EU TPD vote: Europe has fallen - Big Money has triumphed

[jpargana]

Don't have the actual text yet, but this was just tweeted: EUROPA - PRESS RELEASES - Press release - Questions & Answers: New rules for tobacco products

The ecig portion is about halfway down the page.

ETA: Just skimmed the press release, and IMO it's pretty much self-serving PR.

Wow!! Just WOW!!! How IMBECILE, how HYPOCRITE, can those people, who have SOLD our health, can be??

"Governments and society as a whole will benefit from improved public health, namely longer healthy lives. Health is a value in its own right, and a healthy population is a key factor for economic growth. The reduction in tobacco consumption resulting from the new measures is calculated to translate into annual healthcare saving to the amount of €506 million."


Do you really mean to tell me, that you actually believe that by restricting the MOST effective electronic cigarette types, you will improve public health?? Your ambitious goal is, "2% drop in consumption of tobacco over a period of 5 years. This is roughly equivalent to 2.4 million fewer smokers in the EU"? Really? There are already around 1.5 million vapers, AND EX-SMOKERS, in the UK alone!!

"In order to ensure the visibility of health warnings, cigarette packs will be required to have a cuboid shape and each pack will contain a minimum of 20 cigarettes."

So... to make warnings more visible (not that it has worked in the past, you see, many smokers have GOOD SIGHT, thankyouverymuch. And still we smoked on), you decided to ban 10 cig-packs... How is that going to encourage people to smoke LESS? In the US, the size of sodas is being restricted to SMALLER sizes. In Europe, the mandatory packet size is being restricted to BIGGER sizes... does that make any sense at all?

Sorry, rant over...

 

[Anjaffm]

@SmokeyJoe:

excellent summary.
I have only been involved with this fight for a little over 2 years, but my experience is the same.

 

[Oliver]

Oh, and I almost forgot - TVECA!

It's hard to know what their influence was, but they sent a letter claiming they (and their associates) represent 80% of the European industry and that they fully supported the final draft of article 18.

It was referred to by Linda McAvan, who stated that the e-cigarette industry was fully in favour of the proposals. If you look at the roster of companies that are members of TVECA you'll see that they are overwhelmingly cigalikes.

So, when it comes to lobbying, it's possible that the most insidious part of it came from within the e-cigarette industry. Although, that said, I tend to think of the industry as being formed of two separate but parallel industries.

 

[Oliver]

@SmokeyJoe:

excellent summary.
I have only been involved with this fight for a little over 2 years, but my experience is the same.

Thanks Anja. I should clarify that I've been involved in the EU side of things for about 1 year, but in the overall regulatory machinations (in the UK) since 2010.

 

[Anjaffm]

Well, TVECA is a branch of CORESTA.
And who is CORESTA?
An association headed by the Tobacco Industry:

BOARD MEMBERS (2012-2014)
Alliance One International (USA)
Borgwaldt KC GmbH (Germany)
British American Tobacco (UK)
China National Tobacco Corporation (China)
Imperial Tobacco Ltd. (UK)
Japan Tobacco Inc. (Japan)
KT&G Corporation (South Korea)
Papierfabrik Wattens GmbH &
Co KG (Austria)
R.J. Reynolds Tobacco Company (USA)
Sodim SAS (France)
Swedish Match North Europe Division (Sweden)
SWM International Inc. (USA)
Universal Leaf Tobacco Company (USA)
University of Kentucky (USA)

source (German)

 

[AgentAnia]

University of Kentucky has a board member on TVECA? Ellen Hahn's University of Kentucky? What the ...?

 

[jpargana]

Well, TVECA is a branch of CORESTA.
And who is CORESTA?
An association headed by the Tobacco Industry:


source (German)

Follow the money trail. TVECA has back-stabbed vapers to protect their true interests.

 

[Anjaffm]

Follow the money trail. TVECA has back-stabbed vapers to protect their true interests.

of course they have.
The industry / dealers make more money with non-refillable throwaway junk.

Big Tobacco - gains. Gets the EU e-cig market handed to them on a silver platter. To market their silly, ineffective, overpriced throwaway trash to the entire EU. Competition wiped out - thanks to "friendly" politicians.
Big Pharma - gains. Can continue to sell expensive, ineffective NRTs and make a bundle on selling treatment for sick smokers.
Big Government - gains Can continue to collect cigarette taxes.

The only one who loses in this deal is the consumer. The human being. But who on earth cares about human beings anyway?

 

[jpargana]

hmm, unless I'm missing some over-arching definition of Electronic cigarette here, an Electronic Cigarette onlyexists if it has nicotine in it. A Battery, Tube, Atomiser and Tank are only e-cigs if they have nicotine in them. Trying to find the relevant definitions now. The law, from the reports I have now found, is fan-drafting-error-tastic for little things which mean not what they should.


Ok, found it, all devices that are capable are e-cigs, it's the refill containers that do not count unless they have nicotine in. Although note. An e-cig designed for nasal use is not covered by the policy, so we could all just switch, right?

And yet, there is potential on that idea... people have curbed insane laws for less than protecting their health!

