Dear don...an artist should be respected......

[mb300sd]

This is not Walmart! You can sell your art to whomever you desire. I applaud you for your all consuming effort to be fair and to treat your loyal fans fairly. You DO NOT HAVE TO SELL TO ANYONE YOU DON'T WANT TO. I'm sure the walmart police will have me arrested, but I have done too much selling at art shows and the like to know that I don't have to be forced to sell to someone i do not want to have my wares. too bad so sad go somewhere else and get your shi....


sandy

 

[Dkrom68]

Thanks MB I appreciate it.

 

[Butch]

Don, I'm a fairly new customer, so this may not mean a whole lot but I've been around a few months, & seen what your following is like. I ran a business of my own for 15 years. Let me say that no one & I mean no one could do it better. You put out a wonderful product at very reasonable prices. Then on top of that you go to great extremes to make sure that everybody gets the stuff that is scarce because of limited supplies.. Don't let one really dumb bad apple ruin a wonderful thing. You sir have my respect & my business.

 

[Dirty]

Don, I'm a fairly new customer, so this may not mean a whole lot but I've been around a few months, & seen what your following is like. I ran a business of my own for 15 years. Let me say that no one & I mean no one could do it better. You put out a wonderful product at very reasonable prices. Then on top of that you go to great extremes to make sure that everybody gets the stuff that is scarce because of limited supplies.. Don't let one really dumb bad apple ruin a wonderful thing. You sir have my respect & my business.

+1
(minus the running a business for 15 years part, can't say I've done that recently

 

[passerbyeus]

I have to disagree with all of this. Backwoods Brew is a open site and not just for club members or is it? and to say he can sell to who ever he wants is selfish and the worst business practice I have ever heard of. Yes it is your right to do as you please with YOUR business and more than likely you have enough fans to keep food on your table. I am not sure of your profit but I do know that you have been in business since I started vaping two years ago and I am certain you are not going hungry. The thing is with mom and pop shops if you have something everyone likes the business can not keep up with the demand so to fix it that being stubborn and only offering things to people that are really in the CLUB because they are the first to know is the solution. Really after years of doing the same thing don't you think a change is needed and offer what people really want instead of just holding it down for ECF member's or anyone lucky enough to just show up on your site? The ecig business just still has not gone main stream yet and that may be a good thing but I would love to see one of these mom and pop shops just blow it out of the water and step up.

 

[Dkrom68]

Hey Passerbyeus, It is a matter of limited flavoring availability and the fact that I post on Facebook, Newsletters, the front page of my web site as well as on here I think I have done as much as I can. If it was something I could get all the time it wouldnt be a problem but the fact remains I cant get unlimited quantities and rather than deal with all the grief and aggrivation associated with it and having fighting and arguing and all that Its easier to just do away with it. While I respect your opinion I disagree with you because not knowing all the facts behind something really hinders what you know about it.

I also show no favoritism of who gets it and its not a club on here. I treat all the way I would like to be until I get treated wrong then I do have the right to refuse orders from people in that regard as I have seen many other suppliers do the same thing.

 

[Ruppy]

I have to disagree with all of this. Backwoods Brew is a open site and not just for club members or is it? and to say he can sell to who ever he wants is selfish and the worst business practice I have ever heard of. Yes it is your right to do as you please with YOUR business and more than likely you have enough fans to keep food on your table. I am not sure of your profit but I do know that you have been in business since I started vaping two years ago and I am certain you are not going hungry. The thing is with mom and pop shops if you have something everyone likes the business can not keep up with the demand so to fix it that being stubborn and only offering things to people that are really in the CLUB because they are the first to know is the solution. Really after years of doing the same thing don't you think a change is needed and offer what people really want instead of just holding it down for ECF member's or anyone lucky enough to just show up on your site? The Ecig business just still has not gone main stream yet and that may be a good thing but I would love to see one of these mom and pop shops just blow it out of the water and step up.

Nah PB your missing the big picture here....

