901 atomizer disassembly

[mogur]

Nice info.

Well, the slow boat from china finally came in. Woo HOOO!

My first homemade coil. A little tentative, so I made it really high resistance. About an inch and a half of NiCr60, wound around a large hypodermic needle.

The new power supply is awesome. Constant current, constant voltage, meters for voltage and current. Anyway, down to business.

Nikrothal 60 38 ga. (.0039" dia), @ 43.29 Ω/ft, 2.5 inches, wound around 1mm dia former, 1.5" finished length, 9.8 Ω, cold:

4.0V .38A 10.5Ω (calculated = V/I, as are all Ωs below)
5.0V .47A 10.6Ω
6.0V .54A 11.1Ω shiny metal started to discolor
7.0V .63A 11.1Ω first very faint glow
8.0V .72A 11.1Ω red glow
9.0V .80A 11.2Ω bright red
10V .88A 11.4Ω
11V .96A 11.5Ω orange
12V 1.04A 11.5Ω
13V 1.12A 11.6Ω yellowish orange
14V 1.18A 11.9Ω amps fell after a few seconds to 1.10
end of spearmint- wire broke when jostled

This is the same wire used in the 901 that I burned up at about the same amperage.

Next, I got braver and tried some Kanthal DSD ribbon, .004" x .012" (.1mm x .3mm) @ 15.12 Ω/ft, ~1 inch, wound around 1mm dia former, ~.5" finished length, 3.1 Ω, cold:

1V .33A 3.0Ω (calculated)
2V .62A 3.2Ω smoke emitted
3V .89A 3.4Ω faint deep red
4V 1.18A 3.4Ω orange
5V 1.48A 3.4Ω
6V 1.77A 3.4Ω
7V 2.05A 3.4Ω yellow/orange
7.2V 2.12A 3.4Ω
>7.2V 2.12A
end of spearmint- power supply amps maxed out

Here's what it looked like at 3V-
http://img531.imageshack.us/img531/2885/mvi5147xx8.flv

And at 5V-
http://img190.imageshack.us/img190/7044/mvi5146.mp4

Finally at 7V-
http://img531.imageshack.us/img531/6091/mvi5145jq5.flv

And the damn thing never broke at over 2 amps! Might drip a little juice next and observe the vape.

If anyone is wondering whether a tactile switch rated in milliamps can handle brief multiamp currents (sry about the focus, it was just an accidental picture, and I just read another post about tact switches)-

 

[Sun Vaporer]

Mogur--this is some real progress--Very Impressive!!!!!!! Have you thought about what you would use to wrap the coil around--what type and source of fiberglass material to make an atomizer? And are you going to try to replace a new coil in a old atomizer?---Thanks----Sun

 

[kinabaloo]

mogur - great work, haven't taken it all in yet, but love to the breadboard there

will read through it again when less sleepy ...

my interest in the resistance of the foam was, obviously, in case it could be used as the heater 'coil' - no wick required. Seems the resistance is just too low (as expected, but oh well)

 

[kinabaloo]

The 1 inch of Kandal (what is that?) looks just right

 

[mogur]

Mogur--this is some real progress--Very Impressive!!!!!!! Have you thought about what you would use to wrap the coil around--what type and source of fiberglass material to make an atomizer? And are you going to try to replace a new coil in a old atomizer?---Thanks----Sun

Thank you. Oh yeah, I've thought about it, but no ideas. Got any? Grin.

RjG used some poi wick, and I've been scouting for an easy purchase of 1/8" fiberglass woven cord, but only seem to find off shore importers selling boatloads of it. Kevlar is out due to its high temperature degradation. Porous, but solid ceramic seems interesting, but there's the problem of obtaining some of that, too.

I saw an atomizer in patent research that looked very appropriate. It used a stainless tube with electrodes spaced apart on the outlet end, with the juice tube actually being the heating element. Can't figure out how to get the resistance up into heater range, though, without being paper thin. Anyway, thought I might try some graphite collars on a syringe tube, like a cold solderer. Probably will lose some eyebrow material on that one. Oh well, I've got plenty to spare. One experiment at a time, though.

 

[mogur]

The 1 inch of Kandal (what is that?) looks just right

Kanthal is Nickel Iron with a little Aluminum thrown in. Comes in A, A-1, D, DSD, and one or two other flavors. Basically, an attempt at improving the oxidation, strength, and endurance properties of NiChrome. One of our few choices, since few others have the high resistance needed for these tiny little buggers.

 

[kinabaloo]

Thank you. Oh yeah, I've thought about it, but no ideas. Got any? Grin.

Zippo wick ?

Forget who, but someone did a little experiment with it - seems good and easy to get

 

[mogur]

Isn't that cotton?

 

[kinabaloo]

Isn't that cotton?

some part of a zippo - thought it was the wick. The person said it didn't burn.

 

[mogur]

Need coffee before writing numbers down. Meanwhile a couple movies to watch-

Warning: if you don't like flaming e-juice movies, don't waste your time on these.

