anti e-cig commercial

[Myk]

I will also agree that I would appreciate local health department inspections of e-liquid vendors just like restaurants but not the FDA. The FDA is after control and taxes not safety.

The FDA isn't about taxes. They're not about safety. They are about control which comes down to protecting the corporate interests.
There's no other excuse for them to be focused on ecigs as long and they have and trying everything they have while at the same time allowing tests for Zyban to be rushed through and falsified, and then after knowing about the problems with Zyban doing the same thing with Chantix.
They also want to inspect me if I sell apples out of my yard but don't care what Monsanto does to the food.
We have the best government corporate money can buy, and they have.

 

[zapped]

I worked in Restaurants when I was in College. We were visited by the Health Department randomly. How many e-liquid Retailers are Inspected? And what are they Inspected for?

There were also Standards for things like Cooking Temperatures/Storage and Sanitation.

BTW - Traceability of Ingredients and Quality Control was one of the Reasons I started to do DIY.

Ever notice how those "random" inspections only happened on weekdays before 5pm? If the Health department were TRULY doing their job they would be in on a Friday or Saturday night at 7pm checking things out not at 10 in the morning.

Regulations like those are only good if they are enforced and the majority of them arent.Ive even heard of some health department inspectors taking bribes of food and/or money.

Better not to even have a law if thats the case.

 

[Susiejo]

That is just it. You don't think BigT will try to get DIY and self extractions to be be made illegal just like growing your own "other leafy herbs". Even if they can't get DIY to be illegal, how many people do you REALLY think are going to grow their own tobacco, do their own extraction, then make their own juice instead of just picking up a pack of smokes? Probably about as many that are willing to grow and roll their own analogs today.

My husband and I have been growing tobacco for quite a while and I have kept some that we grow to roll my own. It is different from what you buy at the store but it is still pretty good. and growing my own and rolling it I know exactly what is in it.
There are certain chemicals that you spray on tobacco while it is growing to kill bugs (yes there are bugs that don't have a problem with nicotine). One is the tobacco worm (aka tomato hornworm), it can decimate a tobacco crop very quickly. I can give you a list of the chemicals used on tobacco while it is growing but the most harmful stuff is what they do to it after they take it to the tobacco plant to be processed for cigs. Alot of the chemicals we used on the tobacco can be used on vegetable plants as well. If you have questions regarding how tobacco is grown and cured, I can answer those, but as to how nicotine is extracted I have no idea.
I have noticed all the warnings about DIY juices, about working with nicotine, but I already know quite a bit about that from working in tobacco. What most people don't know is that 95% of the work in raising tobacco is hands on work. Very, very little is done with machine. When you work in the tobacco patch you have to be careful and wear protective clothing to keep from getting nicotine poisoning, especially if the tobacco is wet. I, myself, have gotten sick from working in the tobacco, and it is not a good thing. But I don't think we need the government treating us like we're 5 y.o., I am an adult and I take responsibility for myself and as I am going on 45 y.o. this year, I think I've done a pretty good job of taking care of myself. We don't need the government in everything we do. I mean seriously people, do you really need someone to tell you that smoking is bad, nicotine is dangerous, or that eating 3 Big Macs a day will make you fat!

~Susiejo

 

[EddardinWinter]

I think this is where a Group like AEMSA, or another Trade Organization, would be More Effective than CASAA.

It takes Money to get things done in Government. Trade Organization type Money.

If it were not for CASAA, many of our vaping rights would have been lost already. Those who don't support CASAA still benefit from their vigilance.

AEMSA has yet to do anything to improve a single vendor's process that is not on their (very short) list of vendors. The biggest name vendor on the list is probably NicQuid, I guess. None of my vendors are on the list.

AEMSA won't defend your rights, they want to give them away. They hope that giving a few up will somehow get the FDA to play nice. That is childlike reasoning. The FDA understands force, not reason.

CASAA is the only proven fighter for vapers. Visit CASAA, see for yourself.



Sent from my HTC6435LVW using Tapatalk 2

 

[BostonVape]

this is terrible.. since when to people goto the weather channel for medical advice?

some of the lamest scare tactics in this 'commercial' if you can even call it that.

 

[zoiDman]

If it were not for CASAA, many of our vaping rights would have been lost already. Those who don't support CASAA still benefit from their vigilance.

AEMSA has yet to do anything to improve a single vendor's process that is not on their (very short) list of vendors. The biggest name vendor on the list is probably NicQuid, I guess. None of my vendors are on the list.

AEMSA won't defend your rights, they want to give them away. They hope that giving a few up will somehow get the FDA to play nice. That is childlike reasoning. The FDA understands force, not reason.

CASAA is the only proven fighter for vapers. Visit CASAA, see for yourself.