The common belief that "the customer is always right" is a myth. From the beginning of time people have been buying or selling things in one form or another. Any way that you look at it, its a barter system. Just now instead of trading chickens for something were trading paper. A trade (sale) has always been about both parties getting something and walking away (usually) satisfied. In this process a required amount of thought, civility, and action on the part of the buyer and seller is expected. When the buyer or seller step out of line EITHER party has the right to cancel their trade (sale). I like to think of it as the thing formerly known as freedom.

I run a food establishment. If someone comes in throwing a fit.... Acting like a fool... ranting and raving because they cant read a sign... Im going to throw them out. They are not going to get fed. In some cases I may never let them eat there again. If I put a sign in my parking lot, on my door, at the counter, and on every table I have a reasonable expectation my customer will see it. The situation in question is no different. People could not follow the rules and were asked to leave (in a sense) The notices were in 5 places.

Grant it I am a big fan of BWB... Don has always been very good to me. But I am also a business operator. Nothing gets me more than customers that think they are entitled. They are entitled to a service not to treat me like ****

Anyway no disrespect Passer just wanted to voice that.

 

[Ladypixel]

I ran a retail business which handled a lot of custom orders (usually for leatherwork and/or custom Native American beadwork) for fifteen years.

Don, from the perspective of a long-term fellow businessperson, I salute you. What you did today is fair. There will be a lot of people who won't like that their RY4/Ejoker is gone. You're going to take some flack for it. But at the same time, when the required materials are not easily at hand, and you've tried incredibly hard to keep people happy, there comes a point at which you have to simply say "enough". And I think this is, in fact, enough.

I'm sorry people gave you crap over it. For me, I ordered one 15ml bottle of each, just to indulge the curiosity and leave the rest to the people who were desperate for those juices, and they're good. They aren't my present flavor profile, but yeah, they're good. However... even the good things have to go sometimes, sad to say.

You done good.

Now, don't you dare stop stocking Nutty. Or Dulce de Leche. Those, I'd have to lynch you for.

 

[passerbyeus]

It was not the big picture I did not see but the workings behind closed doors, and I spoke to soon and have to totally agree with his decisions.

 

[TehBilly]

Posted this on Reddit, but I'll say it again. I believe you've done this out of passion for the field, evident by your prices and your attention to your community following. If people have made it so that it's stressful and not a joy to you, by all means stop without feeling guilty! You live for your own, not others', satisfaction. This isn't some gigantic corporate entity that you're a salve-wage to, you do this because you enjoy it and you're good at it, so don't take something you love and feel the need to put yourself into a position that'll make you resent what you do.

I only had a chance to make one order of the legendary RY4, and I never once felt bitter about it. I instead felt extremely lucky when I did manage to get my hands on this rare beast I'd heard so much about! It's not your fault some people have piss-poor attitudes and can't understand that they're not being treated "unfairly" just because they didn't get what they want. I hate that entitlement bull.... attitude, pardon mah french. (For the record, I'm not speaking of anyone specifically at all, I'm just making a baseless gross generalization because that's the only reason I can come up with for someone being upset!)

That said, I hope that in some way your RY4 becomes available again somehow, even if it takes awhile and the process changes to make it happen. I've waited ~6 months to get my hands on some and foolishly only ordered a 15ml bottle! I'm now going to treat it like a box of fine cubans, heh. Is there no way you can coach someone to create this masterpiece you've made, or at least handle the time-consuming parts to help take the stress off of you? I'm not familiar with your specific process, but it makes sense to me that you should be able to find a happy medium between using quality local ingredients and offloading some of the work/stress. Then again, I'm sure you've already weighed all of these options.

In closing, I think you've made the right decision and am appreciative of all you've done. I wish I could have experienced it more!

 

[vafromnc]

Hey Don, sad to see a good juice go. I never got to try it, but I hope most of the stress issues go away with it. Good luck and good health.
P.S. Your peach is the bomb.

