper mods for a good reason.
For sure brother, I mean the russian 91% is technically a clone too
, it's my favorite version of them all. I'd love, (love love love) if one day they (authentic or otherwise) improved the kayfun's airflow drastically, they've gotten alot better like you said, but I think if they upgraded to a good 1/18th" at least, they'd be sooo much more popular. Still make it so it can be controlled/decreased of course, and then everybody, even big vapor lovers like myself would all be clamoring to get one! They've got an (obviously ) famous and epic design, I think it's not too far from virtual perfection! Lately my favorite benefit of the cloning game has been simply up-scaling, I think it's SO exciting that soon there'll most likely be a big brother to every favorite atty out there. When I figured out my favorite Tobh Atty would have a big cousin with more deck space for bigger coils, deeper drip well (which isn't that important to me either, it's just a big plus to me, I HATE when the drip well goes above the coils though, like the Omega, so hard to build and get a perfect build, it's like playing operation
.), bigger post holes, larger airflow, and just bigger capability in general, I was so excited for it to arrive at my mailbox! I liked that it wasn't a blatant clone of the Tobh (that could be sold AS the original), and that someone simply took the initiative to make it look flush with a bigger mod.Also I'm not that disappointed with the progression of creativity regarding authentics, I agree that the Atty's have always been on their game
, and too LOVE the cyclonic airflow design, it truly makes a difference (I recently got the Mutation X atty, and it's amazingly effective at making a little tornado. I actually pull my top cap off right after I took a pull, and as I did, there's was a little tornado that followed the top cap as I removed it. (Kinda like that tornado smoke trick, when you make a cloud on a table, and quickly pull your hand up to make a tornado.)I was just adding on to another idea as a response, and there are quite alot of authentic pieces that are VERY similar to something already done. I mean, 90% of all atty's are 3-post, with maybe an adjustable air slot, often what your paying for is the latest cool looking engraving
. I think I just meant that alot aren't changing the vape game enough to gouge the price like they are, we often say "clones are taking credit for someone elses idea, infringing on their intellectual property. But often times, the new item is literally identical to 95% of what's popular right now, with a handful of dimensions changed, or out of different materials.I gladly support authentic ideas that are out of the blue, and an idea that I could've never thought of myself. The Asmodus had a few neat things about it that just make it stand out, and I gladly payed the original makers. The design AND quality of the Asmodus are simply STUNNING, and I'd probably pay $200 for their work of art. I wouldn't buy the clone if it were $5.
Thanks for that catch brother
, I've been talking about the BFM too much lately! 
Your 100% right, I was talking about ANOTHER copper mod (the Copper mod by Scott UA) , which is basically a BFM without the brass ends.I'm just being pickier than I actually am about the C-clip, you can barely see it, much less feel it while using. I think it's just because I know it's there, Vapers OCD is on overdrive sometimes lmao. The copper by Scottua is one of the better mods I've owned, but believe me I don't have a "collection" by any means, unless you consider 6 a collection
, BUT it is an epic collection if I toot my own horn. Nothing but hard-hitters on this guy's desk .My favorite vape-shop has an excellent trading/purchasing policy, so I go through mods (sometimes) like I do library books
. So I don't have too many mods, but I've certainly OWNED too many in the past . That talon looks beautiful dude! I haven't heard of it until now, looks really quality designed!
Much better.
Actually I can.
Great quality authentics, (there are more inexpensive authentics, but I wanted to give examples of good quality),
$45 -Magneto
$30 -Fogger V4
---
$75 Total
Questionable quality clones
$21.54 -Kayfun v3.1 from Fasttech
$20 -Nemesis Style Mechanical Mod from Fasttech
---
$41.54 Total
$33.46 Price difference
$ 4.25 -Kanthal
$ 2 -cotton
$12 -ohm meter
$13 -2 batteries
$11 -charger NiteCore IntelliCharger i2
$34 -120 ml e-liquid from MBV
---
76.25
Gear + Authentics,
$151.25
Gear + clones,
$117.79
$180 -Average U.S. price for a pack a day smoker for 30 days. (June 20, 2014)
Sorry, but I simply don't believe that the price of authentics is holding anyone back from vaping.
Good point. Some of them actually do. However, the fact is that it can take years to aquire a patent, and until the patent is finalized there is not much you can do if someone overseas clones your product. Then it could cost hundreds of thousands of dollars to pursue it. As fast as this industry moves, it's almost pointless, unfortunately.
