Thinking about starting up again... :-/

[Kismayaz]

I'm sure some of you might remember me. I used to frequent these forums, and quit tobacco and nicotine altogether some six months ago.

For the past few weeks, I've been getting stronger and stronger cravings for cigarettes/snus/snuff/pv/etc. and I don't like it. Up until about the beginning of December I was just fine, and then the cravings started lingering up on me, getting stronger day by day, and now I'm about ready to snap.

It doesn't help that NO ONE on this forum put in an offer on the 70+ cans of snus I have sitting in my freezer that I view on a daily basis. But maybe it was a sign. Maybe I will go back to tobacco and, considering my test order on getsnus a few minutes ago for 10 cans of ettan white came out to $69.84, I will be spared many extra dollars for having this massive stockpile. Who knows.

I'm afraid to start up again. I really am. I'm afraid of feeling the feelings of guilt, the feelings of failure. But I'm afraid nothing else is filling this void in my life. I've been feeling depressed lately as well. Maybe this has something to do with it. I don't know. I just feel like if I take up tobacco again I will feel like myself again. Feel whole.

I'm sorry for using this forum as a blog of sorts, but I'm just trying to get my emotions out there and sort of vent if you will.

 

[rothenbj]

Kismayaz, you are not alone. I really started my journey with no desire to quit smoking and only got talked into E Cigs by my gf. Once I started vaping and reduced my cig consumption nearly ninety percent I decided I wanted to quit entirely. However, six months into it I started feeling as you describe and my cig count started going up. That's when I ended up over here on the dark side. I may have just missed your posts because I've been hanging out here now for something like 10 months and I can't recall anyone selling a bunch of snus or perhaps I wasn't sure what I wanted when you were selling.

Anyway, I can't remember where I read it, but it's just been recent, somewhere around 2/3's of all smokers have depression in their physiology. How they arrived at that number I have no idea but I had already figured that I had started smoking when I was pretty depressed in college and never looked back. Every time I had a quit attempt it was a major struggle and back to cigs in short order. The only "long" attempt was with Zyban and I did real well until a few weeks or so after stopping the pills which pretty well explained why I did well when on them, but soon returned to smoking after I quit using them. They are an anti-depressant.

It's really up to you what you do or don't do, but don't drive yourself crazy feeling you have to stay off tobacco or nicotine. Just stay off the cigarettes. 10 1/2 months since my last puff on one and the difference in breathing is amazing. I don't snus a lot, normally 4 or 5 portions a day, sometime more rarely less but I don't worry about it. The zealots are the ones that want you to either quit or die. I still vape here and there, but Ss has been my savior. I was wheezing and coughing up a storm after they but the FSC into the cigarettes and I would have been a mess if I hadn't found my way here.

Do what you have to do but remember what I learned on this web site-

"If your happy and you know it, pop a snus!"

 

[rothenbj]

Forgot one thing. I don't know how bad the Fla taxes are, but get over on What's under your Lip thread. You should be able to order from some sites that leave you pay the taxes later when ordering from Sweden. Here in PA we still don't have excise taxes on smokeless and I manage to keep my orders in the low $3 per can range. You have to register with the various sites and look for the deals. When ordering from Sweden, if you can catch a free shipping deal it can be sweet, but you have to be prepared to buy a lot. Just ideas. You have a decent supply now so you have time.

 

[jj2]

Don't get on yourself too bad. I was nicotine free for over a year and then started back on it.
At least I didn't light up an analog.

 

[hittman]

Hello Kis. I remember you well. I have been going thru a struggle of my own too and finally decided to give up on the guilt thing and do whatever it takes to work past this hurdle. In the end you are the one that has to live with yourself. Just because you use some snus to get you thru a rough patch doesn't mean you can't quit again if you want to. I wish you the best of luck and don't be a stranger. You know that we take care of our own here and will help if we can.

 

[firechick]

PM in your inbox, Kiz.

 

[TWISTED VICTOR]

Hiya Kis. Sure we remember, who could forget a mug like that ? Don't worry about that lil nic thing, take a load off and pop a snus in. Or vape....or both. No reason to suffer. It's just like my coffee in that I don't like being a slave to it, but it doesn't seem to hurt anything and it enables me to take on a more human form to easily blend in with the crowd.......

