As long as the product is legal, yes.
That's how it works in a free society.
Even if the product can kill you.
Just look at cigarettes.
Again vaping is basic primitive electronics. It doesn't take much effort to educate ones self.
Lots of us have.
When it comes to devices where does the true responsibility for safety rest
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As long as the product is legal, yes.
That's how it works in a free society.
Even if the product can kill you.
Just look at cigarettes.
Again vaping is basic primitive electronics. It doesn't take much effort to educate ones self.
Lots of us have.
zoiD, the OEM absolutely has responsibility but in the end isn't it the users responsibility to do the research to know if its not a safe device.
I'll use myself as the example. I consider myself to be fairly knowledgeable with regard to vaping. There are many here that know far more than I do and I often read their posts to continue to learn.
I use all different types of devices and recently picked up a Noisy Cricket. I did my research bought match sets of batteries and a RDA with the appropriate 510 connection. I even want so far as to break down the RDA, check the insulators and make sure everything was nice and tight.
Series batteries can create quite a bang and in stereo.
Built it with a .8, nothing fancy a 26ga coil and it vaped pretty nice but a little warm for my taste. I kept reading about hybrids and some of the recent problems. Every time I bought it to my face I thought what happens if the damn coil shorts, a grub screw loosens up or something isn’t as tight as it was when I built it.
I boxed it up and put it away.
I formed and opinion as I continued to do research that there is a higher risk with hybrids and I could get the vape I wanted from a regulated device. This is the first I’ve mentioned it on the site because I’m not saying it’s right for everyone, it’s just not right for me. I haven’t really been using my stingray or GG as much lately either.
The OEM can’t warn people about stupidity or tell you give that grub screw loosened while you were vaping. They suggest batteries but have to presume that just because they have put a 200W chip in a two cell 18650 device that the user is going to build and use the device appropriately.
If they build garbage with a little google foo you’ll know in seconds. They won’t last long if users are responsible and educate themselves to proper use.
I'll use myself as the example. I consider myself to be fairly knowledgeable with regard to vaping. There are many here that know far more than I do and I often read their posts to continue to learn.
I use all different types of devices and recently picked up a Noisy Cricket. I did my research bought match sets of batteries and a RDA with the appropriate 510 connection. I even want so far as to break down the RDA, check the insulators and make sure everything was nice and tight.
Series batteries can create quite a bang and in stereo.
Built it with a .8, nothing fancy a 26ga coil and it vaped pretty nice but a little warm for my taste. I kept reading about hybrids and some of the recent problems. Every time I bought it to my face I thought what happens if the damn coil shorts, a grub screw loosens up or something isn’t as tight as it was when I built it.
I boxed it up and put it away.
I formed and opinion as I continued to do research that there is a higher risk with hybrids and I could get the vape I wanted from a regulated device. This is the first I’ve mentioned it on the site because I’m not saying it’s right for everyone, it’s just not right for me. I haven’t really been using my stingray or GG as much lately either.
The OEM can’t warn people about stupidity or tell you give that grub screw loosened while you were vaping. They suggest batteries but have to presume that just because they have put a 200W chip in a two cell 18650 device that the user is going to build and use the device appropriately.
If they build garbage with a little google foo you’ll know in seconds. They won’t last long if users are responsible and educate themselves to proper use.
I'm just Not Sure I can place the Ultimate Responsibility on the End User for All Aspects of a product's Design/Use. Just like I couldn't put it Ultimately on the OEM.
I see this More as Shared Responsibility.
If I make a tank that works incredibly well with replaceable coil type A, but coil type B makes it go boom, and I put warnings on the site, box, even on the side of the tank that says only for use with coil type A, and then someone uses my tank with coil type B, is that my fault?
Nope you are not responsible.
English is so funny!
You did the responsible thing by giving the user fair warning.
funny how the word responsible can mean one thing in one sentence but the opposite in another!
