Batteries are acting strange but I have no idea why.

[Rickajho]

As you sure the problematic batteries are unprotected? The flaky behavior is sounding more and more like what I would expect with protected batteries behaving badly in a VAMO or even an eVic if a protection circuit starts flaking out.

The only way you will get any satisfaction out of this - and an answer - is to get at least one other battery in there that isn't one of those NCR's and see what you get.

 

[Baditude]

As you sure the problematic batteries are unprotected? The flaky behavior is sounding more and more like what I would expect with protected batteries behaving badly in a VAMO or even an eVic if a protection circuit starts flaking out.

The only way you will get any satisfaction out of this - and an answer - is to get at least one other battery in there that isn't one of those NCR's and see what you get.

Good point. The Panasonic/Orbtronic NCR batteries can be purchased as either protected or un-protected.

 

[Ryedan]

I have no idea why it behaves differently with battery #1 vs #2 and #3, but IMO the problem is with the SID. I finally Googled 'smoktech sid short message' and got a bunch of hits with people looking for a solution to the same problem. This one is interesting. This thread has a link to the ECF SMOKTech forum in post #3. This thread on UKV also talks about SID issues and there is a video that may offer some help. There are more hits, these are just the ones that caught my eye and I checked into a bit.

8a31, I don't know if the short is real or that message means something else. The safest thing would of course be to not use it until it's fixed.

 

[Rickajho]

Good point. The Panasonic/Orbtronic NCR batteries can be purchased as either protected or un-protected.

The problem is that the protected NCR's I have seen - you can't even tell they are protected by physical observation. Short of stripping off the outer jacket and seeing what's under there, they don't have the more typical indicators you would expect to see on protected batteries. The negative base of them looks perfectly "normal" compared to the unprotected version.

I know the OP said they bought the unprotected version but this is sounding like protection behavior in an APV that doesn't like protection circuits.

 

[Ryedan]

As you sure the problematic batteries are unprotected? The flaky behavior is sounding more and more like what I would expect with protected batteries behaving badly in a VAMO or even an eVic if a protection circuit starts flaking out.

The only way you will get any satisfaction out of this - and an answer - is to get at least one other battery in there that isn't one of those NCR's and see what you get.

Good point. The Panasonic/Orbtronic NCR batteries can be purchased as either protected or un-protected.

The PF's are 10A max. Even if they had protection way lower than that the SID is limited to 4A and it's cutting out at high battery voltages. Unless the chip was not working right. Still, a lot of people have the same problem and AFAIK it's the SID most of the time.

Still, if it is a battery issue, that would answer why battery #1 is different.

 

[Ryedan]

The problem is that the protected NCR's I have seen - you can't even tell they are protected by physical observation. Short of stripping off the outer jacket and seeing what's under there, they don't have the more typical indicators you would expect to see on protected batteries. The negative base of them looks perfectly "normal" compared to the unprotected version.

Wouldn't the cell length be longer? Typical unprotected are I believe very close to 65mm.

I know the OP said they bought the unprotected version but this is sounding like protection behavior in an APV that doesn't like protection circuits.

Is it that the protection causes some kind of interference with the mod Rick? I always thought the issue was the battery protection tripping.

 

[Rickajho]

Wouldn't the cell length be longer? Typical unprotected are I believe very close to 65mm.

I would have to go look up the specs on them again. As I recall they were made in two different lengths, one being specifically shorter for manufacturers building protection circuits onto individual cells. The unprotected length was meant for battery packs with a separate charge and protection circuit for the entire pack.

Is it that the protection causes some kind of interference with the mod Rick? I always thought the issue was the battery protection tripping.

Roughly speaking, there is a lot of circuitry in those things - more than you may think. If a PV starts dropping voltage below the 3.2 low voltage cutoff when pulling current - you have problems. Then at rest - ta da! - the voltage is back up at 3.4 volts or higher again. There can be max. current drain cutoffs in there as well. See here for some info: The Anatomy of a Protected Battery

 

[Ryedan]

Good stuff, thanks Rick

 

[ImThatGuy]

Hmmm...no one has asked if there was anything wrong with the kayfun or connection...we all know what "short" means...

