This forum might need to be cleaned up...

[Worutaa]

I'm all for the ECF. It's got immensely useful information. So much information has been presented on this forum and because of it countless people have made a switch from analogs to PVs. There is a problem, however. There is so much information that newer people are being turned away. I've seen quite a few threads in the newb forum being started asking the same questions:

"Is my [overpriced mini model] good? I tried to find the info here but there was too much info so I used google"

"What model should I choose? I want it to last forever and have perfect draw and flavor and I want it to be cheap.. etc"(me too!)

And you could say "Well, if you read the stickies, you could have saved yourself and others some time"... The problem is, there are so many stickies.

Essentially my request is if it would be possible for a team of some of the top contributors to work on a project? Veterans that have experience with countless PVs and setups and rigs to come together for an end-all-be-all sticky. Something that incorporates all of the knowledge from the beginning of this forum till now.

I know the previous stickies are useful, and they represent people working through problems or having AHA! moments.. and those that are truly in search of all available knowledge should definitely look them over. However, I propose that the older stickys that aren't of immediate value to a general newcomer be moved to an archive of stickies or something similar.

I also understand that this site isn't for endorsing certain brands or distributors. It's for getting the information out there to the users. If all of this information is hidden, however, it's of no value. It's hard keeping it all organized, I imagine. And I'm certainly not proposing a complete reboot of the site (well... maybe that wouldn't be a horrible idea lol) but hear me out...

Best E-Cigarette for a New User

This is by far the most useful information to a newb. If you use that as a backbone for the sticky most of the work is done. It is a little (not much) dated, however, and I believe a general idea of *appropriate* prices should be included (I know, prices are subject to change so a little upkeep may be necessary. I just want to avoid someone paying 300 dollars for an 808 kit AFTER visiting the site) as well as possibly adding links to a variety (4-10) of vendors with a good reputation that offer the product (that DONT charge 300 dollars for a KR808)

Follow up with information on safety and links to other threads or stickies that pertain to what the user is looking for in the (I guess it's more of a tutorial)... If a newb is coming in looking for a cigarette sized model and get so much information like why you shouldn't use unprotected batteries, they'll probably be turned off. If, however, they are interested in mods, point them in the right direction by linking them to another fantastic sticky about mods.

Hopefully the people that work on this project are a bit more succinct than I am but if this can be done, with a clearly written (HEY NEWBFACE, LOOK HERE BEFORE YOU MAKE A FOOL OF YOURSELF; IT WILL TAKE 10 MINUTES AND YOU'LL BE A PV MASTER) or something a little less gaudy lol... it might help.

I guess the thing is a wall of stickies kinda turns people off. People are lazy, and want instant gratification. I'm an oddity for actually reading all of the stickies, I can guarantee you. I didn't intend to put the site down or hurt anyone's feelings or anything of the sort, just putting out my on what could help people and the forum.

 

[JerryRM]

I have no doubt that you didn't intend to hurt anyone's feelings, but something should be cleared up. New members may be reading this thread and they shouldn't get the impression that they could make a fool of themselves. We were all new members/new vapers at one time and so many of us, including myself, started vaping with less than desirable equipment.

So, for the new members/vapers, go ahead, try whatever you will, no one here will laugh at you. We are here to help you find the best vaping equipment for your needs.

As for cleaning up the forum, I am in agreement with you 100%. Trying to find information here is darn near impossible, there are too many old and outdated threads clogging up the works. Archiving them would be a great idea.

 

[salemgold]

Also, most of the questions asked by noobs do not fall under the one size fits all answer category.

How boring would this forum be if none of us had to talk to each other and help each other out?
I have met and made some very good friends by answering their questions and by asking some myself. JMO

 

[Homedude]

Also, most of the questions asked by noobs do not fall under the one size fits all answer category.

You are very right. The problem is that a lot of the answers given ARE one size fits all. When reading through the newbie forum, I can predict who the poster is by what equipment they recommend. They don't actually read the original post and consider what is really being asked, they just spout their favorites. More reading comprehension, more thought and less parroting is what is needed here. There are some posters who are such rabid fanboys/girls that I would never dare to contradict them even if I know they are giving bad advice just because I don't have the time or desire for a knock-down drag out battle over what a newbie buys.

The cleanup needs to start before the "Post" button is pushed.

 

[salemgold]

I had to LOL when I read your post, Homedude. That type of thing happens all over the forum and I feel the same as you do about contradicting the fans It is unfortunate that some people have the attitude that you are either with them or against them. They just consider you against them if your opinion differs from theirs.

That is the individuals though and no fault of the forum IMO. You are going to see that anywhere.

 

[Mr.Mann]

I feel weird about posting here (I am always in general e-liquid discussion). I started vaping January of 2011, an was always baffled by the forum. I joined in December 2011 but still could not make heads or tails of all the info...plus, I was confused and slightly frightened by the elitist side of things. In January of this year I fell in love with SteelJan and then with PBusardo. Those two got me caught up to speed quick fast and in a hurry. Now, I feel I know enough about what I am interested in, and more importantly what I am not interested in. Because of those two (specifically), I felt that the ecf was my next step. I always recommended (past tense with SteelJan ) those two for beginners before jumping into this or any forum. I have said before, "I think too much information can lead to anxiety, which can lead to paralysis, which can lead to a cigarette".