Why would it be your Fault?
Didn't you Act in a Reasonable and in a Responsible manor by altering the Consumer to Only Use Coil A?
It would have been Irresponsible if you had just put "For Advanced Users".
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I agree with your post.
However, here's some Knowledge:
The noisy cricket isn't a hybrid.
It's a direct-to-battery mod or "hybrid look" mod.
Hybrids don't have 510 threads. They have dedicated atomizers.
There aren't any problems with hybrids. The issues some people have had with direct-to- battery mods are impossible on a hybrid.
Yes, I did, and that is what I have seen from all of the ORIGINAL manufacturers of devices that people find problematic. They include a warning that you must only use atomizers with adequately protruding center pins.
Now, a b&m reseller may not include this information. Or if you buy a clone from ft, it probably won't come with any information. Is the manufacturer responsible in either of those cases?
the manufacturer has an obligation to provide a device that is safe when used as directed.designing a device for maximum capacity from a fresh new battery would render the device unsafe as the battery ages and this would be part of normal use so the manufacturer would be responsible for selling an unsafe device. my automatic battery charger measures the voltage and internal resistance of the battery and then sets charge current based on these measurements which corrects for increase in internal resistance as the battery ages. some of these mods push batteries to their maximum pulse output but do they monitor battery temperature or test internal resistance before setting maximum power level?even if they are safe with a new battery are they safe with that same battery after a month or two of operation?do they warn consumers about these problems and advise them to test batteries with the appropriate equipment on a regular basis to insure that the battery is still safe in their mod? a lawyer could have a field day with one of those 90 watt single cells mods if anyone got hurt by them.
Ninja agreed, devices like the Valkyrie by Vicious Ant are true hybrids. I am using the terminology that I see referenced every day to describe the Cricket. Very rarely do you ever see it referred to as a direct to battery device. But that's a whole different conversation
If the OEM provided these warnings, then the Responsibility shifts to the User using the Mod in the way described by the OEM.
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On the Flipside. Why would a B&M or Cloner not bare some Responsibility if they did Not Adequately provide information as to how to Safely use a Product they Sold/Produced if there was a Problem.
How hard is it include that information you said the ORIGINAL Manufacture provided?
Adults accept responsibility for their actions, even the bad decisions they make. They don't look for other to blame for their mistakes, just to place liability. Like blaming Mcdonalds for their bad diets.
Here's a standard disclaimer on a mechanical mod. Most sites and stores have basically the same disclaimer or something close to it.
From vape royalty-HCigar 4nine clone:
HCigar 4Nine Mod Brass
"The HCigar 4nine clone features a direct battery connection and is strictly for advanced vapers only. Use at your own risk!"
"We will not be held liable for any injury incurred from improper use of this advanced user device."
How much more do they need to warn someone?
After that warning it's 100% on the user.
Once again. I fail to see how saying something is for "Advanced Users Only" makes this Mod any Safer in the hands of an Uneducated User. Or will release the Seller/Manufacture from any Liability when it Blows Up in someone's Truck.
The mod isn't the problem.
The user is.
Ahh I thought so.
You are confusing responsibility with "legal liability".
Totally different, though my stance is roughly the same, however legally, the liability can stop with something as simple as "sold as is, use at your own risk".
The thing is, you have to be responsible for your own safety.
If not you will eventually get hurt.
You may not be able to sue afterwards so worrying about who's liable would be moot.
It better to be use common sense and safe than to count on a lawyer.
I have no idea why they would not include the proper information. I'm not even positive that they don't. I do know that just because a warning exists, does not mean the user will read and adhere to it.
If the industry moves forward, I do expect more detailed user warnings and instruction manuals in the future. It only makes sense, for liability issues.
Unless of course someone uses all of this as justification for banning mods with replaceable batteries and/or interchangeable atomizers.
Then we'll be back to the days of home built mods, and things will be even less safe.
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