Charging at 2 or 4.1 amps?

[BillW50]

I totally agree Zaryk. I too have plenty of batteries and so time isn't really an issue. But there are times when I don't have the time to babysit charging cells for 2 to 8 hours. As I have other stuff to do too. So now I resort to faster charging which greatly cuts down my charging babysitting time.

 

[BillW50]

That's true Punk In Drublic. But the problem with a controlled environment is that it isn't realistic at all. We don't care what happens in a controlled environment. All we care about what happens in actual conditions with your mod.

 

[Punk In Drublic]

@BillW50 - Logical post! To some time is more of a value than the life span of a pretty inexpensive battery. Just as long as one is charging to within the batteries limits.

 

[Punk In Drublic]

That's true Punk In Drublic. But the problem with a controlled environment is that it isn't realistic at all. We don't care what happens in a controlled environment. All we care about what happens in actual conditions with your mod.

I understand that but the point of my post is I can’t use your findings as a reference to determine my battery life for both are performed under different conditions. Preforming tests in a controlled environment gives us a base line in which we can reference. If charging at 4amps reduces a batteries life by half vs 2amps under a controlled environment, I now have a benchmark.

 

[BillW50]

Yes Punk In Drublic, but by the same token I can't use test from a controlled environment either. As normally they use ideal conditions for one. Do they test this where the temperature can often be -10°F? There are people charging cells in a very hot environment too. Are they also doing this in a controlled environment?

I love it when they test 18650s in things like electric automobiles and RC aircraft. As these are often used it some really harsh conditions and I would say our vaping would come in 3rd place for harsh conditions. And especially electric automobiles, swapping battery packs isn't generally an option and so they want to charge as quickly as possible.

RC aircraft often uses swappable cells, but we can drain them faster than we can recharge them. So we often don't like slow charging there either. Sure you can have lots of battery packs and start recharging right after discharging. But at some point you must stop flying because you just can't charge all of them fast enough.

 

[Punk In Drublic]

Again, I understand that personal experience will be different. But the point of controlled tests is to find a base line in which everything else can be compared to. Especially if there are multiple subjects. The specifications of a battery are measured in a controlled environment. Mooch’s test are performed in a controlled environment. If we are to determine the life span of a battery for the purpose of setting a base line that test/measurement must be conducted in a controlled environment.

I’ve worked on loud speaker design. The frequency response you see for a loud speaker was measured in a controlled environment. You will never obtain that exact performance outside the environment in which the speaker was tested. However, with that specification you have an idea on how that loud speaker will perform.

 

[BillW50]

Again, I understand that personal experience will be different. But the point of controlled tests is to find a base line in which everything else can be compared to. Especially if there are multiple subjects. The specifications of a battery are measured in a controlled environment. Mooch’s test are performed in a controlled environment. If we are to determine the life span of a battery for the purpose of setting a base line that test/measurement must be conducted in a controlled environment.

Yeah but most of the time, it is done by scientists, lab techs, or somebody that has no experience with vaping whatsoever. How does this help any of us? They do stupid things like turning up the heat of e-liquid to like frigging 900°F and then claim how bad vaping is. If the controlled environment is different than actual, it is meaningless.

I’ve worked on loud speaker design. The frequency response you see for a loud speaker was measured in a controlled environment. You will never obtain that exact performance outside the environment in which the speaker was tested. However, with that specification you have an idea on how that loud speaker will perform.

Oh I love your loud speaker example. Because in my younger days I was so picky about loud speakers and headphones. But back then I could hear 16hz to 22khz. Now I can barely hear 30hz to 11khz and I am not so picky anymore.

But yes, some environments reflected sounds better (which maybe good or bad). Some also absorbed sounds better (which maybe good or bad). And then you have the endless combination of both. Plus the listener placement is a huge importance and coupled with the listener's hearing capability. Lots of variables here to ever do under a controlled environment. Both you and I know that the bottom line is not what it does in the lab, but what it does in the environment that it is going to be used in.

Granted and I really do concede, if you pick the worst loud speaker that did the worst under a controlled environment, it probably won't do well in any realistic condition either. You have to start with something that can do what you wanted it to do in the first place. You can't take a loud speaker that does well at 500hz to say 3khz and expect it will produce perfect 20hz to 20khz in the environment that you want to use it in.

 

[Mooch]

Apparently it isn't as bad as most people believed.

Recharging Lithium-Ion Batteries Rapidly Not So Harmful After All

I believe that article only says that by tweaking the electrode material could this benefit be seen. It’s all still in the lab/research phase yet.

I’ve seen definite decreases in cycle life when charging at 3A vs 1.5A for several cells rated
at 4A or so for a “rapid” charge. It’s probably quite cell or chemistry specific.