A Few Questions About DIY E-Liquid

[kinky j]

I've been reading the DIY section and have a few questions, but can't post in there yet so thought I'd post them in here instead.

Firstly, there's a warning about how dangerous nicotine is that made me confused, is it just in it's pure form or would 36mg liquid be dangerous to work with? also how would I go about cleaning anything I mix it in safely?

Secondly, if I had 35ml of 36mg liquid and mixed it into 70ml VG am I right in thinking this would result in 105ml of 12mg liquid? (maths not my strong point)

Thirdly, roughly how many ml of flavouring would I need to be able to taste it? Would I have to subtract the amount of ml of flavouring used from the total ml of VG to keep it at 12mg?

I hope that makes sense

Thanks in advance
KJ

 

[makdevo]

You asked
there's a warning about how dangerous nicotine is that made me confused, is it just in it's pure form or would 36mg liquid be dangerous to work with? also how would I go about cleaning anything I mix it in safely?

My response
Handling pure nicotine is very dangerous. Handling 36mg nicotine is not dangerous, keep away from pets and children etc...
Cleaning with normal soap and water is fine.


You asked
if I had 35ml of 36mg liquid and mixed it into 70ml VG am I right in thinking this would result in 105ml of 12mg liquid? (maths not my strong point)

my response
Yes your math is correct. There are several good DIY ejuice calculators on the forum, search for them, they will help

you asked
roughly how many ml of flavouring would I need to be able to taste it? Would I have to subtract the amount of ml of flavouring used from the total ml of VG to keep it at 12mg?

my response
Yes the flavor will dilute the nicotine just like VG. Keeing 12mg will require adding flavor and VG totals keeping to the 70ml to 35ml ratio.

Flavor: This is a tough one, maybe you should mix small batches and try it first. Don't mix 105 ml unless you are sure! you have to be more specific as to what flavorings you are using.
If you are using strong flavors like menthol or tobacco absolute it only takes a small amount. If you are using weak flavors it could take upto 20% or more to get the flavor you like.

 

[kinky j]

Thankyou Makdevo you're a star!

Flavor: This is a tough one, maybe you should mix small batches and try it first. Don't mix 105 ml unless you are sure! you have to be more specific as to what flavorings you are using.
If you are using strong flavors like menthol or tobacco absolute it only takes a small amount. If you are using weak flavors it could take upto 20% or more to get the flavor you like.

I was looking at the flavourings from liberty-flights, they come in 5ml bottles and it says they're very strong. I was thinking about getting a few different flavours and making up 10ml bottles as and when, so to speak. Would 3 bottles of flavouring (probably coffee, pineapple and a tobacco one) be enough to keep me going until I've used up all the 35ml bottle of 36mg liquid?

TBH, my priority is a reasonable flavour liquid I can make cheap rather than I nice tasting liquid for a bit more money. We're trying to save money to move house and do up a sensory room and get a trampoline for my little un.

Thanks again
KJ

 

[oldtechno]

I cut my 24mg twice...it winds up at 6mg. I found I can cut mine once and still get flavor...but after that second time it loose most its flavor.

 

[Elendil]

Moved to DIY forum

 

[kinky j]

Thanks Oldtechno, Does the flavour taste weaker if you only cut it once?

Oh, and another quick question, Can I mix PG and VG together?

 

[foebea]

If you are starting with unflavored liquid you would be able to get it to whatever mg/ml you desire with no loss of flavor as you havent added it in yet. If you are starting with a shop liquid then yes, you will definately be losing flavor. It might not be a bad thing though if you are cutting it with another flavored liquid or add in your own. As it has been said, try it in small batched. Depending on your desired recipe you can do a test batch of only a few drops, so if it is bad, there is nothing to throw away.

PG and VG do mix well. Be sure to check your VG to ensure it is roughly the same consistancy of the PG. VG is normally very thick, and needs to be diluted with water or some people use PGA (pure grain alcohol, like everclear).

VG adds a bit to the vapor and smooths a bit of the flavor it seems. makes it.... rounder this diy stuff can get a bit like wine tasting.

 

[kinky j]

PG and VG do mix well. Be sure to check your VG to ensure it is roughly the same consistancy of the PG. VG is normally very thick, and needs to be diluted with water or some people use PGA (pure grain alcohol, like everclear).

Thanks, I didn't know that. What would be the difference between using water (is that just normal tap water, btw?) and using PGA?

 

[Kurt]

Thanks, I didn't know that. What would be the difference between using water (is that just normal tap water, btw?) and using PGA?

I didn't get good results with using water to thin VG juices...mine wouldn't vape well at all. I can't get PGA in PA (blue laws), but cheap 100-proof vodka works really well, not just to thin the juices, but to sterilize equipment and recycled bottles and carts. I use 10% vodka in my VG-only DIYs.

 

[kinky j]

Cool, that'd probably be easier to get hold of over here than PGA would,

 

[Raenon]

If you do decide to use water instead of alcohol (vodka should be fine, as long as it's 80-100 proof), make sure to use DISTILLED water, not tap or other bottled. Most bottled and all tap will have impurities, including things like fluoride/chlorine or other minerals. Even Coca-cola's Dasani has small amounts of salt added. Sure, it helps the human body to absorb water better, but it's no good for atties.

Distilled water is nothing but pure H-2-O. You can find it here in most grocery stores and pharmacies. It'll probably be right next to any other water, and it's probably cheaper than the name brand bottlers.

