ACSH Invited to White House to Advise on Tobacco Harm Reduction

[NoFumus]

ACSH Invited to White House to Advise on Tobacco Harm Reduction - American Council on Science and Health

"The regulatory assessment on small businesses, and the cost-benefit analysis, are separate issues that OMB is considering. We instead care about keeping a harm reduction and smoking cessation tool available to smokers who want to quit. So our specific recommendation was that the “substantial equivalence” date — the date at which products could be allowed to continue to exist without going through new regulatory review — be changed from early 2007 to the date that OIRA puts its stamp on the new regulations.

 

[zoiDman]

Thank you for Posting this NoFumes.

 

[bobwho77]

Sound, sensible advice. Let's hope that they listen.
R&D would slow WAY down, but at least we wouldn't have to go BACKWARD

 

[EBates]

The whole 'Deeming' (READ PROHIBITION) has nothing to do with health or safety! This is another MONEY GRAB under the guise of a health and safety issue. The FDA plans to gift the e-cig to BT and BP nothing more or less. So the date 'deeming' occurs is a moot point. It's Gonna Happen!

 

[DrMA]

The whole 'Deeming' (READ PROHIBITION) has nothing to do with health or safety! This is another MONEY GRAB under the guise of a health and safety issue. The FDA plans to gift the e-cig to BT and BP nothing more or less. So the date 'deeming' occurs is a moot point. It's Gonna Happen!

I agree. Moving the grandfather date is largely a symbolic gesture. Even if it happens, FDA would still ban flavors and States would jump on the opportunity to tax the newly deemed "tobacco products" out of existence. And then, of course, there's this

 

[Mossy]

And then, of course, there's this

Oh dear....................what a mushroom.....................kept in the dark and fed on BS

 

[sofarsogood]

In the news today we hear Pfizer merged with another drug company so they could move the headquarters to Ireland for lower corporate taxes. This is reported so we can all be full of righteous indignation at the tax cheats, right? Well, I think vapers are viewed as tax cheats and treated disrespectfully for that reason.

We don't deserve much respect anyway because we are incurable drug addicts who should pay and pay and pay some more to atone for our sins. When we find a cure, a really good one, instead of rejoicing, our fellow non smoking humans view us as cheaters, cheating them out of our money.

In the past week I've started buying things (for vaping) I don't need. I guess it's called hoarding or stockpiling. It actually will cost very little but I hate doing it. I hate what it demonstrates about how I feel about "my" government. I was a philosopy major in college. Ethics was my favorite part of that. But the life lesson is, if you stand for anything, it just makes you the chump.

 

[DC2]

But the life lesson is, if you stand for anything, it just makes you the chump.

I decided a long time ago to be a chump, and let God take care of the rest.
It's worked very well for me, but maybe I'm just lucky.

 

[sofarsogood]

I decided a long time ago to be a chump, and let God take care of the rest.
It's worked very well for me, but maybe I'm just lucky.

I'm compulsive. The moral high ground is irresistablee. Evil is a club. It wants you to join, be a player. It gets very cross when you won't.

 

[Kent C]

In the news today we hear Pfizer merged with another drug company so they could move the headquarters to Ireland for lower corporate taxes. This is reported so we can all be full of righteous indignation at the tax cheats, right?

More and more are moving out and should. atlas shrugging

When all the 1%ers leave, then from whom will they demand all the free stuff?

Whatever your answer... what if they leave too?

 

[BrotherBob]

The koch Brothers and the pfizers of the world want us to be discouraged. That's their plan. They can't win without us giving up. There are more of us with the power of the vote than them. We just have to persistent and continue the fight.
We have to hang in there and chip away. WE WILL WIN.

 

[Kent C]

The koch Brothers and the pfizers of the world want us to be discouraged.

Actually they just want to escape confiscatory taxation. They don't care whether your discouraged or not. Why would they? The only reason you pose it in that form is to 'rally the troops'. Like we need more cheerleaders around here.

And besides - the Koch Brothers supported some politicians and foundations (Cato, Reason, AEI, CEI) that are pro-ecigs. Why not look into it yourself rather than pick out of context items from Media Matters?

 

[zoiDman]

In the news today we hear Pfizer merged with another drug company so they could move the headquarters to Ireland for lower corporate taxes. This is reported so we can all be full of righteous indignation at the tax cheats, right? Well, I think vapers are viewed as tax cheats and treated disrespectfully for that reason.

...

Why would people view Pfizer as Tax Cheaters? Did they Violate any Laws? My theory is if Our Government didn't want people like Pfizer doing something like this, that they would Change Corporate Tax Laws so it Wasn't Advantageous for them to do so.

When I file my Individual Return, I look for Every Possible Way (Legally) to Not Pay One Dollar more than I have to either the State or the Fed. Does that make me a Tax Cheat?

