VG vs PG - what I have been finding and more

[fletchfx]

I started vaping Sept 1 of 2009 and totally gave up analogs on the same day and have not looked back since. From the get go, I did the newbie thing and just bought KR808D-1 carts from a supplier, vaped till they were empty and put on a new one. Then did the obvious thing that most people have probably done and bought a ton of vaping equipment to try out to figure out which I liked the best. So now I have a 510, Janty Stick, several KR models including USB pass through. A smoke51 kit which I gave to my dad and he loves, a smoking everywhere kit which saw the light of day once and just bought a Prodigy V2 which is on the way.

At the moment, my favorite is a Vapor King USB manual pass through tethered to an energizer rechargable USB lithium ion battery. Gives constant voltage, lasts for 2 days on 1 charge and produces major vapor, its almost like smoking.... But where did I go wrong???

After learning about refilling carts and buying high nic juice and cutting it to your liking, I set about to find my sweet spot and thought i did. Unfortunately in my area, finding PG is almost impossible, but VG is readily available so I have been cutting my juice with that and a little distilled water. Produces good vapor and a nice taste but this is where things went bad.

Over the past 3 months since I started using exclusively VG to cut my juice, I have noticed that I have been quite sluggish and tired all the time. Heart Burn is killing me, my joints ache (knees, elbows, hands and back). I did not equate this to vaping since I have been under a lot of stress lately to, but as that went away, the aches and pains and other ailments didn't.

A couple of days ago I thought long and hard about it and decided to try using PG instead of VG and in a short period of time, I am feeling much better. I am definitely more alert, aches a pains are at a minimum and heart burn is almost non existent. Now I have not heard of anyone else on these boards having an issue with VG, but is this possible? I know that many use VG as a replacement if they are allergic to PG.

Other things I have noticed. When using VG exclusively, the atomizers seem to burn up much quicker, I was getting maybe 1 or two days out of 1 cart before it started tasting burnt regardless of how often I filled it. I top off quite a bit to keep everything moist, but that does not seem to matter when it comes to VG. PG on the other hand seems to be going quite a bit further with less taste difference, I am currently at the end of day two with one cart and its still going strong. Now this may be because I am vaping 5v more than 3.7 with the normal batts, but it seems to me that PG is more resilient to burning than VG.

These are just the observations of 1 person and I do not have any real world tests to confirm anything, but it seems to me that PG is a better choice as long as you are not allergic. I just ordred some PG online and awaiting its arrival. I do find that adding just a tad of VG helps the taste, but for the most part, I am done with VG as a primary cutting agent.

Just wondering if anyone else has found similar results or had health issues with VG?

 

[jdw650]

I read in one of the post here that pg turns into lactic acid in the body which makes the muscles feel sore. I dont understand it though, because i use pg and havent had problems. i then started making my own juice. i used a 70/30 pg,vg mix. when i started vaping this i started getting the aching muscles. So im confused. is it the pg or the vg. Someone Fill us in.

 

[guiltyspark]

Interesting. I have some of those symptoms but I'm not sure what I'm vaping. I use Heaven Gifts no flav. juice. Anyone know what base HG uses?

 

[billo]

HG is almost certainly PG, but, you're right, they don't say.

If you E mail them you get a very fast response.

Incidentally, when I first started vaping, I tried PG and VG and couldn't see any major difference, or any noticeable difference to me at the time. Since then I've used PG since it's easier to get.

 

[googled]

The only problem I had with VG was it made me feel hungry all the time..well an empty feeling in my stomach, sort of related to the digestion problems you've experienced. The problems I had with PG were muscle pain but that was fixed by increasing fluid intake AND eating bananas - I eat one a day now and they've completely gone. I still use some VG to thicken and increase vapour in my own mixes but only around 10% of the total volume.

 

[skippy]

I can't vape VG . After a few hours my mouth and tongue feel like they are on fire and I get a very sore throat. A 70/30 PG/VG works great for me and no side effects at all. I had heard how good ECoPure was but not for me.

 

[doots]

I Have the same tiredness and cant use VG for that reason and also it causes too much phelmn. It isnt good for me. I went back to 100% PG and most of that went away.

 

[SevenDeadMonkies]

I smoke shisha and most of the brands I use contain VG. I have to watch how much shisha I smoke in a given session because it always makes me feel like a hot steaming pile of crap after smoking to much. This is why I tend to smoke shisha only when I have othere people to smoke it with. Limits how many pulls I take whith other ppl. Maybe it is the VG making me sick vapin PG efluid hasn't yet. Traditional pipe I am fine no vg though it does caontian PG keeps it moist.