 

[Stubby]

Well...... this may not be the best place to ask for advice...... I mean....... this is the dark side...... So as you know you want it...... why do you resist...... Don't you know by now how wonderful life can be with that blessed nicotine cursing through you blood...... all your problems will disappear........ all that wonderful snus just within reach in the freezer....... just look at it....... can't you hear it calling you.........

Seriously though, impossible to say what is best for you. You have to decide if the quality of life would be better or not if you used tobacco/nicotine. And if it's worth the downside. Health certainly isn't a issue with reduced harm but there may be other things, like the whole idea of being addicted to something, and the money etc.

I know people who have quit for decades and still miss it everyday, and for others they never miss it. Where you are in this only you can figure out.

 

[Kismayaz]

Hey, thanks for all the replies. I should have known everyone here would recommend a snus for a cure

I'm thinking that will be the route I will take. My anxiety and depression have been getting worse every day. I'm trying to see a doctor, but all I've been getting is appointments 30 days out. I could either stick it out until then and maybe get on some medication... or medicate myself with nicotine.

I would prefer the naturalism of using a plant like tobacco for help rather than a chemical anti-depressant/anxiety medication, but the addiction is what worries me the most. I envy my girlfriend, as she can have 1-3 cigarettes at a family gathering/other social setting, and she'll never think to pick up another one again any other time.

If I knew for an absolute fact that I could use tobacco only in times of stress to help me feel better, that would be fantastic. It's the unknown that worries me. I'm just going to have to decide on my own what I need to do.

At least I do feel better now, knowing that if I should come this way I have such an understanding and caring group of friends here on ECF. Thank you all so much. You may see me soon.......

 

[hittman]

Kis, let us know how things go for you. I wish you the best.

 

[TWISTED VICTOR]

Well Kis, consider this: If addiction to nicotine is the only downside, meaning no health issues, why submit yourself to pharma products, where we have a arms-length list of side-effects. Also, antidepressants are a crap-shot. The doc prescribes one, then waits to see the outcome to decide if it was the right one.

Also, any antidepressant will take a minimum of 3 weeks in our system before any results can be had (don't forget about the crap-shot outcome). Meaning that unless we take it day in and day out we'll need a 3 week notice before the onset of stress. There's nothing quick about antidepressants (tho much could be said for morphine, but that's another subject). Another downside is that we can't just stop taking 'em. The dosage has to be reduced over time (weening off). Some common ones can commit worse atrocities on our psyche from withdrawal then what we experience with smoking cessation (sorta like a quick tazer-to-the-brain feeling or "brain shocks" as they're better described).

Now take that tasty snus portion.....no ill will, no malice, no health problems, works in minutes....it's only crime is it makes us want more. My granny used to drink a herbal tea that she said kept her calm so's not to smother Grandpa in his sleep. She drank a cup mid-morning and another one an hour or so after supper. I know she was addicted, but physically or psychologically I really don't know. I do know it never caused any problems, plus Grandpa always woke up on the topside of the pillow .

 

[rothenbj]

Gee TV, that weening process off antidepressants sure sounds like slow withdraw from any other addiction. Of course, it's okay to be addicted to pharma products, they have a pill for that.

 

[hittman]

That is funny and true Roth. I don't even pretend to know what all the meds my wife has are or what they are for. It seems like the doc has a pill for whatever ails you.

 

[Skrymr]

Kis, you know we are here for you no matter what route you take.

 

[TWISTED VICTOR]

Gee TV, that weening process off antidepressants sure sounds like slow withdraw from any other addiction. Of course, it's okay to be addicted to pharma products, they have a pill for that.

Back in the good ol' days all one needed was to be shackled down sideways (to avoid vomit-induced asphyxiation), a strapped on tongue depressor and someone to administer a shot o whiskey once every 6 hours. The orange dinosaurs and little devils eventually went away on their own.

 

[rothenbj]

Morning all. Kis, your post was the first I read this AM and in my completely aware, nothing else on my mind mood (after taking the morning wiz and giving the dogs the same opportunity) your statement about addiction and the history of tobacco. In my youth smoking was just smoking. My parents never smoked and most of our neighbors didn't either in primarily a blue collar neighborhood, Actually the more upwardly mobile neighbors did and eventually moved on to bigger and better. I guess it was more economically motivated restraint than anything else. My aunt who taught 1st and 2nd graders smoked like a chimney, probably while she was teaching if you ever saw they way she never had a cigarette not in her mouth. It was just a fact of life. She lived to her mid 80s. My dad died at 77 after over three years fighting bone cancer.

