Diacetyl in all custard flavors?

[thegreatappreciator]

Question is in the topic. I ask because I was told this by a fairly large Internet e liquid vendor. I asked why this particular vendor doesn't offer dessert or custard Vapes, to which they responded "We can't mix custard flavors a without Diacetyl being present in them"......is this true? Sounds a bit fishy, but I'm no expert.


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[Mazinny]

Sounds about right, with a caveat. A lot of flavor houses stated replacing diacetyl with acetyl propyniol which is a related molecule almost identical to diacetyl, and according to Dr. Farsalinos identical in potential harm. They are both diketones.

I would say almost all custards have them, but a lot of other flavors do as well. A lot of caramels, butterscotch, and some other sweet and creamy stuff.

 

[thegreatappreciator]

It figures it would be in my favorites.


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[DeathBYzombieZ]

What's wrong with diabetes? I know nothing about this molecule.

 

[Mia11]

I heard that some flavoring companies are working on new formulations to replicate the taste without the use of diacetyl or AP, so that's hopeful news.

 

[Mazinny]

It figures it would be in my favorites.


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You might wanna check out this vendor, they specialize in those types of flavors and have re-formulated or reformulating their entire line-up of juices seemingly, at great cost. I haven't tried anything from them myself, and those types of flavors aren't really my thing anyway, but i give them kudos for such transparency :

Diacetyl Acetyl Propionyl

http://www.thevaporbarstore.com/blog/video-explaining-our-diacetylacetyl-propionyl-approach-/

 

[Mia11]

You might wanna check out this vendor, they specialize in those types of flavors and have re-formulated or reformulating their entire line-up of juices seemingly, at great cost. I haven't tried anything from them myself, and those types of flavors aren't really my thing anyway, but i give them kudos for such transparency :

Diacetyl Acetyl Propionyl

Video Explaining Our Diacetyl/Acetyl Propionyl Approach.

Thanks for posting this about The Vapor Bar. I just checked them out, and I commend them for the work they are doing and the initiative they are taking. I will definitely try something from them. Got it bookmarked.

 

[Zanaspus]

Well, Nicoticket offers Custard's Last stand and has tested all ingredients and assure us there is no diacetyl. What am I missing?

 

[Mazinny]

Well, Nicoticket offers Custard's Last stand and has tested all ingredients and assure us there is no diacetyl. What am I missing?

Acetyl Propyniol

 

[Soignee]

Well, Nicoticket offers Custard's Last stand and has tested all ingredients and assure us there is no diacetyl. What am I missing?

SLOW DOWN THERE COWBOY(GIRL)...

What NT says, and I quote:

" *Nicoticket LLC is committed to ensuring our "family" - past, present, and prospective - understand the inhalation risks associated with vaping specific types of flavors. All liquid containing "custard notes" from ALL VENDORS (including Nicoticket LLC) contain some combination of Diacetyl, Acetoin, and/or Acytyl Propionyl (collectively known as "diketones"). This liquid does *not* contain Diacetyl, but it *does* contain Acetoin, Acytyl Propionyl; or both. It is *impossible* to produce the "rich, creamy, decadent, full-mouth experience" in eLiquid without diketones. Such is life - everything that tastes good is bad for you. Potential users are advised that there may be reason for pause due to an absence of longitudinal research which can provide adequate guidance with regard to the relative safety of inhaling eLiquid containing diketones. As with all eLiquid regardless of the types of flavoring used, the user accepts the all liability and risk associated with vaping. THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS SAFE VAPING. Purchase and subsequent use of this product is governed by our Terms & Conditions of Use. Please review the terms before purchasing or using this product." End quote.

So Diacetyl free yes, other diketones free no.

At this time there is insufficient scientific evidence that provides relative safety information one way or the other concerning Acetoin or Acytyl Propionyl.

Currently, many flavor manufacturers are attempting utilize Butyric Acid as a replacement for Acetoin or Acytyl Propionyl (think Capella Vanilla Custard V2 or The Perfumers Apprentice Vanilla Bean Gelato or Flavor Art Vienna Cream to name only 3). Butyric Acid can be irritating to a person's respiratory system. There is equally insufficient scientific evidence that provides relative safety information one way or the other concerning Butyric Acid.

Nicoticket has placed an advisory on there website to alert potential customers to any potential risk associated with inhalation of their product.

They seem to be one of the leaders in the e-liquid industry that will actually alert their potential customers to a potential risk rather than avoiding or simply ignoring the issue.

 

[AquaLung22]

Anybody know if there's AP or any others in Big Willy's Custard? Vaping it now and it's prettyy creamy, and custardy! It claims to be 100% diacetyl free, but doesn't mention other diketones..

I'm with you Mia.... since I started vaping 2 years ago, creamy/custard/marshmallow vapes have been my go-to, only juices I can vape all day and not get sick of. The OB has been my recent new found favorite (by Suicide Bunny) - superior creamy, strong cake flavor, vanilla, custard, I think I taste a hint of Delicous cotton candy as well. The juice is soo Damn good, so complex with many layers that blend, potentiate, and synergize with each other beautifully.
....... and of course, confirmed it has some AP in it. And some diacetyl too I believe

 

[Zanaspus]

SLOW DOWN THERE COWBOY(GIRL)...

