Best thread on rebuilding an atomiser is this one by RjG: http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/modders-forum/8368-cigar-rebuild-pics-bling-v2.html
Great pics and detail
Great pics and detail
Attn: atomizer rebuilders
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Carbon is forming on wick fibers but I doubt the resistance is low enough to cause the coil to fail. I never let it get dry.
I hope to get my hands on some of this #D1200 DAFLEX Braided Fiberglass Sleeving soon. I used the 24ga for thermocouple wire insulation in a 2000+ deg F environment for 20 years in the textile fiberglass industry. Anxious to try it inside and outside the coil.
There is a silicosis potential with the raw materials for figerglass (silica, clay, lime etc.) but once the fibers have been formed any particulate produced by the breakdown of the fiber is too large to embed in lung tissue. It is expelled like the dust particles we breath all the time.
If this is a concern, don't use 801 atomizers. Just about every one has loose and/or burned off filaments lying about the coil area.
Bits of deposit could well also get into the air-stream. If one puts a filter just inside the mouthpiece, and check it carefully a day or two later one might be surprised.
I actually considered making a ring to go around the cart to catch such debris. But I feel if the coil is kept wet and all the condensation in the chamber , design of turns in the mouthpiece it would be very hard for much to get out. If it did though it would be the smallest size.
I received a reply from the manufacturer of the single amophorous crystal silica yarn and thread on a request for a 10' (300cm) sample. They make a 1 & 2mm dia size cermaic based also. It can take 1200* constant with little to no degradation.
They quoted me the cost for a kilo spool. No sample.
No help there. I still await replys from 2 distributors I found for samples.
If I can get one to send me a sample to examine, test...I'd consider buying a spool and selling it in 10' lengths if it was better than anything we have now.
There is a fiberglass mat material used to make model airplanes. Is very smooth to the touch with a sheen and a silky feel. If I still have some I can try to cut a length and then fold the cut ends in and roll. It's very thin to keep weight down. That would just leave the loose wick ends as the only possible source for stray bits.
I haven't give up looking yet..............
Edit: I sent a reply back to the company stating I couldn't consider purchasing something I've never seen or was able to test and would look for their product at US distributors. They don't have distributors in the USA and samples are on the way tomorrow!
I received a reply from the manufacturer of the single amophorous crystal silica yarn and thread on a request for a 10' (300cm) sample. They make a 1 & 2mm dia size cermaic based also. It can take 1200* constant with little to no degradation.
They quoted me the cost for a kilo spool. No sample.
No help there. I still await replys from 2 distributors I found for samples.
If I can get one to send me a sample to examine, test...I'd consider buying a spool and selling it in 10' lengths if it was better than anything we have now.
There is a fiberglass mat material used to make model airplanes. Is very smooth to the touch with a sheen and a silky feel. If I still have some I can try to cut a length and then fold the cut ends in and roll. It's very thin to keep weight down. That would just leave the loose wick ends as the only possible source for stray bits.
I haven't give up looking yet..............
Edit: I sent a reply back to the company stating I couldn't consider purchasing something I've never seen or was able to test and would look for their product at US distributors. They don't have distributors in the USA and samples are on the way tomorrow!
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I think the more critical issue is that heating copper can give off some vapors that I don't think you will NOT be wanting to inhale.
Just to revive a 'dead' thread... I had an idea driving into work this morning...
After searching for a little bit, I couldn't find anything on it so forgive me if this has been discussed already...
How about just nichrome foam?
Do they make such a thing? If the resistance is right, shouldn't we be able to stick it in a ceramic pot and apply a charge to it? No wicking material required - no nickle mesh, just a heating element for a cart to wick onto; or just drip on....
It should be reasonably easy to clean or replace... I'm envisioning that the legs are just screwed into the bottom of the ceramic pot, rather than soldered..
I dunno - just brain storming...
After searching for a little bit, I couldn't find anything on it so forgive me if this has been discussed already...
How about just nichrome foam?
Do they make such a thing? If the resistance is right, shouldn't we be able to stick it in a ceramic pot and apply a charge to it? No wicking material required - no nickle mesh, just a heating element for a cart to wick onto; or just drip on....
