Cigarette taxes and the American government.

[Steam Turbine]

I was just wondering something after reading some of the posts in the "A Marlboro rep came to my job" thread.

Since a pack of smoke in the states can be anywhere from 4$ to 13$. and we all know that most of that money goes to the government thru taxes.

What do you think the American gov thinks about e cig? My guess is that they don't want to see them in the picture at all or if they do they want some of that money.... a lot of that money. How do you think that will play out?

 

[stevegmu]

Of course they want to tax e-nic. I only hope they don't think a disposable really equals 2 packs of cigarettes and tax e-liquid based on that formula. If that is the case, a 30ml bottle could well be taxed at $ several hundred.

 

[Steam Turbine]

deleted because no longer apply

 

[stevegmu]

One thing that happened when the Obama cigarette tax passed, is that the tobacco companies also raised their prices at the same time. Many thought the taxes were far higher than they were because the sudden increase in price, but the tobacco companies realized fewer people would be smoking due to the increased cost, so figured out how much to raise the price and time it with the increased tax. Quite brilliant, actually. People blamed the tax on the higher cost, not knowing the manufacturers also raised their prices at the same time.

 

[Glen Snyder]

One thing that happened when the Obama cigarette tax passed, is that the tobacco companies also raised their prices at the same time. Many thought the taxes were far higher than they were because the sudden increase in price, but the tobacco companies realized fewer people would be smoking due to the increased cost, so figured out how much to raise the price and time it with the increased tax. Quite brilliant, actually. People blamed the tax on the higher cost, not knowing the manufacturers also raised their prices at the same time.

That's the problem with the tax and spenders. They put on their magic show for the public that eats it up. Issue is that the ultimate consumer always foots the bill whether it's tobacco or gasoline.

 

[bacc.vap]

The government justifies the tax as a sin tax because of cigs being bad and causing health problems and costs, but they don't really use alot of the money on what they said they would. I think they have been caught a little off guard at the popularity of ecigs and are now trying to paint ecigs in a bad light to justify high taxes on them also, those are'nt the only factors at play, but it's typical government corruption.

 

[Myrany]

/me looks at the state she lives in and thinks to herself "Tell me about government corruption"

I don't like it and groups like CASAA are going to fight it tooth and nail, but it is coming. One way or another the government is GOING to get their pound of flesh out of vapers. Current national debt levels virtually FORCE them to find every tax they possibly can, though in truth they would do it anyway.

The sad part is that because of the bad propaganda out there the American people will behave towards the issue exactly like they do taxes on analogs. Good tax those people they shouldn't be doing that anyways. It lets them pretend to be holier than thou while sticking it to someone else.

As long as the population by and large looks at vaping as the same thing as smoking that is what we get to deal with. I saw a commercial last night for Fin e-cigs last night and really wanted to throw something. It was all about remember when we could smoke everywhere and no one thought twice about it, well you can again. NO that just plays into the hands of those that want to make vapers the same pariahs as smokers. GROWL

 

[jazon1]

if the government cared about peoples health (like obama pretends to with obamacare) then they wouldn't tax vaping at all,but we all know
our current government has one interest...money, so its likely at some point soon with the loss of revenue from smokers quitting they will tax the crap out of vaping to make up for it.

 

[DC2]

There is no doubt the government is going to WANT and NEED to make up the tax shortfall at some point.
They should get it from taxing sodas, fast food, and other unhealthy crap.

They will make a HELL of a lot more money from that than from taxing us.

This is not the solution I want, but I don't see the sheeple standing up to fix what really needs fixing at this point.

So if they want their money, let the rest of America deal with what we've dealt with for so long.
Let them start footing the bill for a change, and see how they like it.

Maybe then we might get the people to wake up and make some real changes.

 

[gully]

In my country the current tax take from smokers and Tobacco industry covers the whole health budget.

 

[Steam Turbine]

In my country the current tax take from smokers and Tobacco industry covers the whole health budget.

And the smokers that get sick from cigarettes probably cost your health care system all of those taxes.... So whats the point?

 

[gully]

The smokers pay for everyone's health care is my point.

 

[stevegmu]

The smokers pay for everyone's health care is my point.

What's going to happen as more and more people quit smoking? At some point, that revenue stream will shrink to where that is no longer sustainable. Maybe the taxes on e-cigarettes will pay for healthcare?

 

[bacc.vap]

What's going to happen as more and more people quit smoking? At some point, that revenue stream will shrink to where that is no longer sustainable. Maybe the taxes on e-cigarettes will pay for healthcare?

Sure, cig sin taxes are already paying for some of non smokers health care in the US, and like gully said, in NZ it's paying total health care costs for everyone, smokers and non smokers. Governments don't want to give up this huge cash cow they've conditioned the public to think is just. The easiest thing they can do is condition the public to transition the cig hate over to ecigs so they can continue with the sin taxes. The only other options they have is to start conditioning people to accept sin taxes
on other things which a higher percentage of people indulge in, and they're going to have a harder time with that. They're holding off on that right now, but rest assured they are working on it.

 

[house mouse]

The easiest thing they can do is condition the public to transition the cig hate over to ecigs so they can continue with the sin taxes. The only other options they have is to start conditioning people to accept sin taxes
on other things which a higher percentage of people indulge in, and they're going to have a harder time with that. They're holding off on that right now, but rest assured they are working on it.

I'm just cynical enough to believe that there are citizens out there that push for higher taxes on cigarettes and that will also push for taxes on e-cigarettes, not for any health related reasons(although they'll hide behind that),but just to keep the government from digging any more out of their pocket. Folks aren't stupid. They know that if cigarette tax revenue falls enough the government will be looking at everybody else to make up the shortfall.

 

[SpinDr480]

A lot of the taxes imposed on cigarettes are local/state taxes...It's been a great source of revenue for things like schools, roads and other state/local programs . It's why a pack of smokes in AZ is around $7.50 and the same pack is $5.25 in Colorado. It's misleading way for members of both parties to say, we didn't raise taxes on people while maintaining the social programs people would complain about if they cut. Plus they can rally around the misleading claim that they are doing it all in the name of promoting good health.

The big problem with this approach is that state/local governments actually needs smokers now to fund the programs. They claim they want everyone to stop smoking but if everyone stopped there coffers would be empty. So if revenue from smoking continues to decrease, they will simply look for another "vice" to tax. In the future, I see taxes imposed on eCigs to make up for the loss revenue as well as alcohol, sugary drinks, fast food or anything they want to deem as bad (yet secretly need people to do). The only industry arguing that they would like to be taxed is the mary jane industry. I say go ahead and legalize it and let them foot the bill for a while.

 

[Coastal Cowboy]

The smokers pay for everyone's health care is my point.

What an incredibly short-sighted model. Sooner or later, the smokers are going to decide that paying the extra price in taxes just isn't worth it anymore, and either move to a more smoke-friendly country, quit, or find some other way to get the nicotine they crave. Then who pays for everyone's health care?

My God, does the entire world think that everything should be free to them?

When do I get my free cell phone and free cell service? Is free internet service a right, too?

Shouldn't I have a free car, free gas and free beer?

I'm going to Home Depot right now, and I'm demanding a free A/C unit for my upstairs office. It's too warm up there and by God, I have a right to be comfortable in my own home. Don't I?