Goodnews, there are a lot of newbies here lately. I also have the feeling the average age round here is going down. That can make a big difference too.
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Eh... vaping's getting quite popular. Not sure if you've heard?
The more popular something is the more noise generated about it and parallel to that, the less intelligent the average user gets. This isn't just ecigs, it's everything. Early adopters are more likely to be curious nerds who want to know everything.
Not sure what your point on clones was about, it was pulled out of nowhere apropos of nothing. That's Chinese commerce in action. Not too hard to analyse.
Dark sweet juices on the typically thin wire inside a prebuilt clearo head is going to gunk. Not sure how that's Big tobacco's fault?
The more popular something is the more noise generated about it and parallel to that, the less intelligent the average user gets. This isn't just ecigs, it's everything. Early adopters are more likely to be curious nerds who want to know everything.
Not sure what your point on clones was about, it was pulled out of nowhere apropos of nothing. That's Chinese commerce in action. Not too hard to analyse.
Dark sweet juices on the typically thin wire inside a prebuilt clearo head is going to gunk. Not sure how that's Big tobacco's fault?
My guess is vaping is growing so fast, manufacturers can't keep up, so rather than Kanger relying on 1 or 2 facilities, they may be outsourcing to others, who produce less than ideal coils/heads. I only buy Kanger coils from 1 trusted source who buys direct from Kanger. Wouldn't trust many others.
They are significantly more fiddly than my Triton clearos, but once mastered produce a rich, flavorful vape. I can get 8 tankfuls out of a Triton head, whereas I gat 4 tankfuls out of a Kanger head.
The Tritons cost twice as much, however, but require pretty much no work to get a great vape.
In the end, however, I think most of the issues are user error. I know they were for me.
Someone from Conspiracy Theorists International will be contacting you soon. A new file will be opened and an investigation begun. Can't trust BT any further than you can throw em. Sneaky basterds, I bet you're right!
could it be that it is no more than the sugary residue that has clung and fried to wick/coil
possibly due to cheap juice / ingredients...
my experience seems the cheap stuff burns away quicker and possibly fouls my coils more,
while some juices just seem to last far longer...
Vape≈ like your hiding from Conspiracy Theorists International
i love that
possibly due to cheap juice / ingredients...
my experience seems the cheap stuff burns away quicker and possibly fouls my coils more,
while some juices just seem to last far longer...
Vape≈ like your hiding from Conspiracy Theorists International
i love that
i have a seinfeld episode idea, two in fact.
Kramer: this pretzel juice is making me schmootsy
Jerry (in a cutesy voice): you're schmootsy
Jerry's GF (in a cutesy voice): no, you're schmootsy
Jerry (in a cutesy voice): no, you're schmootsy
Jerry's GF (in a cutesy voice): no, you're schmootsy
Jerry (in a cutesy voice): no, you're schmootsy
Jerry's GF (in a cutesy voice): no, you're schmootsy
Jerry (in a cutesy voice): no, you're schmootsy
Jerry's GF (in a cutesy voice): no, you're schmootsy
Jerry (in a cutesy voice): no, you're schmootsy
Jerry's GF (in a cutesy voice): no, you're schmootsy
Jerry (in a cutesy voice): no, you're schmootsy
Jerry's GF (in a cutesy voice): no, you're schmootsy
Jerry (in a cutesy voice): no, you're schmootsy
Jerry's GF (in a cutesy voice): no, you're schmootsy
Kramer: this pretzel juice is making me schmootsy
Jerry (in a cutesy voice): you're schmootsy
Jerry's GF (in a cutesy voice): no, you're schmootsy
Jerry (in a cutesy voice): no, you're schmootsy
Jerry's GF (in a cutesy voice): no, you're schmootsy
Jerry (in a cutesy voice): no, you're schmootsy
Jerry's GF (in a cutesy voice): no, you're schmootsy
Jerry (in a cutesy voice): no, you're schmootsy
Jerry's GF (in a cutesy voice): no, you're schmootsy
Jerry (in a cutesy voice): no, you're schmootsy
Jerry's GF (in a cutesy voice): no, you're schmootsy
Jerry (in a cutesy voice): no, you're schmootsy
Jerry's GF (in a cutesy voice): no, you're schmootsy
Jerry (in a cutesy voice): no, you're schmootsy
Jerry's GF (in a cutesy voice): no, you're schmootsy
WOW@
Hey Steve nice seeing you in here again. I agree with you on the head quality. The last three or four Kanger tanks I've gotten are producing scorched flavor with factory coils before I was done with the first tank. I'm seldom over about 3.9V normally. Even on the mech's I Kick. So I suspect the quality of the silica being used has gone down. Plausible, at least, if not likely. But honestly after almost a hundred rebuilds, seeing the degradation and scorching so quickly in this material, I'm starting to get scared it-less of silica. Both from the contaminant perspective (oxidation, combustion) and particulates in the form of fiber. Not saying such would be severely detrimental but irritating and frustrating of our enjoyment certainly. I'll leave it to others to fill in the explanation on silica sedimentation in tanks. I've seen enough of such degradation in my heads.