 

[cruisedoc]

Funny, more folks have symptoms that clear up when they switch to VG. Of course, it's highly individual, and different people react to substances differently. The most common is a sore throat from PG, which generally clears with VG. Indeed, PG metabolizes into lactic acid, and muscle fatigue is hallmarked by the build up of lactic acid. VG is more natural and metabolizes as glucose. PG is more drying to the throat, and a known respiratory irritant. I often vape VG exclusively, but I agree, you do need to clean carts often. Then, even JC recommends only 6 refills before cleaning to keep a cartridge 'fresh', and they use mostly PG. I suppose everyone just needs to experiment and find what combination is best for them, but there is little doubt that most people who have difficulty have it with PG. Some manufac. are now advertising 'PF Free'. Dr. G.

 

[cruisedoc]

'PG Free', that is.

 

[fletchfx]

PG is hard to come by locally around here and I only had a little to experiment with, so I had to go back to VG until my PG internet order gets here (should be here tomorrow). Till then I went to a pharmacy and bought a bottle of Glycerin that has the USP markings on it (though my other VG I bought from the internet does as well, was just hoping that maybe its the brand). Sure enough, the muscle aches are slowly coming back so I am convinced its the VG.

Obviously everyone is different as mentioned earlier so I definitely agree with just experimenting until you find what works best for you. I definitely will be adding just a touch of VG to my mixes as it seems to make the vapor a little smoother but I think for me at least, its going to be PG as the major ingredient.

I was just curios if anyone else found similar results and by the looks of it, I guess I am not crazy but will find out once I get back on PG. Thanks for replying everyone.

 

[four2109]

I can't use VG. I wake up with a scummy coating in my mouth, sinuses, and throat.
Any pharmacy can order PG for you, they just don't keep it in stock. Just make sure you have it written down for them so they order the right thing. It comes in a pint bottle, I paid $11.00 at CVS, $18.00 at a local pharmacy. Both had to order it but I picked it up the next day.

 

[fletchfx]

I tried the pharmacy thing and I was told they can not order it to sell to the general public. They may be blowing smoke up my .... about it, but I was not going to argue with them. I saw someone had bought it at tractor supply for $20 in one of the other threads so I tried all of the local stores around here and they do not stock it and most gave me the deer in the headlights look
But all is good, I got my order today and am happily mixing and vaping PG. Got 2 16 ounce bottles for a little over $20 which should hold me for a good while

 

[guiltyspark]

I think it can be used to make crystal .... (and 1.7 trillion non-illegal things), that might have been the problem.

 

[robertpri]

Wow, I guess the PG/VG debate/comparison will go on forever, simply because it's really an individual thing. I have been vaping for PG 6 weeks, not a single analog, and nothing but problems. Dry mouth so bad I cannot sleep, wake up 2-3 times a night for water, gums hurt, heart racing, high BP, etc.

I cut with 50/50 pure 0 nic, 0 flavor VG and all the problems disappeared in two days, and it did not matter what nic MG: 6, 12, 18, 24, or 36. [I bought a lot of samplers]

Now I trying to get only VG--should be here in a few days.

 

[boochips]

I got mine here Propylene Glycol USP - Propylene Glycol - Bulk - Wholesale
and still have half left since last summer....

 

[fletchfx]

Thought I would wait a week or two to put out an update just to see how things are going. Most of the issues of pain in my joints have disappeared, back issues are pretty much gone though still wake up with back pain in the morning which is normal for me even before I started vaping. I am not as drowsy at night and have assumed my normal sleeping habits. The only thing I changed was not using VG exclusively. I am now cutting about 20% VG and the rest PG and things are going pretty well. I still like the taste of VG better but I can deal with the PG with a little mixed VG.

The other things I have noticed is that the carts don't seem to burn up as fast. I typically get two days out of a cart now where as a VG cart would get me about a day. I know there are people getting up to a month out of a cart, but I am fine with 1 every two days, even if its not burned after two days, I still change it out just for good measure. Just something about a fresh cart that makes vaping a joy to begin with.

I am just glad that I am able to keep vaping, I was worried I more resort back to analogs and I really did not want to do that

Vape on!!

 

[ejoker]

glad you got it sorted out, and thanks for the update!