It's definitely possible to get some authentics for cheap, and I like the list you made, that's a very smart deal. Especially recently, some RDA's have been really putting effort into getting the consumer a good deal, the Odin RDA is a 60$ atty, which is made right here in the U.S. and is made well, alot like the Tobh in it's design. The 454 block is probably my favorite deal as of recently, the 454 block is $70, and it's SUPER capable too. It's built alot like the Fogger (only the center post is raised, and it has more than 1 hole for the other 4 negatives), it's very sturdy, American made of course
, and comes with massive adjustable airflow control, it even has a revolutionary way of mounting the negatives (it uses a ring that clamps down on whatever leads you put under it). Now I know the Magneto and the Fogger are low priced authentics, but they aren't great quality, they're good, but not great, even relative to quite a few (Infinite, HCigar, and occasionally Tobeco clones). I think it's AWESOME that they make products that basically everyone can afford, but you and I both know that those 2 are 2 of a very small selection of really cheap authentics. I wouldn't be surprised if those 2 were the ONLY $70 complete setup options, there are alot of Igo-series atty's that are really fairly priced, but again, I find most Igo's borderline terrible . It seems from my experience like the combination of both authentic and cheap classifications are a really bad outcome, for the same 70$, I can get an outstanding quality setup with clones (I know you probably don't believe that, but I've literally won cloud competitions with full clone setups, and those top notch performers looks GOOD too
. For instance, before I got my (authentic Asmodus for 120$; love it), my favorite complete setup was 60$!. The copper 26650 4nine clone was $39.99 ( COPPER 26650 4NINE MOD CLONE – $39.99 | Vaping Deals n Discounts.com ), and if you appreciate copper, this thing is BEAUTIFUL! It has super thick construction, and feels quality just by it's really, REALLY heavy weight. It's lines and logos were done perfectly, and the brushed finish is flawless, the threads literally feel like they have butter on them, it's one of those that you can spin shut with a single quick flick of your finger. It came with 2 powerful rare-earth magnets, which keeps the battery tight against the positive 510 of the atty (it's a hybrid, so no 510 connection) and doesn't allow battery rattle, even if you shake it as hard as you can (which I did ). The button (which is the most important part to me) is magical, ironically, it's just a tad smoother than my 18650 authentic Tarsius 4nine (which may be due to the Tarsius being stainless steel in it's defense), absolutely no catching, crunchiness, grinding, noise etc., it's just like pushing two guiding magnets together, almost like the button is floating in mid air. BUT the best part to me, because I'm a tech-nerd, an extreme ohm vaper, and just looking for the ultimate vapor producing machine, is the voltage drop! Other than my BFM by BCV (which is renound for it's superior voltage drop, literally the best at the moment), this 4nine clone is the best I've ever had, even out of the mountain of awesome authentics I've owned. It has an astound VD of .04 on a .5ohm atty, which is basically unheard of! It's still my favorite mod right now, perfect everything, it's just perfection, and the cherry on top is that it's $40! The 26650 Tobh Tobeco clone was the remaining $19.99 ( Big TOBH (28.5mm) Clone by Tobeco - Eciggity ), and it's just as good as my (22mm) Tobh Atty authentic in every way, it's just 1.5x bigger! Built like a heavy tank, the negative posts are milled out of a solid chunk of metal, the pressed center post hasn't moved a micrometer on me through very abusive building (my authentic Castle, Dominator, Omega, and Patriot HAVE spun before though). It's capable of any build under the sun too, many authentic's couldn't even begin to keep up with how big it's post holes, airflow, drip well, and vapor are.Whoo, I'm sorry I'm typing too much, I just love that setup though
. It's an excellent example of how much better a deal you can get if you simply research and find out what's truly and good deal, whether it be copying someone else or not (which I don't like, the copying is immoral, but sometimes it'll get you a deal that works better for you.). If I had a $70 dollar budget to find an awesome authentic setup, I'd have a TINY handful to choose from, your two above being included. I could get a magneto (which was my 2nd mod, and it's pretty darn good I'll admit, but I don't like telescopic mods AT ALL I figured out, and I didn't like the way it looked (didn't look cool to me whatsoever, besides the cool spider logo ), and to be frank, the quality of it's threads were pretty sub-par (I'm not lying to "win" here, I'm being 100% honest), the center piece in which the two halves connected