 

[Dkrom68]

I appreciate all the good words and responses. Believe me when I say I have tried to find a way to make it always available to no end. Its a supply issue on one of the common ingredients in both the RY4 and Ejoker that I cannot get ample supply to make it readily available. If I could I would, and by no means would have went this route. I do have more and assure everyone will have a chance to get more. I just need to release it in batches to ensure I can keep up with the orders and not have a major backlog which would never happen if it was always in stock and on a even keel of orders like the other flavors.

I have heard every aspect from, you do it cause of supply and demand to make it a sought after juice to draw a market to just down right nasty remarks. Most I take with a grain of salt but no one knows the backside of things. It would make more sense to keep it in stock at all times and not deal with the headaches associated with it and would make it so there wasnt a mad dash of orders which would also make things easier on our end. On the grand opening it took me 5 days of work to catch up on 1 and a half days orders. I pride us on getting things out in a timely manner for fresh made custom juices and feel we do a great job. It adds volumes of extra work limiting it, monitoring it, and getting the orders filled which wouldnt be the case if it was always in stock. I have many other top sellers and it is just crazy to think I would do things like that as a marketing ploy or supply and demand gas thing. Ive never raised the price on it like we get gouged on gas during holidays and such.

I believe in fairness and equality to all and never showed favoritism to anyone in regards to it. I even lost a few customers that have been there for quite some time cause I refunded their orders out of fairness to all and they just couldnt see it that way. Its sad to lose them but at the same time no one really understands the behind the scenes headaches associated with it.

I dont want a tarnished reputation for bad customer service and although I know the real stories to a few negative feedbacks recently posted as there is always 2 sides, and may have handled them better but at the same time I set a guidline of rules to follow for myself as well as everyone else and think it was a tough decision to do it that way and stick to my guns. No one knows the way people tried to exceed the limits of them better than me and I even allowed many to get more than one cause I know they as well as other family members had ordered in the past to save people on shipping. The ones that just did it without asking in a quick email are the ones I had a issue with. I dont like doing things like this and although I like the "Juice Nazi" reference I refuse to be belittled or degraded by some because they tried to circumvent the rules sneakily or with out a care in the world if anyone else got any. GREED is what I ultimately tried to regulate and it cost me some good customers but like I said, I believe in fairness and equality to all and will never show favoritism towards anyone as Im far from being a HYPOCRITICAL JUICE NAZI!!!

Dont fear, all will get more of them before it is discontinued and gone for good and hopes are to have a suitable replacement by that time as well with unlimited supply.

Im in no way making any accusations towards any one directly, the 2 negative posts on me I feel I answered them justly and have no need to respond back to them in any fashion or feel I need to explain myself. If this had been a Black Friday sale at Walmart no one would be showing that side of things if they didnt get what they wanted, they would just be the ones in the newspaper showing their true colors.

This is just my and everyone can take it for what it is. When the fun dies its not gonna be a pretty picture!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[whiskey]

Thanks for posting that Don, Maybe all can get an idea of just what its like to be YOU for a change.
Ruppy had it right as well...now lets get back to normal in here & enjoy the Forum & friendships we have all built. Keep on Vapin""

 

[Warped3k]

Just want to give a big thank you to don for all he has done for the community. Sounds like you went through a lot this past batch with the hateful comments and I am truly sorry that you had to take it. I have always known you as a straight up, honest guy from the day you started making juice. =)

 

[whiskey]

Thanks Warped!! Its people like you guys that keeps Don going!!!!

 

[Ladypixel]

All I can say is that a couple days ago, I made an order. It was processed that same day, shipped that same day, and arrived here today, having traveled across the country to get here. Anyone who can provide such near-instant gratification is doing it right, no matter what a couple nitpickers might say.

 

[manifestgtr]

if I've learned anything from all this it's one thing:

thank god I never tried ry4...I tried my buddy's ejoker once like a year ago but it was just too tough to get ahold of so I figured I'd stick with the less elusive juices

I'm on dons side with all this...I'm an independent contractor and if I feel abused or mistreated irreparably by someone or have an impossible situation on my hands, fortunately I'm lucky enough to be able to step back and say this isn't worth the effort...sometimes doing so can be a really tough decision but everyone needs their sleep, man

life goes on (mostly because nutty is still around)