It should be reasonably easy to clean or replace... I'm envisioning that the legs are just screwed into the bottom of the ceramic pot, rather than soldered..
I dunno - just brain storming...
I like the way you think. I don't think you can buy NiCr mesh. But what if we used small gage Nichrome and weaved it like a chain-link fence?
Possible Problems:
-Higher power requirements? If lower gage wire uses less power for the same heat then this might not be an issue.
-It might have too large of a surface area.
I just got my 36,32, and 26ga wire but haven't experimented or done any calculations yet. I better look those up and get to work!
I thought about a mesh - but foam would be easier to cut and stick a + and - wire into - less connections.... (How the hell are you going to weave that?!?!?! )
I googled "Nichrome Foam" but came up with nothing worthwhile... One guy back in 1979 has a patent for something using it - so Nichrome Foam exists, somewhere...
Nichrome mesh had a few more hits... But nothing I could take a look at....
Personally, I am envisioning a disk 10-13mm in diameter, maybe 1-2mm thick, with two wires coming out of it, a unit, like present atomizers, that would screw on to a AA battery housing... If you want - I could post pictures...
)I googled "Nichrome Foam" but came up with nothing worthwhile... One guy back in 1979 has a patent for something using it - so Nichrome Foam exists, somewhere...
Nichrome mesh had a few more hits... But nothing I could take a look at....
Personally, I am envisioning a disk 10-13mm in diameter, maybe 1-2mm thick, with two wires coming out of it, a unit, like present atomizers, that would screw on to a AA battery housing... If you want - I could post pictures...
I've made a few different designs before. One was a conical spiral, point up.
I'd thought of a straight "box" weave , over and under. The problem is that electricitry takes the shortest path. The tests I did always shorted out at some point no matter how much oxidation I let form 1st. I was trying to let the natural oxidatiion act as a protective coating.
I still think the idea will work if you can prevent this from happening. The wire will distort while getting red hot. It always seems to look good just before it goes.
If you solve that problem, you could weave it for a "hot filter grid" that vaporizes anything trying to pass it.
It forms better after heated without springing back, but is more likely to break. Been there.
Don't let this discourage your efforts. Open discussion lead to answers one person cannot always solve. Good post and idea.
Edit: if a NiCr mesh could be found, that had the right resistance, for the dia naturally, that could possibly work.
I'd thought of a straight "box" weave , over and under. The problem is that electricitry takes the shortest path. The tests I did always shorted out at some point no matter how much oxidation I let form 1st. I was trying to let the natural oxidatiion act as a protective coating.
I still think the idea will work if you can prevent this from happening. The wire will distort while getting red hot. It always seems to look good just before it goes.
If you solve that problem, you could weave it for a "hot filter grid" that vaporizes anything trying to pass it.
It forms better after heated without springing back, but is more likely to break. Been there.
Don't let this discourage your efforts. Open discussion lead to answers one person cannot always solve. Good post and idea.
Edit: if a NiCr mesh could be found, that had the right resistance, for the dia naturally, that could possibly work.
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Okay... didn't know that!
Is there someway to SEE how the electricity is traveling?
For instance, if the black things are the + and - wires, and we have a mesh or foam as the red... could we see if electricity is flowing enough around the edges? (Other than the obvious of making it and plugging it in and watch what turns red...)
I'm not sure but if electricity takes the shortest path it seems like it might not go out to the "ends" of the "T"?
I was thinking if electrical contacts were at the corners, electricity might be more even. But I have no idea...
I was thinking if electrical contacts were at the corners, electricity might be more even. But I have no idea...
How about a cross piece then?
We still have to be able to SEE the current flow though....
We still have to be able to SEE the current flow though....
Cross piece would be good, plus it gives us something nice to "weave" off of. But yeah, i'm not 100% sure if the "chain link" is possible to do, it's probably the hardest, but I think it would look cool Perhaps there are some other good "absorbent" coil designs...
The other issue: it might be hard to stuff this thing into the atomizer, and especially without it touching itself somewhere.