made a "nails-on-a-chalkboard" squeaking sound to me when occasionally unscrewing, and after about 2-3 hours of busy vaping and moving around, it would work itself slightly loose to make a rattling feeling. It wasn't hard to fix as I just needed to twist it, but that bugged the heck out of me over time, the threads we're loose, I don't know if that's on purpose or what, but it just fired my atty, that's all I liked it for.I can't think of any other truly satisfying quality authentic's, which I don't have to bite my nails too much over purchasing, like I said earlier, instead of the fogger (which I haven't owned to be honest, but I don't like the look of it, just from the pictures it seems a bit "FastTech-y" if that makes sense (I've developed a distrust for FT), the deck looks cheap, I've seen a few around town at local shops and occasionally you'll see the post holes crooked to the others, and that makes me twitch
, the deck is VERY important to me, and I don't care much for a 5 post deck anyway. The posts are tall and skinny, with no drip well to hold the juice below the coils, it has a super thin insulator in the center, even though you can build 4 coils , there's only dual airflow, it's little things like that which make me think not the most amount of time went into designing this. The 510 connection is copper at least, but it has a big phillips head star in the middle to remove the center post, but since it's no longer flat, that affects the conductivity quite a bit, I don't like that all of them come with the shiny gold AFC ring, the chamber is unnecessarily huge which'll attack flavor, and the biggest annoyance to me is that you have 4 posts around the center post, BUT only 2 slots for your positive post, meaning two of the coils will have to reach to the other side of the post, thus making the coils uneven, probably leading to uneven heating.Again those two are good finds that you made, but they just don't cut it for me, I just don't think there are enough options in the world of cheaper authentics. Your basically stuck with only a few options, you can't do 26650 batteries, let alone atty's, you can find some variety on some cheap Igo's maybe, but there'd be alot of people stuck with something that "just works", without clones, less fortunate vapers may NEVER be genuinely EXCITED about their equipment, since there's not alot of variety they may not be able to try something they want to, they'd just be paying to vape period.
I myself am pretty fortunate, I have a great pharmacy tech job at the moment, and make quite a bit compared to the average 23 year old college student, I am 100% confident I could buy ANY mod and/or atty on the PLANET at the moment (as long as it's not solid gold or diamond encrusted etc.
), but I choose to find the best deal for my mulah, like my momma taught me . Occasionally I'll just go nuts and buy the more expensive authentic, solely because it has a serial number , but something many "authentic only" vapers don't know is, you can find amazing, and even BETTER quality clones for less than the original authentic. It's a stereotype (an often accurate stereotype, but not always) that all clones are cheap, and they'll break, and have something missing, or the authentic has something it doesn't, but sometimes it's the polar opposite. I've had quite a few clones that were much better, yes, much better because it was manufactured better, or the clone upgraded the materials from steel to silver.I'm always keeping my eye out for good priced authentics, because I truly want to support the original creator, but the odin I mentioned earlier for $60, is genuinely the best (acceptably awesome) deal out recently, in the micro-coil forum we even made a big deal about it recently how surprising a price that was. And even that good priced authentic is more expensive than some truly awesome clone complete setups.
Actually I've noticed when I would buy clones that Infinite would use brass contacts instead of silver plated or copper contacts in some of their clones. Also the Hcigar clone of the black/copper Stingray was pretty off it was 1 tube and had prints on the button when it shouldn't of, where Infinite had 3 tubes and no print on the firing button. What is my point with this...I forgot, but it was a good one.
I don't think the consumer should have to stand up for "poor companies" like you said either. But, if Infinite or Hcigar wanted to make their own products they could, Infinite copied the Hellio and the TOBH and Stillare and built 1 atty with all 3 designs and branded it with their name, which is fine IMO since authentic makers do the same. The Plumeveil has a dual positive post, I believe the Hellios was first, and somewhere the Igo-M did the same, and if you look at the fins on the TOBH and the Patriot someone did it first. So clone companies could of easily taken a design here and there and built a new product, with little minor changes.