Sent from my HTC6435LVW using Tapatalk 2

Not saying that CASAA hasn't done Great Work. They have. And I am Happy to Support them.

But I think CASSA will be the First to tell you that to Lobby Congress or to be Effective in dealing with the FDA, or Any Government Agency, that it is going to take Money. Big Money.

And where is that Money Going to come From? The Only Logical place is a Trade Organization.

I Fully Understand what AEMSA is. They Represent the Wishes of their Members. So it is Incorrect to say that AEMSA is going to do Anything. What should be said is that AEMSA's Members want to do something thru AEMSA.


I'm not sure if you have been following this thread...

http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/casaa/423407-ejuice-label.html

There is some good Dialogs in it. Here is a Small Snippet with regards to a Trade Organization.

True, a wait-and-see approach may prove prudent in this case. But as far as what an association seal of approval can give, it's like getting a seal of approval from the BBB or Good Housekeeping. Government regulations do not guarantee compliance and who will ensure compliance? The government is notoriously bad at enforcing its own rules and regulations - there's so freaking many of them! lol! Anyhow, even once there are government standards, there will still be fly-by-night companies and those who are less than ethical. Having an association that will assure consumers that the companies who are members of the association (and listed on their web site to easily find, of course) are above board, follow the rules and regulations and trustworthy is an added value for consumers. It's standard practice in hundreds of industries and there is no reason why it wouldn't work for the e-cigarette industry, as well. It's why we have the BBB, Angie's List, the UL and a whole host of industry organizations. People know that just because there are laws that doesn't mean all companies follow them. So, regardless of what rules and regulations the FDA comes up with, consumers will benefit from and ethical association that is ensuring quality and adherence to those rules and regulations. It also benefits vendors and customers to have a powerful association that can lobby the FDA to make improvements to those regulations to better serve the consumers. (For example, the REALTORS Association doesn't just hold brokers accountable, it developed the MLS system and lobbies for laws that benefit home buyers and home owners and against those that would make home ownership less possible or more expensive - ie. taxes, interest rates.)

This is another Reason that AEMSA "May" be a Benefit to the Vaping Community.

But until we see what the FDA plans to do, and how effective AEMSA Lobbying Efforts are for their Member's, it is hard to say what will or Will Not Happen.

Wait and See I think are the Words for Today.

BTW - People should not be Under Any Illusions to what AEMSA Priorities are. AEMSA is a Trade Organization. NOT a Consumer Organization.

This is Not to Say that there Can Not be Overlap between what It's Members Want and what Consumers Want.

But in the Event of Diverging Views, AEMSA is going to do what It's Members Want and Not what the General Vaping Community Wants. As well they should.

 

[DC2]

Isn't having Tighter Restrictions on who can Buy and Who can Sell Nicotine Base the Next Logical Progression?

It's the ONLY logical progression, and it's all but inevitable as far as I'm concerned.

 

[zoiDman]

It's the ONLY logical progression, and it's all but inevitable as far as I'm concerned.

I think that is a Fair Assessment of where we are Headed.

 

[EddardinWinter]

Not saying that CASAA hasn't done Great Work. They have. And I am Happy to Support them.

But I think CASSA will be the First to tell you that to Lobby Congress or to be Effective in dealing with the FDA, or Any Government Agency, that it is going to take Money. Big Money.

And where is that Money Going to come From? The Only Logical place is a Trade Organization.

I Fully Understand what AEMSA is. They Represent the Wishes of their Members. So it is Incorrect to say that AEMSA is going to do Anything. What should be said is that AEMSA's Members want to do something thru AEMSA.


I'm not sure if you have been following this thread...

http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/casaa/423407-ejuice-label.html

There is some good Dialogs in it. Here is a Small Snippet with regards to a Trade Organization.

I note the following. Kristin does not endorse AEMSA in that quote. I hear from her every two weeks at CASAA meetings and she has never endorsed AEMSA. She only notes the value a generic trade organization could have.

Admittedly, I have not followed the thread. I will try to catch up.

That said, even if Kristin endorsed AEMSA, I would not. She is the leader of an organization I support, not my Mommy.

If AEMSA changes its positions on some issues, I may consider changing my stance from firmly opposed to some sort of support. Sorry, but I just don't think that they are going to help me in any way when food coloring is banned due to a personal issue on of the board members has. When I get into that thread I will update.

I do thank you for the link to the information. Much appreciated!

 

[zoiDman]

I note the following. Kristin does not endorse AEMSA in that quote. I hear from her every two weeks at CASAA meetings and she has never endorsed AEMSA. She only notes the value a generic trade organization could have.

Admittedly, I have not followed the thread. I will try to catch up.

