Competition for unethical kiosks. Opinions needed!

[LastoftheBreed]

I'm a recent "PV convert", having gotten started with one of the over-priced "mall kiosk" models. I was luckier than some in that mine is essentially an over-priced, re-branded Kr808 that works, if not good, well enough to get me off analogs for a month and counting. After finding this forum and doing much research I have ordered my Ego clone with all the bells and whistles (complete set-up for tank, cart, carto, AND dripping, for less cost than my original purchase, ugh!), and am waiting patiently (yeah right) for my newer, better, highly recommended PV to get here. (Come on Mr. FedEx!)

That being said. I am also an entrepreneur at heart, and was wondering what some dedicated PV users' opinions were on how well an actual reputable dealer for these products would do in competition at a mall setting? Or maybe even an actual store-front.

I know for many people (smokers) out there, a major turn-off about switching to a PV is the very act of ordering online. Many 45+ people are just too ingrained in thinking they want a FACE to talk to, a PLACE to go to buy their wares...many "old-timers" are just not that computer savvy to be blunt. Then of course their only experience with PVs is the kiosk guy selling $20 crap units for $100 - $150, no education on the product to speak of, and they quit working after 2 weeks..."what a waste of money, I'll stick with smokes *hack hack*" - right? Not to mention the PV user that realizes that he forgot to order some new attys and just burned his last...ON FRIDAY NIGHT...talk about post-man stalking LOL! How WOULD you like a store in town you could run to for your stuff in a pinch?

Thinking of opening a mall kiosk locally (just to get started, I have visions of PV lounges/stores with good coffee and books running in my head), just to see : 1. If I can put the unscrupulous vendors out of business and better products out there in an un-informed population; and 2. If it's a viable route to bigger and better things for myself and my community.

Looking for opinions, thoughts, ideas, and maybe suggestions of vendors or contacts who may be interested?

 

[STLDiceDealer]

I, too, would love to do something like that. My first experience with a PV was from a mall kiosk and it was an absolute joke, I hated it. Had I known about ECF, I could've been analog free for over a year now!!! I would DREAM of a place in the mall that had Volcano, Joye, ProVari, hardware, and carried a bunch of e-liquids and what not. I truly think it could be SUCH a success with the right attention given to it!!! If I had the startup capital I would ABSOLUTELY do it, without question.

 

[wevie]

I envision small supplies - maybe even vending machine type dispensers - in bars.

I'm not a bar person myself, but my wife is a karaoke nut. Her one night out so far with her PV and she was overwhelmed by questions as she vaped away while smokers had to stand out in the cold.

 

[Free2BeMe]

I think its a great idea. With the overpriced units in the mall I think that is a turn off to people. If you sold the units for what they really should be priced people would be more open to buying it I think.

There is a smoke shop that sells e-cigs here and they are way overpriced. The carts cost 14.99 for just 4. Are you serious?! I asked the salesperson do they sale the juice that comes in them? She looked at me like I had two heads. I just said nevermind. I knew she had no clue.

It would be wonderful to have a place that I could walk into and view different brands and actually pick out a juice and bring it home that day instead of waiting for the mailman and paying for shipping and the whole nine yards.

I think it is a GREAT idea! If you can do it I would go for it.

 

[STLDiceDealer]

I would love to have a large selection of juices, and tester bottles so people could try out the different flavors in their PV to see what they like best. It kind of sucks to have to guess and check continually when it comes to new juice.

 

[Kufu Kahn]

As a computer savvy "old-timer" I find your youthful enthusiasm and bravado cute.

Is the political climate ripe for ecig businesses in Oregon? Seems like there has been some recent issues along those lines that might make it rough going. I would love to see more more public exposure for this industry and participants.

Welcome and good luck to you.

 

[MrHyde]

The only problem with opening up a mall kiosk is the outragious rent you'd have to pay for one. We have one such kiosk in our mall here (small mall too) and they get charged $500 a week for their stall. So that, along with super high mark-ups is another reason why they charge so much.

That said, I have access to another vendor in town that operates out of a flea market who sells Vapor4Life stuff. Since he gets a good deal from V4L (20% - 25% off, depending on amount ordered) he has a very low markup. I went in there just a few days ago, being out of my favorite juice, and got some of the same juice I normally try to keep stocked from the Vapor4Life website and was only charged $16 for a 30ml bottle of juice that is normally $12.50. So after shipping, I'd break about even.

The people in the mall Kiosk usually charge anywhere from $25 to $35 for the same sized bottle of juice of usually a lower quality.

So, I might not suggest trying do the mall kiosk thing, as you'll still have to charge a bit more because of the high rental cost. Perhaps you could find a cheaper solution.