Nice is that authentics are coming down. I mentioned about The Doomsday Mod by Intergalactic Industries is $120 and I just seen the Flagship MOD by SMK today in store $100-120 depending on metal (aluminum, stainless steel, brass, copper) all full bodied too. So some
Yeah the CLT is pretty much a "franken-dripper" (someone said that in the forum I posted when it came out
, I thought that was perfect), but like you said, that got me thinking and realized that most atty's are combinations of awesome things that work. The poor helios has like 8 brother RDA's that use it's post, some with heat sinks, the tobh was the first to mill it's negative posts into the chunk of metal that is the deck, and that's one of the coolest innovations in the past couple of years, airflow control must've been the bee's knee's when it came out! I (ironically) don't care much for adjustable airflow most of the time, I kinda like drilling my airflow the way I want it and it being permanent, the adjustable airflow is usually just another annoyance to worry about, BUT the Asmodus has fixed that, and that's one reason I bought it, they put a tiny grub-screw on the AFC cap that locks everything down in place, it's a really cool idea. They also made the gear-shaped cap easy to grab FOR ONCE lol, my bigarse gorilla fingers always have trouble with tiny pieces. It also slightly utilized the Tobhs airflow design, but altered it so you can either have adjustable dual OR adjustable quad airflow, all without having a ring on the outside to bump into. There haven't been to many absolute revolutionary ideas in the vaping world ever, if there ever is, I'll be sure to pay the inventor and not the copier. But all of the clones I buy are of products that basically anybody can make, if I were interested in the plume veil I totally would buy it from the originals because it has quite a few neat changes from your average RDA.
Yeah the CLT is pretty much a "franken-dripper" (someone said that in the forum I posted when it came out
There haven't been to many absolute revolutionary ideas in the vaping world ever, if there ever is, I'll be sure to pay the inventor and not the copier. But all of the clones I buy are of products that basically anybody can make, if I were interested in the plume veil I totally would buy it from the originals because it has quite a few neat changes from your average RDA.
I'm actually waiting to get my hands on an authentic Plumeveil. As far as innovative on my authentic Paragon it has a silver plated spring, I don't think any other mod has done that?
Does that annoy you? lol...
Yes the batteries contacts are steel and chromium, BUT, if you knew how conductors work, you'd know that the longer the "carrying metal" is, the more current you lose in the process. Since the battery conduits are literally attached directly to the power source, it almost doesn't matter what they're made of, because if it were made of copper it would nearly put out the same voltage.
However, since mechanical mods are often 8 inches long, and made of stainless steel, that STARTING VOLTAGE you get from the battery terminal, can get alot worse if your mod isn't conductive. In other words since the current has to go through your mod before getting to your coils, you can lose a significant amount of power after it leaves your stainless steel & chromium battery terminals.
I hear what your saying, but it's not snake-oil, it's cold hard empirical science that proves you'll get a noticeably better/harder vape (not to mention your battery life is the biggest improvement) with a really conductive mod. I've noticed this myself personally with my own mods too, switching from a terribly rated one, to a nearly voltage drop free mod.
For example if you have a stainless steel mod that is made of relatively thing stainless steel, and crappy contacts like steel, or tarnished brass, you can get a pretty large voltage drop of 0.5. That means your losing half of a volt! That may not sound like much, but since your power is down half a volt, instead of starting at 4.2v, you'll start with 3.7 (which is what a GOOD mod will vape at once it's battery begins to SAG), so your already at a pretty lame power. That means you fire longer to get the satisfying vape you want, so it's kinda like a chain reaction, your holding down the button longer waiting for you coils to get to the temp you want, and your firing through a mod that's only delivering part of the power. Most batteries start at 4.2, hover around 3.8 for about 3-4 hours, and then RAPIDLY lose power around 3.2 volts.
Basically, at 3.2 volts your battery's dead, almost everybody isn't satisfied at that voltage because it's trying hard to keep up, and end up charging it at that point. SO, with a terribly conductive mod, you start at 3.7 theoretically, and you only get to enjoy the vaping time from 3.7v-3.2v. When it comes down to it, a super good mod (.1-.07 voltage drop) can get a good 3-4 more hours of satisfying vape time, and during that time the power ramps up like a light bulb, and hits noticeably harder.
Ah yes, the lovely "Harley's Angels", up here in Alaska we have a few bars where they like to shove that attitude in your face. I get some minor "sass" because I ride a superbike, and they like to tell me to ride a "mans bike" all the time.