I can see the new generation (4th ?) of atomizers: something that you coud screw IN PLACE of the bulb in a metal-tube flashlight (It's NOT and e-cig, officer, it's just a flashlight missing it's lamp ), having not one MOUTHPIECE, but two 'nose-pieces' to fit in your nostrils (Look, officer, it's NOT a mouthpiece. There are TWO tips; people only have ONE mouth... )

 

[SPACKlick]

So here is the top comment from the BBC's report on this

We ecig users have battled & fought for our right to stay off of tobacco using our devices. As adults we enjoy flavours (I exclusively use sweet ones at 35yrs old) & it is right that we can access ecigs as freely as we can tobacco. We have been largely ignored & sometimes slandered so today was a huge win for us. Ecigs ARE regulated despite what the public are being told & do NOT harm others.

Wish I could ask what Luna sees to celebrate that I don't.

 

[LDS714]

Those who voted to pass this should go down in history right alongside other mass murderers, especially those of the first half of the 20th century.

 

[sebt]

So here is the top comment from the BBC's report on this

Please comment on this (if you haven't already) pointing out how wrong Luna is.

I can't find this report at all - do you have a link?

 

[SPACKlick]

Please comment on this (if you haven't already) pointing out how wrong Luna is.

I can't find this report at all - do you have a link?

Comments are now Closed, which is what made me realise...I'm looking at the report from October 2013 when the directive was changed. Very sorry. All I can find on the BBC is these two tweets from their live EUparliament stream.

12:30: Contrasting views coming in from today's vote on e-cigarettes. The Green group tweets: "ECR group is trying to filibuster a vote on new, stronger EU rules on #tobacco products"
12:31: Whilst the Conservative group retorts: "@GreensEP Not true. Trying to ensure the voice of #ecigs users are heard. Not against rest of TPD"

 

[sebt]

Our "frog's-legs-flavour vaping" friends are on the case already, promising a legal challenge as soon as this passes into French law:

Régulation outrancière des e-cigarettes par les instances européennes : dès sa transposition en droit national, elle sera contestée en justice !

I particularly like one French word used to describe Article 18 of the TPD: "liberticide"

We should all try to scare our governments in the same way. (Bet the Hungarians who kicked off EFVI would be on for it!). I'm off to join ECCA UK!

 

[FourWinds]

There are peeps over at UKV (UKVapers) that have been preparing legally for some time too.

 

[SPACKlick]

There are peeps over at UKV (UKVapers) that have been preparing legally for some time too.

Any links so we can get involved?

 

[rolygate]

It reveals an effective combination of corruption and fear: the power of those MEPs who are in effect pharma voting seats, together with the fear of other MEPs of being called supporters of smoking if they voted against the TPD.

We'll now see a huge black market in Europe, especially in the UK. This is because the TPD will be interpreted in the strictest possible sense in the UK, and the maximum force of law will be brought to bear on any vendors (or others) who are deemed to be breaking it.

In the UK, smoking prevalence remained static at around 20% from 2008 to 2012. In 2013 there are preliminary signs that ecig use was beginning to cut smoking prevalence (the ONS stats are not out yet, R West's data appears to show the start of a drop as ecig use rose). The number of UK smokers rose by about 0.5 million between 2008 and 2012 - this is because prevalence was static but population growth meant the 20% smoking sector grew in size. The new TPD will probably reverse this and the number of smokers will start to rise again (unless the black market can supply the effective ecig products the TPD bans).

We will now see the beginning of a process that is designed to restrict ecig sales by around 99% in order to protect pharmaceutical and cigarette industry sales and tax revenues, while allowing claims that, "We didn't ban ecigs." As I have warned all along, this was the original target and medicinal regulation was a red herring. The people who engineered this have allocated tens of millions of Euros to this process and have hired the best advisors to ensure success. They aren't stupid, and they certainly aren't stupid enough to think medicinal regulation would fly. The new TPD does 99% of the job medical regulation would do, with the additional benefit of being able to claim (with the usual disinformation) that ecigs are not banned.

Perhaps now people can see how murderously corrupt and incompetent the EU is, and how easily it is manipulated by commercial interests; and how blatant their lies are when the most important effect the TPD will have is to protect cigarette sales.

Tobacco control measures haven't worked for years. Their latest policy will protect cigarette sales for the foreseeable future.

 

[FourWinds]

Any links so we can get involved?

I'm not sure about involved, but head over and look for Doodlebug's post. This place is a fantastic forum by the way, but if you're in the UK you should join UKV too. Most are in both I think.

EU live stream

 

[Vermonster13]

Stopping smoking has never been the true goal of any government since BT became their golden goose. None of them will ever admit this and thus here we are.

 

[zoiDman]

...

Perhaps now people can see how murderously corrupt and incompetent the EU is, and how easily it is manipulated by commercial interests; and how blatant their lies are when the most important effect the TPD will have is to protect cigarette sales.

Tobacco control measures haven't worked for years. Their latest policy will protect cigarette sales for the foreseeable future.

Have the Legal Avenues All been Exhausted?

Or is there a Hope that Something can be Reached thru a Court System?