Vaping "relatively harmless" says Royal Society of Physicians

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Robert Cromwell

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Ahh remember when the FDA was preventing the importation of cheaper Canadian Prescription drugs saying that offshore produced prescription drugs were not safe? Now most of our prescription meds are imported from offshore. And the ones that are made here are largely produced from offshore ingredients.

Remember the Heparin (sp?) incident that killed several?
 

bobwho77

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Cigarettes where costing me $60 a week. DIY is well under $1 a week, about $30 a year. That's what infuriates the anti crowd. I believe the direct economic benefits trump the health benefits. A low income family where the parents smoked as I did and switch to vaping as I did save $6,000 a year. The big loser is government. The big winners are the kids in that family. No tax supported government program could match the benefits. From now on I'm calling it the Federal Drug Administration. I bet South American drug cartels have nice offices too.

Even using commercial juice, and coils, I only spend about 20% of what it would cost me to smoke.
 

Robert Cromwell

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Even using commercial juice, and coils, I only spend about 20% of what it would cost me to smoke.
The price of cigs vary a lot in the USA. You can get them for $32/carton here in KY.
Once you figure in the cost of equipment and bought juice it is about a wash here. If you buy cheap juice.
 

Poeia

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I have a minor case of shinyitis (I have every color iStick30W, but have no interest in the expensive stuff) and I do not DYI. In the past 6.5 years I have spent an average of $3.53 a day on vaping.

The UK has punitive taxes on cigarettes. The most recent price per pack of 20 costs I could find is an average of £9.60 ($14) and it may go higher so the savings for a family with children would be very real.
 
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BuGlen

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This study by the RCP seems to be going viral and my news feed had dozens of articles from many different sources covering the report. Of course, the usual suspects had to inject the most recent BS about advertising and teens from the CDC, and the old standard "toxins" studies, but that's to be expected. There were more articles that kept to the facts of the study, than otherwise, which is an excellent trend.

Hopefully, the momentum will keep going on this for at least a few days and get the conversations flowing. For the first time in a long while, I'm cautiously optimistic, and hoping for the best.
 

rico942

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A low income family where the parents smoked as I did and switch to vaping as I did save $6,000 a year. The big loser is government. The big winners are the kids in that family.

Now THAT'S the basis for a legitimate "Save The Children" campaign ... :thumbs:
 

sofarsogood

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Now THAT'S the basis for a legitimate "Save The Children" campaign ... :thumbs:
I've posted the low income family reasoning hundreds of times on news stories for many months. I'm sure it's trickling up, or down, which ever way that works. I believe the reason smoking will be crushed by vaping is the cost advantage. In the poorest countries in the world with the cheapest quality cigarettes vaping is till far cheaper if you are frugal (my hobby is getting a great vape with little money so I can talk about that). This Royal College of Physicians story should be a block buster. They beat the US SG to the punch by 2 years back in the 60's. They can't be ignored.
 

Tufur

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FDA/drug cartel, no difference.. Here you go ... Former FDA Commissioner Charged in RICO Lawsuit
Sorry, but I do respect the FDA. All the heinous characters that were involved in the 2009 lawsuit to ban e-cigarettes are gone. The advisory committees have been somewhat balanced now. Zeller himself made a comment about the moralists he has to contend with in making functional regulations. I took that as a negitive response to the moralists as he singled them out.
 
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nicnik

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Sorry, but I do respect the FDA. All the heinous characters that were involved in the 2009 lawsuit to ban e-cigarettes are gone. The advisory committees have been somewhat balanced now. Zeller himself made a comment about the moralists he has to contend with in making functional regulations.
He has no good excuse for consuming moralist anti-THR arguments as part of seeking balance. The FDA has no power to regulate morality. They need to attend to their own morality and cut out the corruption.
 

Katya

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Sorry, but I do respect the FDA. All the heinous characters that were involved in the 2009 lawsuit to ban e-cigarettes are gone. The advisory committees have been somewhat balanced now. Zeller himself made a comment about the moralists he has to contend with in making functional regulations.

Which heinous characters are gone? Sorry, I'm not sure whom you're referring to.

Hamburg was bad, but Califf is not any better, perhaps worse. The deeming regs are prominently listed as #2 on his list of most urgent tasks (after opioids) that he wants to complete. He hates tobacco, nicotine and vaping. He believes that e-cigarettes were invented by the devious BT in order to corrupt the youth and to create a new generation of addicts (I'm paraphrasing from a private conversation with him).

Zeller just talks. But his every rational comment about nicotine is immediately followed by the "save the children" and "societal greater good" arguments, which completely negate his seemingly rational stance on nicotine. He also said in an interview which I watched myself that he "understands" that the "grandfather date is problematic," but the FDA is powerless and thus it can't be changed or revised--sorry. Zeller is a weasel of the worst kind. Because he can sound rational...
 

Kent C

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Zeller: (in the video)
"Parents should take no comfort that their kids are using an ecigarette rather than burning cigarette because of the presence of nicotine"

Zeller: (from earlier)
'People smoke for the nicotine but die from the tar

- cigarettes may harm brain development AND kill
- ecigarettes may harm brain development

If your daughters were going to do one or the other, which one would you feel more comfortable with, Mitch??

personas-einstein.jpg
 

YoursTruli

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Hello, Mr. Zeller, Dr. Califf, are you paying attention? :facepalm:

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/04/28/h...ting-smoking-royal-college-of-physicians.html

Some American response highlights:

“These guys, in my view, are going off a cliff,” said Stanton A. Glantz, a professor of medicine at the University of California who has been outspoken in his criticism of e-cigarettes. “They are taking England into a series of policies that five years from now they all will really regret. They are turning England into this giant experiment on behalf of the tobacco industry.”

“This is two countries taking pretty much diametrically opposed positions,” said Kenneth E. Warner, a professor of public health at the University of Michigan School of Public Health. “One is focused exclusively on the hypothetical risks, none of which have been established. The other is focusing on potential benefits.”
He added, “The British are saying, ‘Let’s see how we can help the main smokers today, who by the way are largely poor and less educated, and let’s not focus so much on kids, who may or may not be sickened by this 40 years down the line.’ ”

"A spokesman for the C.D.C. said the agency would not comment on any report other than its own. He reiterated the C.D.C. position on e-cigarettes: “There is currently no conclusive scientific evidence supporting the use of e-cigarettes as a safe and effective cessation tool at the population level. The science thus far indicates most e-cigarette users continue to smoke conventional cigarettes.”

"Professor Glantz cited his recent analysis as evidence that e-cigarettes in fact reduce the chances someone will quit smoking."

The report walks through a decade of science, listing studies that find in favor of e-cigarettes as well as studies that do not. It asserts that e-cigarettes are only 5 percent as harmful as traditional cigarettes, a conclusion that some American experts say has been lost in the United States in the rush to condemn e-cigarettes. It states bluntly that long-term effects of nicotine are likely to be minimal.
 

Lessifer

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"Professor Glantz cited his recent analysis as evidence that e-cigarettes in fact reduce the chances someone will quit smoking."
Let's just say, in some fantasy world just for the sake of argument, that Glantz's analysis was correct, and that the UK studies are also correct. Could the difference between cessation rates in the US and the UK possibly have anything to do with the TC/Media campaign against e-cigs in the US?
 
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