Meanwhile, a ride on my (awesome) SS1000RR BMW would have them screaming like they had their first menstrual cycle, one pull of 0-100mph in 5 seconds flat would make any harley rider poop their leather chaps lmao
. It doesn't matter though, alot of those harley fans are just trying to make their pricey bikes part of their identity, alot of them are either boring old men trying to seem tough and scary, or those that have bought them for an investment, because they "depreciate well", and just wanted a loud bike XD.I have met alot of "authentic only" vapers like that, but let's not talk about those elitists in this thread in case someone takes it the wrong way, we should stay polite so we can just discuss like gents
. But I TOTALLY know the type, they're usually on some type of moral-freedom-fighter like power-trip claiming that "modders are being stolen from by cheap chinese fakes", or that "cloning is ruining the american economy", or even talking about "that one time when my mod short-circuited out of nowhere, and welded the button pushed so I couldnt' undo it, and ruined their $300 atty on top, as well as gave them a 3rd degree burn right before their house was burned down". lol If a flashlight got cloned, nobody would care, because it's just not that important of a device to be honest. It's a battery holder for vaping for christs sakes!
. I bet if duracell's flashlight got cloned down to the logo, and someone started selling them on ebay for half the price, people wouldn't give a crap lol, they'd buy two for the camping trip they're about to go on. Nobody would start claiming that duracell is the primary intellectual property of this device, and that this guy is just despicable for reproducing it for a better price, just disgusting that they have the NERVE to recreate someone elses product! No, it's a flashlight, and they all are pretty much identical, some people just want a rubber grip on their flashlight that's all, who cares if they can find a rubber grip for half the price, good for that company for producing it more efficiently. If a mechanical mod comes out with an idea that blows previous designs out of the water, like a design that's just ingenious and changes the game forever, then I think it'd be pretty low to copy that idea and release it 2 weeks later at a cheaper price. But the thing is, THAT'S NEVER HAPPENED lol, it's always been; a battery, a tube, two contacts, and a button (on the bottom or on the side), wired or mechanical, so there aren't any "intellectual property" ideas to steal really, the first mod was a modified flashlight, so I think it's immoral that the so-called "authentic" manufacturers are shamelessly cloning that smart flashlight design!
JK
Nice thread treehead. I never get involved in threads such as this for obvious reasons. I feel this thread deserves the exception to the rule. Now if nobody opposes I wouldn't mind throwing my hat into the ring as well.
I had been waiting for one of my milestones before dabbling into the mech territory. Of course I didn't need to wait but was using it as incentive to make it to that point. After all it is a journey that I'm on and so many of us are on the same journey together with or without applying any thought to it. We all have different paths but for most all of us the goal is to permanently quit smoking no matter what the device may be and that does includes the use of clones for some.
Coming upon that date shopping around. Even for an experienced vapor, going through it all is enough to make your head spin. I had my mind made up prior not to get a clone. Even with making that decision, to me $200+ batteries, charger and more seemed kinda excessive. So armed with that mind set I ended up purchasing a bottom line but OEM mech mod. I've been around the forum long enough I knew what I was buying. Figuring I like to tinker anyways so the thought process was to tweak it into being a decent mod. I understand where some may point out the insignificance of the $200 with the cost saved on smoking. Yup, I was ahead of the game until Jan 1st came along and the medical insurance increase took all of that savings plus some. I guess that could be saved for another thread.
After three weeks of fixing all it's nuances, I never was able to overcome the lousy inconsistent switch. I decided to cut my losses rethinking my position regarding clones as it was compromising the integrity of the battery showing evidence indenting the negative end.
Finding myself where I started three weeks earlier. Going over all of the things I didn't care about with my mod with the kid in his mid 20's behind the counter. Silently listening to my frustrations and all the things I've done to "try" and correct them.
In turn he took out a mod from behind the glass case. Discussed all of the things this one had as to where mine didn't. He also pointed out to me that it was a clone that I was originally opposed to. He then let me try it using my battery and dripper. The difference was like night and day. I must of tried it at least 20 times. Smooth, consistent and immediate with no noticeable ramp up time.
So in the end I changed my position on clones through ill experience. So I guess it safe to say I was against them before I was for them.
To answer the original post. The etched in design doesn't really bother me. I would never try to sell it as original nor would I try to pass it off as original to an unsuspecting bystander. I do on the other hand wish it didn't have the serial number.
I had been waiting for one of my milestones before dabbling into the mech territory. Of course I didn't need to wait but was using it as incentive to make it to that point. After all it is a journey that I'm on and so many of us are on the same journey together with or without applying any thought to it. We all have different paths but for most all of us the goal is to permanently quit smoking no matter what the device may be and that does includes the use of clones for some.