Same with Vapers. Why would anyone View a Vaper as a Tax Cheater?

They told me for Years that I should Quit Smoking. Ran Ads on TV. Put Billboards up about Quitting. Every Health Care Individual I know told me to Quit. So Guess what?

I Did.

Isn't that what Everyone Told/Wanted me to do? How does that make me a Tax Cheat?

Viewing Vapers as Tax Cheats is like saying someone who Doesn't Drink is a Tax Cheat because they Don't Pay the Tax on a Bottle of Booze.

ETA: Not Mad at you sofasogood. Just those who hold these Distorted Views as to what a Tax Cheater is.

 

[Kent C]

Viewing Vapers as Tax Cheats is like saying someone who Doesn't Drink is a Tax Cheat because they Don't Pay the Tax on a Bottle of Booze.

sofarsogood of course said: "This is reported so we can all be full of righteous indignation at the tax cheats, right?" So the beef is with those reporting it in that manner, or those who actually think that way. So in that context, fully agree with your post. It's why Boeing moved from Seattle to Chicago. And as of September was considering moving out of the U.S.

 

[zoiDman]

sofarsogood of course said: "This is reported so we can all be full of righteous indignation at the tax cheats, right?" So the beef is with those reporting it in that manner, or those who actually think that way. So in that context, fully agree with your post. It's why Boeing moved from Seattle to Chicago. And as of September was considering moving out of the U.S.

I'm not Bent at sofarsogood.

I'm Bent at those who would consider Pfizer a Tax Cheat.

And my Rage is against those who would Consider a Vaper a Tax Cheater.

 

[sofarsogood]

How does that make me a Tax Cheat?

The tobacco control people and their employers know more about our smoking than we do. Very few people stop smoking permanently. It's easy money and reliable. Mass numbers of people quitting successfully was considered impossible and unthinkable and now it's happening. $100 billion is a lot of money, even in the good old US of A. When you are engaging someone in the realm of ideas and beliefs and perceptions a lot of the time you learn more from the omissions than the admissions, especially when you are dealing with someone who is dishonest. The politics of vaping are so dishonest it makes me dizzy. I debated Islamists after 911. What they never said was much more informative than their practiced propaganda, which got tiresome after a while. The anti vaping crowd is the same. Their rhetoric is boring and unimaginative because the only reason they speak out is to distract attention from what their issues might actually be. The truth of the anti crowd is in what they never say, in what they never acknowledge.

 

[Kent C]

I'm not Bent at sofarsogood.

I'm Bent at those who would consider Pfizer a Tax Cheat.

And my Rage is against those who would Consider a Vaper a Tax Cheater.

Got it. Figured so, just clarifying....

 

[Kent C]

They told me for Years that I should Quit Smoking. Ran Ads on TV. Put Billboards up about Quitting. Every Health Care Individual I know told me to Quit. So Guess what?

I Did.

Isn't that what Everyone Told/Wanted me to do? How does that make me a Tax Cheat?

This makes so much sense! We did what you wanted, now THIS!??

 

[zoiDman]

The tobacco control people and their employers know more about our smoking than we do. Very few people stop smoking permanently. It's easy money and reliable. Mass numbers of people quitting successfully was considered impossible and unthinkable and now it's happening. $100 billion is a lot of money, even in the good old US of A. When you are engaging someone in the realm of ideas and beliefs and perceptions a lot of the time you learn more from the omissions than the admissions, especially when you are dealing with someone who is dishonest. The politics of vaping are so dishonest it makes me dizzy. I debated Islamists after 911. What they never said was much more informative than their practiced propaganda, which got tiresome after a while. The anti vaping crowd is the same. Their rhetoric is boring and unimaginative because the only reason they speak out is to distract attention from what their issues might actually be. The truth of the anti crowd is in what they never say, in what they never acknowledge.

I don't know who these Tobacco Control People are. Or what Power they have to Leverage Policy on the State or Federal Level.

But the People I talked with have been Very Matter-of-Fact about things when the Issue of Lost Tax Revenues have come up. And to a Man/Woman they have said about the Same Thing.

And that is they will just Tax e-Liquids that contain Nicotine to make up for Any Combustible Tobacco Tax Shortfall.

Sure, some have used e-Cigarettes as their Grandstand to Play the "Save them from Themselves" Card. But Most Really Don't care if you Smoke or Vape, as long as the Books Balance tax-wise.

 

[Kent C]

And that is they will just Tax e-Liquids that contain Nicotine to make up for Any Combustible Tobacco Tax Shortfall.

What Ohio attempted in February:

Current: 15mL = $10 + $0.73 sales tax = $10.73 total
New: 15 mL = $10 + $16.88 cigarette tax = $26.88 + $1.95 sales tax = $28.83 total

Or a 269% increase in cost.

Plus a $1000 licensing fee for all vendors.