 

[STLDiceDealer]

I wonder what the SBA would think in regards to financing such a venture though

 

[PoliticallyIncorrect]

My understanding is that lease rates on kiosk spaces are exorbitant, and a large part of their price equation. I'm not privy to any of their accounting logs, but it's reasonable to expect a kit bought from one to cost more.

But $150 for a $30 KR808D-1 kit? I'm forced to imagine that at some point operating expenses and justifiable profit expectations handed the baton over to naked greed.

Go for it, dude. As it stands, the kiosk element of the vaping industry is a black eye none of us needs.

 

[vapi]

Looking for opinions, thoughts, ideas, and maybe suggestions of vendors or contacts who may be interested?

I wouldn't sell too much liquid, I think the mass produced stuff taste horrible. Maybe a couple basic flavors like cherry, vanilla, menthol and tobacco. But I would have some business cards from reputable juice vendors and info about what to expect with more or less vg and pg. Juice is going to be the most challenging aspect in the transformation for a new vaper.

 

[Bootsand]

Go for it, man.

One risk to consider is the FDA seizures at the moment... several good small companies have been put in the ground from 1-2 large seizures. Losing 2K worth of goods can hurt.

Other than that, go for it! Sounds like you have some great location ideas in mind. I, for one, would absolutely LOVE a vape lounge of sorts. Somewhere to chill, talk about new products, etc. That would be AWESOME.

 

[Nomoreash]

I think you'll start to see more and more of this type of thing from reputable suppliers. The state of the FDA lurking at every corner to shut the industry down on a whim and the start up cost and the price of rental space in a setting like a mall is likely the main reason they haven't done it and we're left with those trying to make a quick buck by charging inflated prices on often inferior equipment.

A few reputable vendors have already opened up sales in store and lounges in a few places. I suspect we'll start to see more and more of this as time goes on.

Until then buyers need to beware and do research and thanks to ECF it's possible for anyone who chooses to do so.

 

[Para]

I would advise caution....and do a LOT of homework before jumping into this venture. Unless you have experience running a business, this is one that will cause you to go broke before you know it. Example: Don't put in the right systems and your employee(s) will steal you blind. Even with the best systems, you'll experience shrinkage and that will have to be factored into your pricing model. Don't forget all the usual expenses that go with any business such as insurance. You will be sued so make sure you have the right insurance.

I've got 30 years owning and running businesses and I won't open up what you describe; but that's just me.

 

[JamesGang]

I don't have any problem with mall kiosks nor do I think they are unethical, although I never bought their product I was offered a chance to try it. I understand and like somebody else pointed out their overhead is large and e-cig technology is still relatively new.

Without the kiosks at the mall, I probably wouldn't have paid much attention to e-cigs.

I bet they're not a bad option for some people. Less of an option for serious e-cig users.

Is there a larger market to be tapped? Yep. Las Vegas or LA would be a great place to start. I suspect some locations will be less lucrative.

 

[Caddyman]

its a good idea, i tried the same, and got shot down by the mall cause "there was already a ecig kiosk"....they actually said that.

 

[annietc]

As a computer savvy "old-timer" I find your youthful enthusiasm and bravado cute.

ROFL!!!

 

[Big Sheepherder]

There are relatively few successful shops that sell only cigarettes. Were you to open a real store, it likely would require far more diversity in product than e-cigs and their accessories. Unless you have substantial capitalization, and reserves, you'd likely be broke for a very long time.

 

[AlmightyGod]

My local vape shop keeps very busy.
I've hung around to chit chat a few times, & there is a constant stream of customers coming in the door. In fact, he is remodeling, so he can better showcase his products. He certainly isn't going broke.

 

[LastoftheBreed]

As a computer savvy "old-timer" I find your youthful enthusiasm and bravado cute.

Is the political climate ripe for ecig businesses in Oregon? Seems like there has been some recent issues along those lines that might make it rough going. I would love to see more more public exposure for this industry and participants.

Welcome and good luck to you.

Lol, no offense intended. I'm not far from being an "old-timer" myself, which is why I have contact with so many of the "not so savvy" percentage of the population.

The political climate in Oregon IS a bit touchy right now, but the area I'm looking at right now is actually in Washington State, which oddly seems to be promoting the technology.

For those of you expressing concern about my "jumping in" I appreciate your cautions. I NEVER jump into anything financial. venture capitalists who do, don't remain venture capitalists for long. I'm in the early, early EARLY stages of examining this option. I have a few other irons in the fire that have to be pulled, branded, and put in the bucket before this idea could be acted on regardless. Just seeking input from veteran and dedicated users at the moment.

 

[LastoftheBreed]

My local vape shop keeps very busy.
I've hung around to chit chat a few times, & there is a constant stream of customers coming in the door. In fact, he is remodeling, so he can better showcase his products. He certainly isn't going broke.

Where are you located if I might ask?