the health department, fire marshals,building inspectors,
tax assessors,OSHA,etc.. .
if you operate a business there is no end to whom is allowed
to inspect your premises. of course it vary's from locality to
locality.
mike
FDA "Smokers" support Nanny-State when it comes to e-cigs..?
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the health department, fire marshals,building inspectors,
tax assessors,OSHA,etc.. .
if you operate a business there is no end to whom is allowed
to inspect your premises. of course it vary's from locality to
locality.
mike
Seriously, there are forces at work throughout the country trying to change this.
The movement grows larger each and every day, and that movement has nothing to do with vaping.
I realize that you are leaving this country as soon as you can.
But those of us who will remain behind don't wish to be discouraged by you in each and every thread.
I have never heard of B&Ms who make e-liquid who have a department of health certificate, or large manufacturers who have been inspected by a federal agency. Can you post examples of this?
You live in California and don't see what has happened?; a state which re-elected Gov. Jerry Brown...
I am a realist...
My only question to you is why do you spend so much time and effort trying to discourage people?
People should make up their own minds. Given the amount of PMs I have received, I'm not alone in my thinking; most are just scared to post and be belittled and called ANTZ by the extremists... The extremists are the ones turning vapers against vapers and scaring off the population at large...
I would agree with you that actually calling people on this forum ANTZ is counter-productive.
I know I have never once done so, and don't plan to in the future.
But you did not answer my question...
Or at least you didn't answer the question as I intended it to be asked...
Why do you constantly discourage people from tying to do something about the position we find ourselves in?
Maybe I'm just not understanding what your previous reply has to do with my question.
Because it seems to me that your "thinking" is that we should all just sit back and take what they give us.
I've never discouraged anyone. I have said writing letters is pointless, if their view is that money is what drives legislation. Letters don't trump money... I do think the country is lost beyond recovery, but as I have stated many times, we never lived through nazi or communist rule, so don't appreciate freedom...
Gents may I remind you that the argument is on whether non-vaping smokers as a category should have any privilege in deciding how to label e-liquid.
The only thing that can trump money is popular opinion.
And popular opinion can be changed.
Given the survey on the first page, you aren't doing a very good job- even at getting vapers on your side...
But see, that's almost like calling someone an ANTZ since that is what ANTZ are hoping for. And I might add, just as optimism isn't utopian, pessimism isn't realism - it's just pessimism
Change doesn't happen overnight.
And it doesn't happen at all if no one tries.
I would have to say that if your posts are intended to speak for those who do not dare...
Then I can respect that immensely.
And would therefore like to ask...
What opinions would you say define the "extremists" in the view of those who are keeping quiet?
I'm thinking it's libertarian opinions.
Or maybe anti-liberal opinions.
But maybe you can help clear that up a bit.
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I would have to say that if your posts are intended to speak for those who do not dare...
Then I can respect that immensely.
And would therefore like to ask...
What opinions would you say define the "extremists" in the view of those who are keeping quiet?
I'm thinking it's libertarian opinions.
Or maybe anti-liberal opinions.
But maybe you can help clear that up a bit.
"People should make up their own minds." is pretty libertarian vs. gov't should make up people's minds. And I don't consider hearsay as respectable.
I would have to say that if your posts are intended to speak for those who do not dare...
Then I can respect that immensely.
And would therefore like to ask...
What opinions would you say define the "extremists" in the view of those who are keeping quiet?
I'm thinking it's libertarian opinions.
Or maybe anti-liberal opinions.
But maybe you can help clear that up a bit.
It's pretty obvious who they are, to all but those who don't share the same views of them... Rational discussion is not tolerated, when one disagrees with the Group Think of the extremists, which is why so many have left and why others don't feel comfortable posting.
It takes a lot to bother me; the insults only show the intelligence of those posting them...
So this part of the forum is dominated by people who all have the same views?
I wish you'd say what views these are that we all share, assuming you include me in this group.
But I don't know a single poster that I agree with all the time.
Except maybe Rolygate, Kristin, and Vocalek.
Seriously, if you are choosing to speak for an unheard from group of people...
This is a chance to help clear the air, if the air can even be cleared.
Maybe some good could come from it.
Okay, so it's the insults then, not necessarily any shared views?
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Pretty much, yes, but I am pretty sure my posts have already been reported as being off topic by now...All of the above...
I'll take the rest of this conversation to PM if you're willing to continue...
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