Perhaps there are some other good "absorbent" coil designs...The other issue: it might be hard to stuff this thing into the atomizer, and especially without it touching itself somewhere.
I see you are starting to get the concept.
It's not an easy feat. The 2nd drawing in post 155 is the best shot at it as it is.
If one place decides to touch changing the path or another gains resistance from material changes (resistance) the lower resistance now carries the most load and will fail at that point. Thats why you see most coil configurations as a single strand, never crossing.
The conical shape I described earlier was a single strand, like a stove burner with the center pulled up. The idea was to form a "heat cage" that the least amount of atomized liquid could pass without vaporizing. It distorted and touched making a lower ohm circuit, drew all the current in that length and failed immediately on touching. That was with an 801 atty. Which is big compared to a 510 which has a 2 x 4 mm opening to work in. Even with wire .005 dia thats not much room.
Also you need to decide on the flow path of the atomized particle. It wouldn't do much good to just wrap it around the inside walls as the particles will pass it and may not reach vaporization temps. Some cermaic bowls have one feed hole, some 2. Another problem.
I'm not trying to discourage you in the least. With the present design atty there are limitations as with any design.
With the right tools and materials, it may be easier to just redesign the whole atomizer process.
Edit: The next problem you find is being able to feed the beast. The better it works the more it can handle.
It's not an easy feat. The 2nd drawing in post 155 is the best shot at it as it is.
If one place decides to touch changing the path or another gains resistance from material changes (resistance) the lower resistance now carries the most load and will fail at that point. Thats why you see most coil configurations as a single strand, never crossing.
The conical shape I described earlier was a single strand, like a stove burner with the center pulled up. The idea was to form a "heat cage" that the least amount of atomized liquid could pass without vaporizing. It distorted and touched making a lower ohm circuit, drew all the current in that length and failed immediately on touching. That was with an 801 atty. Which is big compared to a 510 which has a 2 x 4 mm opening to work in. Even with wire .005 dia thats not much room.
Also you need to decide on the flow path of the atomized particle. It wouldn't do much good to just wrap it around the inside walls as the particles will pass it and may not reach vaporization temps. Some cermaic bowls have one feed hole, some 2. Another problem.
I'm not trying to discourage you in the least. With the present design atty there are limitations as with any design.
With the right tools and materials, it may be easier to just redesign the whole atomizer process.
Edit: The next problem you find is being able to feed the beast. The better it works the more it can handle.
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Thanks, Vaporer. I have been spending tons of class time drawing prototypes of new atomizers I've just started playing with Nichrome and need all the help I can get. I really want to improve the design and performance... but it's nice getting feedback and not having to start the "research" and experiments from scratch.
So... any advice on failed or successful attempts at unique DIY atomizers? I think I've read almost every single post on this forum on the subject, but I get the feeling that a lot of people have tried many things without necessarily detailing them here.
I've just started playing with Nichrome and need all the help I can get. I really want to improve the design and performance... but it's nice getting feedback and not having to start the "research" and experiments from scratch.So... any advice on failed or successful attempts at unique DIY atomizers? I think I've read almost every single post on this forum on the subject, but I get the feeling that a lot of people have tried many things without necessarily detailing them here.
I'm sure there have been many attempts that have failed. Some dont want to talk about failures. To me those are important posts as much as successes. Another may see a diff approach or why it didnt work. Its a human nature thing.
Do you have an atty torn down or have you ever disassembled one?
If not, thats where to start and look ait the airflow pattern. That will be your target area. Try blowing a visible vapor through it backwards and if you can make a piece of clear to fit the atty...drip it and vape with a vid camers on the side view so you can see whats really going on. Then you can see where improvements can be made.
Do you have an atty torn down or have you ever disassembled one?
If not, thats where to start and look ait the airflow pattern. That will be your target area. Try blowing a visible vapor through it backwards and if you can make a piece of clear to fit the atty...drip it and vape with a vid camers on the side view so you can see whats really going on. Then you can see where improvements can be made.
This was going to be a reply but I made it into a thread to keep things organized: New Atomizer Prototype.
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