 

[Rickajho]

Hmmm...no one has asked if there was anything wrong with the kayfun or connection...we all know what "short" means...

I did back there somewhere but it kinda got dismissed by the OP as a source of a problem.

 

[Stosh]

Hmmm...no one has asked if there was anything wrong with the kayfun or connection...we all know what "short" means...

His toppers work perfectly well and normally with one of his batteries, not the other two.

 

[8a31]

Thanks for all of the posts, I havent taken any readings in the last day or so because I have been preoccupied with a sick child.

The Panasonic/Orbtronic NCR batteries can be purchased as either protected or un-protected.

While I cant look at them and tell, I did order only the unprotected version. In fact I asked about that here prior to buying them just to make sure.

Hmmm...no one has asked if there was anything wrong with the kayfun or connection...we all know what "short" means...

I dont think this is the issue. I have tried 3 different attys now with similar results. When I first load the atty i always push the stty's pin fully and get 9.9 OHM and slowly back it out until I make a connection. I do this because I killed an MVP by over tightening and if it wasnt for a loaner ecig from a friend I was afraid I would revert back to my old smoking habit. so Im real careful.

This thread on UKV also talks about SID issues and there is a video that may offer some help.

I havent been able to watch the entire video yet but I did see something interesting that may or may not be important. In the video they show the button on the bottom of the unit that makes contact with the positive button top of the battery. The one in the video is silver and looks like it is just a hair longer than mine (but there is no way to tell).

I am going to try to post some pics if I can get them to load on here.

 

[8a31]

Here are the pics





battery 1 was marked by me on the wrong side which is why you dont see the stamp at the bottom.

 

[8a31]

Well to update, I finally figured out the problem by accident. I took the unit apart and the white spacer around the positive connection of the unit fell out. so it was not seated far enough to allow the battery to make proper contact on the positive contact. I re seated the spacer and it has worked great ever since. That leads me to believe there is a millimeter or two difference in the length of each battery. that would explain why each battery had a different contact.

Thanks for all of the help I greatly appreciate it.

In the meantime I bought a Provari V2 so now I have 2 good PV's. I found out the NCR18650PF do not work in the Provari though.

 

[Baditude]

In the meantime I bought a Provari V2 so now I have 2 good PV's. I found out the NCR18650PF do not work in the Provari though.

Are they flat top batteries? Only button top batteries work in the Provari.

I know other people who have successfully used Panasonic unprotected NCR18650PF batteries in their Provari, but they are the button top variety.

Of course, everyone knows that Provape recommends using only AW IMR batteries in the Provari.

 

[8a31]

The Panasonic are called flat top but look like button top (as you can see in pic #2 above). I bought 1 efest imr18650 2000MAH just to get it to work until I can get something better. The tops look the same to me but there must be a difference. I plan to get a few new batteries but I want the longest lasting quality batteries for the provari. I know AW is recommended but Iv read mixed reviews. What do you think Baditude? By the way You are local to me do you work at a vape shop? I ask because you have been so helpful and if so I would like to give you my business and send others to you.

 

[Ryedan]

Well to update, I finally figured out the problem by accident. I took the unit apart and the white spacer around the positive connection of the unit fell out. so it was not seated far enough to allow the battery to make proper contact on the positive contact. I re seated the spacer and it has worked great ever since. That leads me to believe there is a millimeter or two difference in the length of each battery. that would explain why each battery had a different contact.

Good to hear you figured it out!

I've held a few production engineering positions over the years and I can tell you from experience that some of the hardest problems to solve are the really, really simple ones . Having multiple issues at the same time is also fun. Knowing which direction to go in is priceless, but doesn't always happen, LOL.

 

[8a31]

Knowing which direction to go in is priceless, but doesn't always happen, LOL.

I agree. it seems that others have had this same issue so im sure it is or was a QC issue. I am not knocking the unit or the brand because it seems to be a workhorse now. Everything looked fine but I have come to figure out the tiniest little bit can make the difference of a device working or not.