I've really been kinda diggin' Nextel XC-132 as I've mentioned elsewhere. Cotton hands down but it takes diligence to maintain the flavor. I've got sensitive taste buds so for cotton it's an every day wick swap for me on each device. And I love 'em! But it's dedication for those babies. I don't get the performance you do. I'm seen two fills before discoloration begins usually as I'm using very dense dark juices like Johnson Tenn. and Boba's. So I'm not expecting miracles. [I'll have to look at the Triton.] But the Nextel's holding up really nice with much less singing or soiling vs. Ekowool and by far an improvement over silica. Eko much less so but still a good top-wick (@1.5mm for 1/16' coil's generally and cheaper). I'd encourage newb's to try it. XC-132 is about 2mm in cross-section and delicate but straightforward to insert into a 1/16" tight coil. It's even a smoother install in a micro coil as the closed space helps the wick insertion progress with rotation. Newb's should definitely try winding on a guide like a screwdriver bit of this diameter (1/16", 1.58mm) and try both Nextel and Eko. They can step up a notch to 1.75mm if it makes it easier to thread the wick. Without torching they will see little if any splaying of the wick which was my interminable frustration when I first started. They will definitely see the difference in both taste and performance.
My
.Take care and good luck all!
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This is just pure speculation on my part, but I think there are some thermodynamic issues with cheap coils that cause them to overheat and burn liquid rather than vaporize it.
The resistance of the load combined with the voltage delivered by the battery determines the power output of the circuit. We already knew that.
The amount of heat energy that's produced is governed by the size, shape and placement of the heating element. Also at play is the type of alloy used to make the coil. If there's not enough coil wire in the wicking area, the heated portion could get too hot instead of just right. Alternatively, if there's too much wire in the area, the heated portion is too cool instead of just right.
The more cheap clearos with cheap coils proliferate, the more we're going to see these thermodynamic issues with performance.
Again, just my speculation.
The resistance of the load combined with the voltage delivered by the battery determines the power output of the circuit. We already knew that.
The amount of heat energy that's produced is governed by the size, shape and placement of the heating element. Also at play is the type of alloy used to make the coil. If there's not enough coil wire in the wicking area, the heated portion could get too hot instead of just right. Alternatively, if there's too much wire in the area, the heated portion is too cool instead of just right.
The more cheap clearos with cheap coils proliferate, the more we're going to see these thermodynamic issues with performance.
Again, just my speculation.
i use kangers, and rebuild my own coils , both micro and spring style.
but i also make my own juice with 100% vg and thinning out my juice with distilled water and using only non oil based water soluble concentrates as flavors i am able to use a single coil up to about a week b4 i have thats "schmootsy" crap on my actual coil and wick or even my flavor wick i use on top of the coil...
in my experience i find making my own juice in this manner is what is key to not getting my coil all 'schmootsy
but i also make my own juice with 100% vg and thinning out my juice with distilled water and using only non oil based water soluble concentrates as flavors i am able to use a single coil up to about a week b4 i have thats "schmootsy" crap on my actual coil and wick or even my flavor wick i use on top of the coil...
in my experience i find making my own juice in this manner is what is key to not getting my coil all 'schmootsy
Gentlemen, I think you're both on to something in your deductions and your inclinations. And no, I think it's pretty good observation. I'm with you Thamyris. I use pure VG but thin for both performance and endurance with very dense juices, using distilled water and PG alone or in combination. It's had a dramatic impact. And yes I can get out to several weeks with Bobas in a PT. I just can't hit this tanks as hard as I do when I chain continuously. I don't think the physics exist for that. IBCR, I agree. I think there's a definite "sweet-spot" for every device and particularly every coil/cup design. There is no universal. I've zeroed in on it for the 3TS and enjoy days of consistent use, no discoloration and great vapor until the coil/wick dramatically reaches it's apparent max load threshold (clog, singe) and vaporization collapses and falls off. So it's there, and I'm closing in for the Protank's. In neither case is it the factory spec which necessarily a compromise for the various tank platforms and certainly considering ease/cost of production. Lately it's been dismal. But I believe a lot has to do with the wicking media quality declining most of all. And If people are going to insist on using silica they should obtain the highest thermal quality from a reliable source. Smart, and healthy, move.