 

[sjohnson]

Unless you have bad, crap municipal water, at the concentration levels we use to vape it's not going to make a gnat's ... of a difference.

 

[bluesuede]

I didn't get good results with using water to thin VG juices...mine wouldn't vape well at all. I can't get PGA in PA (blue laws), but cheap 100-proof vodka works really well, not just to thin the juices, but to sterilize equipment and recycled bottles and carts. I use 10% vodka in my VG-only DIYs.

Im in PA too and I was gonna try and find Everclear around here. Can't?? I could always order over the net I suppose. Would Absolut work as well?

 

[Raenon]

Im in PA too and I was gonna try and find Everclear around here. Can't?? I could always order over the net I suppose. Would Absolut work as well?

Absolut would probably be okay- smirnoff would be better. Absolut has some oily impurities that lend to it's distinct finish, but smirnoff is squeaky clean.
Hence Absolut for straight/on the rocks, Smirnoff for mixing

As someone mentioned above, the quantities we use for vaping as so small it's probably not a problem, but I say why risk it?

 

[tanimn]

Save yourself a whole lot of trouble, and stay far away from non distilled water for ANY vaporizer use.

Don't mix with it, don't clean with it, and you won't destroy your attys with it.
My first 2 attys are in pristine condition thanks to frequent cleaning with hot tap water. I just wish they still vaped through the calcified shell around the nichrome wires. :-(

~100 proof vodka is good enough for mixing, but if you are using the alcohol for throat hit remember to double it compared to a recipe calling for PGA.

Alcohol is also good in juices for it effervescent qualities (particularly in VG). It allows the flavors to be more distinct in the mix. Ever wonder why soft drinks are carbonated?

 

[Kurt]

Im in PA too and I was gonna try and find Everclear around here. Can't?? I could always order over the net I suppose. Would Absolut work as well?

You can try, but they may not sell to a PA address. Absolut is vodka, so yes, it should work, although isn't it rather pricy...but if that's what's on hand, then fine. I use Smirnoff or Kamchatka (spelling?) which is very cheap-.... Vladimir is also another c-a vodka. I've even heard of some here that use flavored vodkas to thin and add a little flavor too. Evidently Smirnoff vanilla is a good one, but I've not tried this. Scottes uses 151 rum, but this will add rum flavor of course, as would whiskey or bourbon add their own flavors. And they may have sugar too. Not good for attys, although it is probably not much of a factor.

Don't use a potato vodka, if they even still make them. Fantastic to drink, especially frozen, but LOTS of starch molecules that will cause atty problems. But I haven't seen these in about 10 years or so. And I don't drink much at all these days anyway.

 

[Kurt]

Alcohol is also good in juices for it effervescent qualities (particularly in VG). It allows the flavors to be more distinct in the mix. Ever wonder why soft drinks are carbonated?

I'm not getting this, tanimn. What does carbonation, which is done with high-pressure CO2, have to do with ethanol in VG? I've noticed no effervescence with ethanol in VG, and its 100% of my DIY juices. Can you please elaborate? I do agree with the bringing flavors out properties of adding ethanol to VG. Maybe you mean it boils at a lower temp so the bubbles sort of help break up and vaporize the VG? This indeed does happen. Thanks.

 

[tanimn]

I'm not getting this, tanimn. What does carbonation, which is done with high-pressure CO2, have to do with ethanol in VG? I've noticed no effervescence with ethanol in VG, and its 100% of my DIY juices. Can you please elaborate? I do agree with the bringing flavors out properties of adding ethanol to VG. Maybe you mean it boils at a lower temp so the bubbles sort of help break up and vaporize the VG? This indeed does happen. Thanks.

I probably should have found a better word to put there, but "stimulation of the olfactory senses via evaporation" doesn't reduce well.

Carbonated soft drinks owe their popularity to the fact that the CO2 carries the smell of the liquid to your nose as you drink, mimicking the way that alcohol evaporation does the same thing for hard drinks.

Effervescence does bring bubbles to mind, which is why I qualified the statement as 'effervescent qualities'. Ethanol seems to allow a flavor to pop out of a juice, when straight VG wraps a flavor in kinda sorta ALMOST taste it. It's very easy to pass that 'one drop too much' flavor threshold when mixing with VG because while it dampens the flavor, it doesn't reduce the concentration of that flavor.

Hope I haven't caused even more confusion now...

 

[Kurt]

I probably should have found a better word to put there, but "stimulation of the olfactory senses via evaporation" doesn't reduce well.

Carbonated soft drinks owe their popularity to the fact that the CO2 carries the smell of the liquid to your nose as you drink, mimicking the way that alcohol evaporation does the same thing for hard drinks.

Effervescence does bring bubbles to mind, which is why I qualified the statement as 'effervescent qualities'. Ethanol seems to allow a flavor to pop out of a juice, when straight VG wraps a flavor in kinda sorta ALMOST taste it. It's very easy to pass that 'one drop too much' flavor threshold when mixing with VG because while it dampens the flavor, it doesn't reduce the concentration of that flavor.

Hope I haven't caused even more confusion now...

Not at all. Quite clear and I agree. For me effervescence chemically means production of bubbles in a liquid, but you are dead on with everything you are saying. I like to think of it as flavor (and nic) made more bioavailable, as the alcohol boiling sort of unwraps the VG droplet around those compounds. We're saying exactly the same thing, just different vantage points. Cool!