Then came the start- nicotine found to be addictive. Wow, addicting! All of a sudden people talked about getting a nic fix, then jonesing for a cigarette. The expressions were basically a joke back then. Then came the puritanic, zealots that started the anti-smoking movement. Koop, became the father of the anti-smoking movement in the early years and pushed the addiction angle hard. All the health risks-cancer, heart attacks, COPD, all caused by smoking. All attacked by raising the price of cigarettes to try to discourage the smoker.

Soon BP found that they had a tremendous opportunity to benefit mankind by getting people off cigarettes but how? I wonder who the genius was that came up with selling oral nicotine, in low doses of course, to help people quit smoking. But a few more people were able to quit the habit, er addiction, to pulling a cigarette out, lighting it and putting it to you lips and inhaling. Now the war was on. People were making money, lots of money on the smoker. The ?non-profit?"health" associations who way back when actually appeared to actually care about peoples health saw themselves making major corporation type revenue selling the concept. The money came from everywhere. People died of cancer and the first thing you did was contribute to the ALA or ACS, heart attacks AHA, tax money was pushed their way from government, BP paid them to keep up the good fight. The ?non-profit?"health" associations got fat and naturally others saw they wanted a piece or a bigger piece of the pie. Banzass saw the opportunity early CTFK much later, but the money was flowing and noboday wanted it to stop.

Anti-smoking became anti-tobacco even when there were tobacco products that were orders of magnitude safer products out there, thus the campaign to discourage alternatives. Today they've not only convinced many that smokeless is bad, but many believe it's worse. Then came anti-nicotine, unless of course BP supplies it. I found it amusing the Oregon has a bill to reclassify nicotine as a class-3 narcotic, get your script from the doc and pick up your cigarettes at the pharmacy. Visualize that one. You can bet that none of the antis will support that one.

So through this progression we have arrived at the "fact" that nicotine is now the most addictive drug in the universe unless, of course, you can get all those caffeine addicts to admit that they are in denial. I personally could have vaped 48mg liquid constantly and only managed to get a serious headache and still not felt satisfied.

I just wish these people would mind their own business and leave everyone else mind theirs. End of rant.

**edited cause**

This post was meant for the what's under you lip thread but I got so dazed over by the "addiction" word that after I sold my children to feed my addiction I got lost and ended up waking up here.

 

[Kismayaz]

Hey Roth, I really enjoyed reading your post, as well as the history lesson lying therein. However, I'm not quite sure I understand the message you were trying to communicate. Are you trying to tell me that tobacco isn't as addictive as everyone thinks it is? Or that using tobacco isn't as harmful to your health as everyone believes? I know there is a lot of misinformation out there, not only on tobacco, but on many different subjects. If you could just help me understand your post better I would appreciate it. I'm sure you're just trying to help. Thanks

 

[rothenbj]

Quick bottom line from my perspective. Smoking is probably bad for you over a long long time and as much as I was smoking. So is wood smoke, diesel fuel and a ton of other thing inhaled. Nicotine is addictive, but no more so than a lot of other products including caffeine, carbohydrates, processed sugar, video games texting,,,,you get the picture.

Something in tobacco and for me it's not even nicotine makes people enjoy life they would not otherwise enjoy. These are the ones that the prohibitionists will never get to quit. THR tries to address this and they're fought tooth and nail by those that make a living in the anti movement. The message is you shouldn't force yourself to suffer trying to please someone else.

 

[TWISTED VICTOR]

Good post, roth. Although I was younger, that's the way I remember it happening. The ol' neighbor who ran the gas station 2 houses down and across the road didn't mind selling a teenage kid a pack of smokes since the anti movement hadn't properly kicked in, yet.

As a side-note, don't forget about "smoking related illnesses". You know, those same diseases non-smokers get, but we don't talk about.

 

[hittman]

TV, your post reminded me of one time when I was less than ten years old and my older sister( six years older) took sixty cents in pennies out of my penny bank and walked up to the local store and bought a pack of smokes. I know she was less than sixteen at the time and they didn't think twice about selling them to her.