What NT says, and I quote:

" *Nicoticket LLC is committed to ensuring our "family" - past, present, and prospective - understand the inhalation risks associated with vaping specific types of flavors. All liquid containing "custard notes" from ALL VENDORS (including Nicoticket LLC) contain some combination of Diacetyl, Acetoin, and/or Acytyl Propionyl (collectively known as "diketones"). This liquid does *not* contain Diacetyl, but it *does* contain Acetoin, Acytyl Propionyl; or both. It is *impossible* to produce the "rich, creamy, decadent, full-mouth experience" in eLiquid without diketones. Such is life - everything that tastes good is bad for you. Potential users are advised that there may be reason for pause due to an absence of longitudinal research which can provide adequate guidance with regard to the relative safety of inhaling eLiquid containing diketones. As with all eLiquid regardless of the types of flavoring used, the user accepts the all liability and risk associated with vaping. THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS SAFE VAPING. Purchase and subsequent use of this product is governed by our Terms & Conditions of Use. Please review the terms before purchasing or using this product." End quote.

So Diacetyl free yes, other diketones free no.

At this time there is insufficient scientific evidence that provides relative safety information one way or the other concerning Acetoin or Acytyl Propionyl.

Currently, many flavor manufacturers are attempting utilize Butyric Acid as a replacement for Acetoin or Acytyl Propionyl (think Capella Vanilla Custard V2 or The Perfumers Apprentice Vanilla Bean Gelato or Flavor Art Vienna Cream to name only 3). Butyric Acid can be irritating to a person's respiratory system. There is equally insufficient scientific evidence that provides relative safety information one way or the other concerning Butyric Acid.

Nicoticket has placed an advisory on there website to alert potential customers to any potential risk associated with inhalation of their product.

They seem to be one of the leaders in the e-liquid industry that will actually alert their potential customers to a potential risk rather than avoiding or simply ignoring the issue.

Cowboy.

Oh well, I like custard flavors. Something's gotta kill me.

 

[Soignee]

Cowboy.

Oh well, I like custard flavors. Something's gotta kill me.

'zactly how I feel.

Per wikipedia "In a 1994 report released by five top cigarette companies, acetoin was listed as one of the 599 additives to cigarettes", so it's not like any smoker hasn't ingested this stuff before...

 

[thegreatappreciator]

It's in TONS of food and drinks too, so .... it.....I'll keep vaping what I like


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[DeathBYzombieZ]

It's in TONS of food and drinks too, so .... it.....I'll keep vaping what I like


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It's only dangerous if inhaled

 

[Stosh]

OMG...another thread on the terrible scourge of inhaled diacetyl from vaping. Read up on the actual studies done on inhaled diacetyl before you panic. If you are an ex-smoker, you used to inhale far more diacetyl everyday from smoking than you would from any other source.

First there's Dr. Farsalinos study on diacetyl in e-liquid.....Dr. Farsalinos study on diacetyl in e-liquid which found

DA and AP were found in 74.2% of the samples, with more samples containing DA. The levels found are presented in
Figures 2 and 3 The calculated median daily exposure levels were 56 μg/mL (IQR: 26-278μg/mL) for DA and
91 μg/mL (IQR: 20-432 μg/mL) for AP. They were 2-times higher than the strict NIOSH-defined safety limits (Figure 4) but 100 and 10 times lower compared to smoking respectively. Similar concentrations were found in liquid and vapor for both chemicals
(Figure 5), with a very strong correlation between the concentration in liquid and in vapor for both substances

Also of interest, there's the study comparing smoking to the industrial study which raised the exposure danger of inhaled diacetyl in the first place.

Concentrations of Diacetyl and 2,3-Pentanedione in Mainstream Cigarette Smoke: A Comparison to Workplace Exposures
http://www.cardnochemrisk.com/~chem...OT_2014/Pierce_Diacetyl_SOT_2014_Abstract.pdf

We found that diacetyl and 2,3-pentanedione exposures from cigarette smoking far exceed
occupational diacetyl exposures for most food/flavoring workers who smoke.

 

[DeathBYzombieZ]

^^ this is also true

 

[thegreatappreciator]

Oh well, I'm vaping it because it's delicious. You know, when I started vaping I was really on the fence about committing to it because of the flavors I had tried. Then I had a good custard and I was hooked. I vape because it tastes good. I couldn't imagine vaping unflavored .... like some people do just to avoid the diacetyl. Am I crazy?


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[Racehorse]

Oh well, I'm vaping it because it's delicious.

And I'm not vaping it because it represents an avoidable risk.

but........

You know, when I started vaping I was really on the fence about committing to it because of the flavors I had tried. Then I had a good custard and I was hooked.

.....if vaping custard was the ONLY way I could stay off smokes I would do what you are doing.

I vape because it tastes good. I couldn't imagine vaping unflavored .... like some people do just to avoid the diacetyl.

There are LOTS of options other than vaping unflavored.

Tehre are vendors who do testing (MOV) as well as DIY (i can make about 100 different juices that don't have diacetyls) or diketones.

 

[thegreatappreciator]

I've had some MOV stuff before, and everything I've tried just "falls short" of the juices I've had that have Diacetyl in them. Carmela by MOV is one that I can live with, but it still just doesn't have that edge that keeps you coming back. Maybe just my taste profile


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