First, a drip at 2.5V, .75A on that last kanthal ribbon coil.
http://img531.imageshack.us/img531/4951/mvi5153fk6.flv

Next, a drip at 3.3V, 1A.
http://img531.imageshack.us/img531/6233/mvi5152os2.flv

Finally, 6V, 1.75A we reach take-off temperature.
http://img531.imageshack.us/img531/540/mvi5151eg7.flv

I'm wasting alot of juice, where do I get glycol locally? Drug store?

 

[RandallFlagg]

Need coffee before writing numbers down. Meanwhile a couple movies to watch-

Warning: if you don't like flaming e-juice movies, don't waste your time on these.

First, a drip at 2.5V, .75A on that last kanthal ribbon coil.
http://img531.imageshack.us/img531/4951/mvi5153fk6.flv

Next, a drip at 3.3V, 1A.
http://img531.imageshack.us/img531/6233/mvi5152os2.flv

Finally, 6V, 1.75A we reach take-off temperature.
http://img531.imageshack.us/img531/540/mvi5151eg7.flv

I'm wasting alot of juice, where do I get glycol locally? Drug store?

Try a farm supply shop.
Or a cigar shop.

 

[mogur]

Thank you, thank you. I live out in the sticks, but have a farm supply down the road.

 

[Rogue X2 v2]

thx 4 the autopsy, mogur! hope you gave ur e-cig a decent burial?! or did you cremated it? LOL!

 

[mogur]

thx 4 the autopsy, mogur! hope you gave ur e-cig a decent burial?! or did you cremated it? LOL!

I'm keeping the body parts to make a MONSTER. I'm waiting on the next lightning storm....

 

[mogur]

I'm a little disappointed this morning. I used a very short (.625") piece of NiCr60 measuring 2.7 Ω to compare to the long one I used yesterday. The hope was to confirm what all the literature had told me about the relationship between amperage and temperature of a resistance wire, i.e., that only amperage uniquely determines temperature for a fixed dia. wire. So, a 10 Ω .004" dia NiCr60 wire yesterday broke at 1.18 amps. Today, the 2.7 Ω .004" dia NiCr60 wire broke at .90 amps. Even more significant was the fact that at .64 A in the short coil the color was orange, while the long coil yesterday didn't turn orange until .74 A.

Well, I'm waiting on a K thermocouple meter on the next slow boat, so I'm suspending these experiments until I know what temperatures we are actually dealing with. I'm going to build a mod today, instead.

 

[kinabaloo]

I'm a little disappointed this morning. I used a very short (.625") piece of NiCr60 measuring 2.7 Ω to compare to the long one I used yesterday. The hope was to confirm what all the literature had told me about the relationship between amperage and temperature of a resistance wire, i.e., that only amperage uniquely determines temperature for a fixed dia. wire. So, a 10 Ω .004" dia NiCr60 wire yesterday broke at 1.18 amps. Today, the 2.7 Ω .004" dia NiCr60 wire broke at .90 amps. Even more significant was the fact that at .64 A in the short coil the color was orange, while the long coil yesterday didn't turn orange until .74 A.

Well, I'm waiting on a K thermocouple meter on the next slow boat, so I'm suspending these experiments until I know what temperatures we are actually dealing with. I'm going to build a mod today, instead.

mogur - not surprising at all really - the heat is spread out in the longer coil, within the extra metal and presenting a greater area for heat loss by both radiation (IR) and convection.

It is not necessary however to aim for the smallest coil - with a mod power capacity is not such an issue and a bit bigger could give a more decent vapor without burning the juice Just will require more current to get to the same temp.

 

[forcedfuel50]

Cool experiments Mogur...very informative...

 

[coldgeo]

Hey, Mogur, why not use something like Pt or Au wire? I understand it is expensive, but it is relatively quite nonreactive and could potentially make a longer lasting coil. Is it because of the amount of heat required to take it to the vaporization point? Further, what is the 'vaporization point' with respect to the coil and the liquid and what will be considered the optimal surface area and temperature?

I'm highly interested in this DIY style. You're kicking some major ..., man.

 

[kinabaloo]

Hey, Mogur, why not use something like Pt or Au wire? I understand it is expensive, but it is relatively quite nonreactive and could potentially make a longer lasting coil. Is it because of the amount of heat required to take it to the vaporization point? Further, what is the 'vaporization point' with respect to the coil and the liquid and what will be considered the optimal surface area and temperature?

I'm highly interested in this DIY style. You're kicking some major ..., man.

Welcome.

Atomiser coils fail primarily because a burnt deposit of dry residues from the juice builds up. Solution: improved juice formulations.

To reach vaporising temp reasonably quickly when the coil is wet requires a power in (about 3w) that is sufficient to take the coil to red-hot when it is dry. Two solutions: feed coil by piezo from valved container and detect when container is low; temperature control the heater coil.

 

[coldgeo]

So, it would be possible then to clean a dead atomizer's coil and restore functionality? What exactly is flawed in the liquid's design?

Sorry to derail this topic.