Thanks for your remarks and observations. Words to the wise. Thanks.
Good luck!
I was batting my head against the wall too despite a bit more than average understanding of the science. Then it dawned on me one day It's the wick, stupid. Because I was I was ignoring the science and clear observation. Why they're foisting silica on us, heaven knows. Time to find alternatives pronto, and move on.
It's cheap. It doesn't burn. It's relatively easy to work with. It's long lasting.
For those benefits, we trade off the superior wicking capabilities of natural fibers like cotton, hemp, etc. Those materials are more expensive, burn easily, take some practice to work with and don't have as long of a useful life. But once those materials are mastered, their performance is significantly higher than silica wick.
It's "cheap" for them, a
for us. But seriously have you really considered the "long lasting", "doesn't burn" and "easy to work with" part? What parts of those was I totally blind to these part four months. That's what I'm reporting...THAT SILICA IS NOT. You must be giving us the rhetorical stock answer. Kidding right, IBCR? And wicking with silica is like square box round hole games compared to Eko and Nextel in a coil.
I was in denial. As you said, silica, it's cheap. I almost wen't back to smoking before I realized how ludicrous trying to coil silica is. If ever a product had a better "built in" deterrent to success and adoption that I've ever seen it's mass produced PV's and silica. But I will grant you that it's an awesome consumable for resale. That it is.
But sooner or later somebody's gonna ask What are all those fish spines in my soup?
I'd rather it be us, than you know who.
But that's just me talkin'.
Soo those that haven't given up on rebuilding and relented to producers giving us what they want, an old paradigm we've been long made accustomed to, really take a look at the product and you'll see why you're experiencing the flavor issues. Then help yourself and all of us seek out healthy effective alternatives. If the producers are satisfied with what they're giving us, who else will?
Good luck!
I don't mess with silica wicks much- last thing I want is to over-wash or over-use them and have them break down in my juice. A quick wash and air dry and I use once more until the flavor and vapor begin to be less than ideal- usually a tank refill or two, then off to the trash they go.
Ditto that. But noticed I can't seem to do that lately! So it's rebuild bin for the installed and add-on pair.
It occured to me as I posted that perhaps some additive may be in play in the silica. Not suggesting a malignant purpose or anything. Maybe constructive in intent. Maybe it's me, and I need to let the current grades of silica wick more as I'm tasting too much wire. Which suggests a declining quality. And glue is no longer an issue. But I've never had to consider washing Kanger heads until recently. A number I've used, and I do for comparison, have tasted awful out of a sealed box. Never ran into that before. Worrysome and disappointing as that had been one of the finest parts to buying a Kanger product. That you could albeit a little foolishly pull the tank out of the box and vape it.
Not anymore. Not I.
Good luck.
There's always the possibility Kanger has altered the composition in order to get people frustrated with the current heads to 'upgrade' to the ProTank 3 which has heads that aren't interchangeable with current Kanger heads...
I'm thinkin' you may be right! Heading down the wrong direction, fer sure. The PT is phenomenal in a lot of ways. The design is outstanding and conceptually genius. The draw is certainly closer to the natural draw of a cigarette. But where were the throngs of people clamoring for that? <shrug> Current factory coils get HOT with the restricted chimney and it significantly affects flavor. The interrim "no glue" version was better. Perhaps a factor of the change of the sloped head vestibule as well as the chimney. But I can feel [in warmth] the additional strain on PV batt's. I seldom see that. Not a good sign for users.
I would hope that someone is listening and would re-open the air chambers. Not sacrifice performance for draw.
[Of course you realize limiting draw restrains flooding.]
More natural, smoother, cooler draw. PT 2's the ticket.
But I can't chain on the new heads/design. At least that's what I'm observing so far with the 2 PT2's I have from different sources. And that was/is my primary purpose for the PT. I use a pair of matched VW Sigelei's, keep them full, precisely for that inclination and break from rotation. Such as now when I'm writing. And the new PT's don't seem to be able to stand up to that. So I'm disappointed.
But certainly they must realize such things. And, of course, they want to make money. Eventually they will give the consumer...what they wish to buy (if not what actually works).
I'll have to look at the ver3 and the Triton as well, mentioned to me elsewhere. I need an all day vehicle and I've had to expedite my roll out of RDA's to compensate.
Good luck!
Just for the record, I didn't truly mean that Big Tobacco has infiltrated, it was just some humor.
