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To agree with @Baditude location location location
BT sells basically all its e-cig stuff out of bodegas/gas stations. Really low quality really expensive. Also though, the FDA banned sales of flavored ecigs out of bodegas/gas stations over a year ago. Nationally. What this means is that a “flavor ban” affects almost entirely ONLY B&M shops. The places that kids can’t get ecigs to begin with.
To be fair, B&M shops are pretty low overhead. They sprung up quite quickly and if destroyed would probably do it again. Same with online.
A flavor ban will affect all US Brick & Mortar shops and also US online shops.
Many kids nowadays have their own credit cards to order online; they can lie how old they are with most of them. They always seem to know of an adult who will buy vapes for them, too. They usually know of an adult in the community that will buy vapes for them. That's what we did when we wanted beer or Boones Farm when I was a teen.
Have you worked in a vape shop? I have. The overhead is tremendous, with a very small profit margin. A ban on flavors, which is what most shops depend upon for profits, would be devastating and force many shops to close. Just because shops over-charge for gear, they have to to make any money because of overhead expenses to run a business.
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Maybe the Current Hysteria that the CDC/Media has created is a Good Example.
Because Many have already commented that if the FDA had Only Allowed the Sale of e-Cigarettes that could Not be Adulterated, that the Scope of the current problem would have been Greatly Reduced. Some have even said it might Not have occurred.
Closed System e-Cigarettes also (for the Most part) alleviate Another Problem in the eye's of the FDA. And that is having to Control Bulk and Bottled e-Liquids. Both in the wholesale/Retail Market. But also on the Black Market.
If Nothing can be Sold that can be Refilled, then you're Not Going to run into much of a Legal or Congressional Challenge when you Outlaw the Sale of Bulk/Bottled e-Liquids.
And then there is the Administrative side.
If you were the FDA, would You want to Regulate/Policy/Collect Taxes from Tens of Thousands of Wholesalers, Distributors, Companies? Or would you Rather deal with 3 or 4?
PM profit margin is 26.6% as common cig,,, they could easily double that selling eliquid for their juul/pod systems
PM Philip Morris International Inc. Stock Quote
Honestly, I don't know where you get the info you come up with .. ever been to a Walmart .. ??
Does Walmart Sell Electronic Cigarettes? Absolutely!
Or Sam's Club .. ??
https://www.samsclub.com/p/juul-cl-...2770258?xid=pdp_carousel_rich-relevance.rr0_2
Any closed system atomizer can be refilled. It may not be easy, but it can.
The popular Juul pods are a closed system. Many adult Juul users on this forum found a way to refill them. You think a kid couldn't figure it out, too?
I've read that many of the kids' vapes come from ordering online at EBay and Amazon, supposively businesses who have policies restricting e-cigarette sales.
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When I type me Zip Code into this page...
Retail Locator
... I basically get a Ton of 7-11's, some General Retail Stores, and a handful of e-Cigarette B&M's.
I have 2 JUUL's .. they are easy to refill .. plenty of YouTubes on that ..
(They are not my main vape, but if I'm out and about, they are handy .. and yes, they do pack a real head rush ..)
I even bought empty pods so my husband could have a few back ups,,, but he switched over mosty to Zero brand,, easy charge with his phone charging cord micro USB
ah. That’s where the disagreement lies. It’s all relative. “Low overhead” as I was thinking of it generally means under a few million dollars. Yes they would fail fast. Very possibly extremely fast. Most small businesses are radically undercapitalized. Juices are basically the only thing that keeps them open and that only barely. Basically any leased storefront shop including almost any restaurant would be considered “low overhead”. They’re not exactly building a battery megafactory or something. Such businesses generally rent their space, are classed as “small businesses”, having less than 130 workers? I forget. They’re likely to be a tenth of that. Less than a million dollars of equipment. Bigger than, say, a small gutter cleaning service, but the average plumbing company is usually larger. There should really be a separate classification: “tiny business” or something.
My point is in a few years they would sprout again. They aren’t Tesla, or even a medium sized family farm.
The vast majority of vapes shops are small Mom and Pop businesses, lucky to have over 3 employees.
The shop I worked for would be considered "big". Maybe 10 part time employees, but it was the owner's first and flagship store. The owner was able to expand to having 11 shops in fours states, which are much smaller with smaller staffs. However, a flavor ban will most likely force him to close all his shops.
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More than restricted. They’re completely banned specifically because they don’t Check ages. They don’t seem to care much though. The standard path to control of such things would be lawsuits by angry parents but lawsuits in the USA have been detoothed far beyond their ability to do the job they are relied upon by our system to do. Nowadays big companies just break the law and simply ignore the human cost of their actions because it’s more profitable that way.
eBay COULD solve this problem but they don’t bother because it’s too much trouble, and they’re too big to be moved. They save more in personnel costs than they spend on lawsuits so why should they?
And that is one reason why we have a "youth vaping epidemic".
not if I can help it anymore. A few times. Less than 10.
Super depressing. target generally has stuff for basically the same price except it doesn’t smell funny. What’s with those blue smocks anyway?. They never even remotely fit and they tend to be half on, half off, or they’re tied on sideways or something. It feels like a concentration camp in there. Or maybe the zombie apocalypse.
. None in my area. Aren’t they owned by the same company?
Ah. JUUL. So they sell gas station stuff then.
The contaminated THC cartridges sold were purportedly "closed system" as the end user was not supposed to be able to reuse those cartridges.
I have had chipped ink jet cartridges refilled. The chips can be reset, the printer can be reset to accept the cartridge, or you can replace the chip yourself. You can buy empty inkjet cartridges with chips to fill yourself on eBay.
Keurig attempted to set up a code system to prevent refillable pods that was easily defeated.
Just as those THC cartridges came prefilled, no closed system can be considered secure from refill or tampering.
When Deeming first came up I remember reading this comment many times. Maybe from you. With the really complex expensive application process it looked like they were planning to thin out the herd.
Didn't someone in leadership in the FDA back then specifically say they were expecting only a small number of manufacturers to make it through the application process?
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