Coming upon that date shopping around. Even for an experienced vapor, going through it all is enough to make your head spin. I had my mind made up prior not to get a clone. Even with making that decision, to me $200+ batteries, charger and more seemed kinda excessive. So armed with that mind set I ended up purchasing a bottom line but OEM mech mod. I've been around the forum long enough I knew what I was buying. Figuring I like to tinker anyways so the thought process was to tweak it into being a decent mod. I understand where some may point out the insignificance of the $200 with the cost saved on smoking. Yup, I was ahead of the game until Jan 1st came along and the medical insurance increase took all of that savings plus some. I guess that could be saved for another thread.
After three weeks of fixing all it's nuances, I never was able to overcome the lousy inconsistent switch. I decided to cut my losses rethinking my position regarding clones as it was compromising the integrity of the battery showing evidence indenting the negative end.
Finding myself where I started three weeks earlier. Going over all of the things I didn't care about with my mod with the kid in his mid 20's behind the counter. Silently listening to my frustrations and all the things I've done to "try" and correct them.
In turn he took out a mod from behind the glass case. Discussed all of the things this one had as to where mine didn't. He also pointed out to me that it was a clone that I was originally opposed to. He then let me try it using my battery and dripper. The difference was like night and day. I must of tried it at least 20 times. Smooth, consistent and immediate with no noticeable ramp up time.
So in the end I changed my position on clones through ill experience. So I guess it safe to say I was against them before I was for them.
To answer the original post. The etched in design doesn't really bother me. I would never try to sell it as original nor would I try to pass it off as original to an unsuspecting bystander. I do on the other hand wish it didn't have the serial number.
At the end of the day, its all about price.
A couple of hundred dollars to buy the top end product is a bargin, when compared to practically any other hobby, and a steal compared to smoking.
If a clone is as good as the original, or better, the original was crap to begin with.
At any rate, if price is the most important thing to you, then you will buy a clone.
A couple of hundred dollars to buy the top end product is a bargin, when compared to practically any other hobby, and a steal compared to smoking.
If a clone is as good as the original, or better, the original was crap to begin with.
At any rate, if price is the most important thing to you, then you will buy a clone.
Would you say that an authentic paragon is crappy to begin with? There are clones of it that are as good in function and build quality
I have an authentic Paragon v2, and out of my other 7 mech mods, 5 being all copper tubes, the Paragon definitely hits the hardest. But, the recessed button is kinda crappy since it's not actually recessed, but doesn't auto fire when standing.
Not sure about the v1 version or clones to compare it with though?
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I took a hit off of one of the workers at a local b&m paragon clone (side by side with the authentic the only difference was the carbon fiber on the clone wasn't real). It was the hardest hitting mod I'd ever experienced
I took a hit off of one of the workers at a local b&m paragon clone (side by side with the authentic the only difference was the carbon fiber on the clone wasn't real). It was the hardest hitting mod I'd ever experienced
I love my v2 Paragon, not sure if it performs better than the v1 or not, but I'd hate to buy a better mod and bench my Paragon. It must of been a pretty decent clone, since I've noticed some clones are horrible with going cheap on the contacts, using brass instead of copper or silver plated and or on copper pins.
Not all clones are created equal, same as with authentics. My nemy clone has silver plated contacts. The only thing holding it back is it's stainless steel instead of copper
I know not all are created equal, but for the price of some clones, and how they are designed to try to get someone to buy theirs over an authentic, but won't come close to the same performance, because of cheap pins. As an example many people condider infinite to be one of the best clone companies and they're at least one of the one's using brass contacts instead.
Funny you should mention the Nemesis is SS and copper hitting harder. I DON'T disagree with at all. When I first started using mechs I bought both, both clones and the same contacts and the copper hits harder. I'm actually battling with someone on a different thread saying SS, brass and copper tubes make no difference in voltage drop.
That person has no idea of electrical theory and conductivity. How could a better conductor not have less voltage drop?
I even posted a video from youtube of a guy doing a voltage drop test between a SS and Brass Nemesis clone both made by HCigar, using the same battery and same dripper obviously the same ohms and after testing the battery and the Brass wins, but he is still saying it's not the tube it's the battery's resistace and the pins and sends me a link to a different thread with no evidence and just replies with out facts.
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