But I do have to give light to the other theories on this thread. It seems as though someone is actually describing my experience to a tee - burnt heads right out of the box - and when it comes down to it, the one area that would be above my head is simply being able to look at a coil, just from a glance, and being able to tell if the coil is wrapped perfectly, or if it has any bad spots, or whatnot.
I always check my pre-made coil and make sure that it is wound evenly and not cramped together, and I do have to say most brands are pretty good about that factor. But what makes them burn up is anyone's guess. I've had maybe an hour's performance out of juices that are about as thin as water, but give it any sort of texture to the juice at all, any slight thickness, and you're out.
And with rebuilding, if I could get a robot to analyze my thoughts and rebuild a coil based on the technical knowledge I have lodged up on some of the aspects of the subject, I'd be churning out wicks all day - I'm very interested in things that simply wick better. But the sad truth is that I have a nervous fidget that, when I concentrate, makes me drop things and sling things everywhere. I'm sort of out of luck on the rebuilding part untill a vendor may want to step in and build at least one coil for whoever may want to come in and try the difference out, and then try a hand at selling them.
Overall though, ease of vaping is just one thing I hope to conquer, my penchant for going out and finding a brand of cigarettes I enjoy is just too great, and here's to hoping that the iClear 30 and like devices work out better.
What's oddest though, is, wether it works for you or not, I dare anyone to go into a local vendor and say that your Protank burns up too quickly. You'll practically get a cursing from whoever works there, and the quote "We've never once had that problem ever, not ever, nope not once, I've never heard that." will come up. The universal employee behavior concerning the Protank is a bit strange.
*I have to stick up for the newbies on this one too:
The truth is that every pre-built device is designed to run and gun, at least by the (not actually very well explained) manufacturer's intentions. There's no reason anyone should have to pull out the faithful ohm checker, voltage checker, calculator, the weight scale to check the density of the juice compared to pure PG, and all that, just for a disposable or semi-disposable model. Noobs aren't going to do that and I'm certainly not going to do that when there's a BP up the road calling my name.
A casual customer walks into a shop, buys a CE4, and if they like a juice, they buy a juice. Who knows what they experience when they get home, but with retracing my steps in the vaping world and actually trying some of these products again, it's been insanity. I just don't see how juices from Halo and the like can give results like these. It's just baffling!
But I do have to give light to the other theories on this thread. It seems as though someone is actually describing my experience to a tee - burnt heads right out of the box - and when it comes down to it, the one area that would be above my head is simply being able to look at a coil, just from a glance, and being able to tell if the coil is wrapped perfectly, or if it has any bad spots, or whatnot.
I always check my pre-made coil and make sure that it is wound evenly and not cramped together, and I do have to say most brands are pretty good about that factor. But what makes them burn up is anyone's guess. I've had maybe an hour's performance out of juices that are about as thin as water, but give it any sort of texture to the juice at all, any slight thickness, and you're out.
And with rebuilding, if I could get a robot to analyze my thoughts and rebuild a coil based on the technical knowledge I have lodged up on some of the aspects of the subject, I'd be churning out wicks all day - I'm very interested in things that simply wick better. But the sad truth is that I have a nervous fidget that, when I concentrate, makes me drop things and sling things everywhere. I'm sort of out of luck on the rebuilding part untill a vendor may want to step in and build at least one coil for whoever may want to come in and try the difference out, and then try a hand at selling them.
Overall though, ease of vaping is just one thing I hope to conquer, my penchant for going out and finding a brand of cigarettes I enjoy is just too great, and here's to hoping that the iClear 30 and like devices work out better.
What's oddest though, is, wether it works for you or not, I dare anyone to go into a local vendor and say that your Protank burns up too quickly. You'll practically get a cursing from whoever works there, and the quote "We've never once had that problem ever, not ever, nope not once, I've never heard that." will come up. The universal employee behavior concerning the Protank is a bit strange.
*I have to stick up for the newbies on this one too:
The truth is that every pre-built device is designed to run and gun, at least by the (not actually very well explained) manufacturer's intentions. There's no reason anyone should have to pull out the faithful ohm checker, voltage checker, calculator, the weight scale to check the density of the juice compared to pure PG, and all that, just for a disposable or semi-disposable model. Noobs aren't going to do that and I'm certainly not going to do that when there's a BP up the road calling my name.
A casual customer walks into a shop, buys a CE4, and if they like a juice, they buy a juice. Who knows what they experience when they get home, but with retracing my steps in the vaping world and actually trying some of these products again, it's been insanity. I just don't see how juices from Halo and the like can give results like these. It's just baffling!
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Your wicks look charred because they are trying to kill themselves. They can't get away from you.
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