That said, even if Kristin endorsed AEMSA, I would not. She is the leader of an organization I support, not my Mommy.

If AEMSA changes its positions on some issues, I may consider changing my stance from firmly opposed to some sort of support. Sorry, but I just don't think that they are going to help me in any way when food coloring is banned due to a personal issue on of the board members has. When I get into that thread I will update.

I do thank you for the link to the information. Much appreciated!

Whether or Not a person Likes or Dislike AEMSA is a personal Decision.

I have Very Mixed Feeling about AEMSA. Mainly because I Don't Know what Exactly the FDA will do in the Coming Months.

It could be that AEMSA works closely with the FDA and their Efforts Benefit the Average Vaper. It could be the Direct Opposite.

Everyone is Kinda in Limbo until we start hear how e-Cigarettes/e-Liquids will be Regulated.

 

[EddardinWinter]

Whether or Not a person Likes or Dislike AEMSA is a personal Decision.

I have Very Mixed Feeling about AEMSA. Mainly because I Don't Know what Exactly the FDA will do in the Coming Months.

It could be that AEMSA works closely with the FDA and their Efforts Benefit the Average Vaper. It could be the Direct Opposite.

Everyone is Kinda in Limbo until we start hear how e-Cigarettes/e-Liquids will be Regulated.

True, we are in limbo. I see the FDA's slowness as a reaction to the strength the vaping community has gathered. That is just my opinion, and I could be way off base.

My feelings are this: AEMSA working with the FDA gives me another reason to not trust them.

 

[Myk]

AEMSA won't defend your rights, they want to give them away. They hope that giving a few up will somehow get the FDA to play nice. That is childlike reasoning. The FDA understands force, not reason.

I don't know what AEMSA wants but I can tell them that trying to appease antis so they stop wanting more doesn't work. The more you give in the more they want. They only need to look at alcohol, firearms and tobacco prohibition history for the proof.
If something needs fixed you fix that but stand firm on everything else.

 

[mcol]

Last night browsing You Tube - saw that video of Rachel Ray interviewing someone on the e-cig.
What a ......... can't say it in a public forum. "Ew, don't want to touch it.......EW.....ICKY......."
Gag.

 

[MartiP]

I will also agree that I would appreciate local health department inspections of e-liquid vendors just like restaurants but not the FDA. The FDA is after control and taxes not safety.

^^Yep. This.^^

 

[AgentAnia]

I see the FDA's slowness as a reaction to the strength the vaping community has gathered. That is just my opinion, and I could be way off base.

My opinion too.

 

[GaryInTexas]

True, we are in limbo. I see the FDA's slowness as a reaction to the strength the vaping community has gathered. That is just my opinion, and I could be way off base.

My feelings are this: AEMSA working with the FDA gives me another reason to not trust them.

I see their slowness as the federal governments inability to get out of the way of a racing turtle. I actually think their just waiting on big pharma and BT to fill their pockets a little more. They just don't want to choke the golden goose yet. They were not concerned about over whelming opposition to Obamacare and they are not worried about stomping our relatively small group like a bug.

 

[EddardinWinter]

I see their slowness as the federal governments inability to get out of the way of a racing turtle. I actually think their just waiting on big pharma and BT to fill their pockets a little more. They just don't want to choke the golden goose yet. They were not concerned about over whelming opposition to Obamacare and they are not worried about stomping our relatively small group like a bug.

That could be true. But remember, the pretense of a "health hazard" of e-cigarettes is falling apart. On Obamacare, there was the 'need' for insuring 20 million Americans going for them, plus a perceived mandate after the sweeping 2008 elections. The FDA lacks both positive momentum events, and they have not forgotten the pasting delivered to them the last time they were in court on this issue.

Back then, there was no CASAA (only its forerunner which was an loose alliance). Now CASAA opposes them at every local and state proposal. CASAA is organized and a force to be reckoned with, and they know it.

And they also want no parts of the Lion!

 

[GaryInTexas]

I hope your right and I am wrong but my confidence level in the federal government doing the right thing is pegged at zero.

 

[AgentAnia]

I agree with you both in some ways, EddardinWinter and GaryInTexas. The Federal bureaucracy is notoriously slow-moving (That "inability to get out of the way of a racing turtle" is going in my quotable quotes file, LOL!), which may be part of the reason the "deeming regulations" are so late in coming. But I also believe that the ANTZ (I'm including private sector and government) have until now been able to run roughshod over the "smoking" community, whereas suddenly they find they have, gasp!, opposition. Vocal and assertive opposition. And to ruin their day even further, the opposition has, shudder, facts and figures to support their position.

In so many ways, ecigs are a game changer. It's gonna be a bumpy ride, but a fascinating one.