 

[Oliver]

Hey everyone,

I just wanted to chip in here in agreement.

The basic problem is that the forum is huge, and there really is no efficient way of sorting out the good from the bad from the dated. Because of this good info gets lost very quickly.

We have been working on a content management system for over a year to try to address this, and this is where the post that Worutaa linked to is found.

A CMS is a very tricky and sensitive thing to set up though, and due to time constraints we haven't been able to develop it fully. That will change over the summer, as I will be working full time on getting content up there, I hope with the help of members such as yourselves.

The role of the CMS is to provide a proper repository for important information, and to complement the forum by hosting answers to questions that get asked often, but can't be dealt with by FAQs.

One of our biggest stumbling blocks is working out the best way to improve the member experience without detracting from the forum, and without increasing workload for our admin in such a way that the completion of tasks becomes impossible. Just to give you an example of how this can easily happen - I set up a coupon code subsite last week. A simple wordpress installation with an installed theme, right? Nope, it's taken nearly a week of full time work, sorting out all the niggles, and uploading the information - and it's still not done.

This was done to remove 1 sticky! (and improve the member experience)

So, there you have it - I'm in full agreement with the OP, and actively looking for ways to improve things, and I'm always, always grateful to receive suggestions.

SJ

 

[JerryRM]

Hey everyone,

I just wanted to chip in here in agreement.

The basic problem is that the forum is huge, and there really is no efficient way of sorting out the good from the bad from the dated. Because of this good info gets lost very quickly.

We have been working on a content management system for over a year to try to address this, and this is where the post that Worutaa linked to is found.

A CMS is a very tricky and sensitive thing to set up though, and due to time constraints we haven't been able to develop it fully. That will change over the summer, as I will be working full time on getting content up there, I hope with the help of members such as yourselves.

The role of the CMS is to provide a proper repository for important information, and to complement the forum by hosting answers to questions that get asked often, but can't be dealt with by FAQs.

One of our biggest stumbling blocks is working out the best way to improve the member experience without detracting from the forum, and without increasing workload for our admin in such a way that the completion of tasks becomes impossible. Just to give you an example of how this can easily happen - I set up a coupon code subsite last week. A simple wordpress installation with an installed theme, right? Nope, it's taken nearly a week of full time work, sorting out all the niggles, and uploading the information - and it's still not done.

This was done to remove 1 sticky! (and improve the member experience)

So, there you have it - I'm in full agreement with the OP, and actively looking for ways to improve things, and I'm always, always grateful to receive suggestions.

SJ

SJ, what should we the members do to help you with this?

 

[Oliver]

SJ, what should we the members do to help you with this?

Hey Jerry,

Well, for the short term, hold tight! I have an ace developer working to get the gubbins up and running, and once that's up, we'll sort out navigational areas.

When the basic structure is sorted, we'll start adding content. I'm going to be writing as much as possible over the next few months, looking deep into the forum for lost topics etc, moving the content of stickies over and so on.

I haven't really any true idea of how much time is going to be involved in this. As I said above, the simplest seeming things can take forever. I believe this is known as the 'planning fallacy'.

One sticking point has been what to name the new area, by the way. I'm not a fan of infopages, to be honest, and want something a bit more catchy. I came up with 'ECF Knols' today - based on the (now sadly deprecated) google project where a Knol is a unit of information.

I liked the Google concept, because they wanted to have Knols curated by an expert in the particular subject - kind of like Wikipedia, but with more certainty that what you're reading is authoritative. Perhaps this would work better with something like ECF, where the subjects up for discussion are rather specialized.

Honestly, though - I'm kinda thinking out loud here. Like anything we do on ECF, I want it to develop and see where it takes us. But the basic point is that this is probably the biggest project we can undertake at this point - and the one that makes the most sense right now, for all the reasons mentioned by the OP. All input on every aspect will be essential.

I hate to say it, but I guess the best way to do this collaboratively will be to start a new subforum to discuss it! We'll almost certainly do that in due course.

Cheers,
SJ

 

[meatsneakers]

I think a wiki would really tie the massive amount of info together.

For instance - I just read that first info page posted here for the "best e-cig for a new user" and there is a ton of terminology that I couldn't make heads or tails of if I was a brand new user fresh off of Google.

I think a lot of us have forgotten what it was like to really have 0 idea of how these things worked and the terminology was probably the largest part of it. What is an atomizer? What is a 510? etc etc. It seems trivial now, but to have all this info condensed with linked pages such as a wiki would really help people get a quick grasp on it.

The word LR hot linked in a article about cartomizers? A newbie can read about it by clicking and getting a complete idea from a page dedicated to LR. Then they see a link for ohms. What is an ohm? etc etc. E-cig info, in my opinion, is so in-depth and varied that single-page information is not the ideal way to get it all across.