DIY Help Please, Heartlandvapes Premixed Unflavored Nicotine.

[sparkyslots]

Hello its been a while since I posted so bare with me on this one please.
Looking for some DIY help with unflavored premixed base nicotine from Heartlandvapes.

OK this is what I did, I bought some 100%VG/3mg Nicotine, 50/50/3mg Nicotine, and a bunch of PG based flavors. (TFA flavors, except for a custard which is CAP)
Nicotine Solution - 3mg Liter

Everything seems OK, However seems as though something is missing.
When mixing more than one flavor I just splits the flavor mils in 1/2 or 1/3's. and so on depending how many flavors I decide to use.
I made a simple mixing chart to follow but seems off.
The chart is based off bottle size in mls. (the e-juice row is the bottle size you want to make)

I let it sit for a day before vaping it.

Basically all I'm doing is adding flavors to this base I bought from Heartlandvapes, super simple way to start DIY on my own.

All feedback would be super helpful.

I saw another post that kind of answers some questions but not all.

DIY E-juice Question [Long Post, Need Help A.S.A.P.]

 

[Train2]

A couple things to consider with that approach -

a) 40% flavoring is a little extreme... If you like the flavor of something with 10% flavoring, you could still lower the VG ratio by adding unflavored PG. That's how most recipes work - the VG/PG ratio and the flavoring percentages are independent, because you can add VG or PG...

b) You're also lowering your Nic strength with every level.
If you start with 3 mg/ml nic, and that's 80% of your finished juice - then your finished juice is really 2.4 mg/ml. And so on.
Most accurate way to know strength is "Total MG Nic divided by Total Volume".
So in your 60/40, 10 ml example, you have 6 mls x 3 mg = 18 mg of nic. That's in 10 mls.
18 mg/10 mls = 1.8 mg/ml juice.

I highly recommend using a calculator.
I like ejuicemeup, which is a PC- installed program.
You put in your recipe (including flavor percentage, and finished strength and finished PG/VG ratio, etc) and it tells you how many mls of each ingredient to use.

 

[sparkyslots]

A couple things to consider with that approach -

a) 40% flavoring is a little extreme... If you like the flavor of something with 10% flavoring, you could still lower the VG ratio by adding unflavored PG. That's how most recipes work - the VG/PG ratio and the flavoring percentages are independent, because you can add VG or PG...

b) You're also lowering your Nic strength with every level.
If you start with 3 mg/ml nic, and that's 80% of your finished juice - then your finished juice is really 2.4 mg/ml. And so on.
Most accurate way to know strength is "Total MG Nic divided by Total Volume".
So in your 60/40, 10 ml example, you have 6 mls x 3 mg = 18 mg of nic. That's in 10 mls.
18 mg/10 mls = 1.8 mg/ml juice.

I highly recommend using a calculator.
I like ejuicemeup, which is a PC- installed program.
You put in your recipe (including flavor percentage, and finished strength and finished PG/VG ratio, etc) and it tells you how many mls of each ingredient to use.

Thanks for your quick response, You stated that 40% flavoring for 100mls is a little extreme, what would be the norm on a 60/40 ratio be then? I usually stick with the 80/20 most of the time, and every so often 70/30.
The chart was more less a guide line.

When using the e juice cal they are always off because of the base I'm using.

 

[BrotherBob]

Might want to use an on line calculator first, to double check your math.
re: E-Liquid Calculator Ten Flavors with PG/VG Adjusting

 

[OlderNDirt]

I am just starting out with DIY myself and got my nic and some TFA flavorings from Heartland.

If you are using 3mg nic base and your target nic is 3, anything you add to the base will reduce nic level below target making the calculator "off". Therefore, when you add any other ingredients, the calculator is going to say "uh, what? Does not compute!"

On the 4 TFA flavorings I got, the bottles suggest adding from 2% - 10% to 6% - 20% flavorings. I tried all at 5%, but all seemed short so letting them steep for a while before adjusting. It appears by your charts, you are trying to adjust VG/PG ratios by adjusting the amount of your PG based flavorings added, which will also throw you calculator off as well as the amount of flavoring you are using in each recipe.

If your target nic is 3, I can only see one options for you. Get some higher nic level base so you can mix with the 3mg resulting in a higher nic base you can then mix down with VG, PG, and flavorings to reach your desired nic level of 3.

At the least, get some VG, PG, or both to mix to a desired VG/PG ratio including your flavoring percent. But your nic levels will drop, possibly significantly when doing that.

 

[Capt.shay]

Thanks for your quick response, You stated that 40% flavoring for 100mls is a little extreme, what would be the norm on a 60/40 ratio be then? I usually stick with the 80/20 most of the time, and every so often 70/30.
The chart was more less a guide line.

When using the e juice cal they are always off because of the base I'm using.

You are using your flavoring like they are PG. You need a bottle of straight PG to keep your flavor percentages in line and still get the higher PG (60/40) ratio's. You can enter your Nic. level and it's vg % in the options for bases in most calculators

 

[Iron Molly]

I think you made it more complicated by trying to combine two different bases with different PG/VG ratios. It would be much easier to start with a higher mg nic base in either PG or VG, then add plain PG/VG and flavorings to get your desired nic strength and PG/VG ratio. The e-juice calculators I have seen do not have the option to combine two different nic bases.

Edited to add: Unless I'm misunderstanding what it is you are trying to do...

 

[dannyv45]

Your using your PG flavoring as raw PG and you will never get the proper flavor percentage to base nicotine percentage that way. Use a proper calculator such as the ejuiceme up calculator to figure out your percentages and you will also need a higher strength nicotine solution as well as unflavored PG and VG to accomplish proper flavor percentages at the proper nicotine levels.

eJuice Me Up - Best eJuice Calculator

Please do some research starting here.

My blogs will give insight into all aspects of DYI, from steeping to what supplies to have on hand to a basic walk through mixing your first E-juice.

E-Cigarette Forum - dannyv45 - Blogs

Then read hoosier's blogs. These blogs concentrate on fine tuning your mix and give insight on additives.

E-Cigarette Forum - Hoosier - Blogs

Then read Boletus's blog's. These blogs concentrate on formulation of nicotine bases regarding proper calculations methods for figuring Nicotine concentration as well as safety.

E-Cigarette Forum - Boletus - Blogs

Then read Ginger's book "E-Cigarettes 102: DIY E-Liquid". It is a book which I've contributed to that delivers an in depth easy to follow guide in the art of DYI.

E-Cigarettes 102: DIY E-Liquid

I recommend viewing VPLive Vape Team Episode #82: DIY Safety and bookmark it for future reference. It explains safety in all aspects of DYI.

VPLive Vape Team Episode #82: DIY Safety

List of suppliers and other useful links courtesy of ECF Member Sir2fyablyNutz

List of suppliers and other useful links | E-Cigarette Forum

then read the stickies at the top of the page.

Reading the above will explain a lot of the how's and why's and help you formulate questions on what you may not understand. Best of luck.

 

[Capt.shay]

Your using your PG flavoring as raw PG and you will never get the proper flavor percentage to base nicotine percentage that way.

Never say never, even a broken clock is right twice a day

 

[sparkyslots]

Wow some great input, Thank you all!

Let me see if I can try another approach,

The reduction of the nicotine I knew about that and I'm OK with that, I was informed of this from this forum and Heartland Reps.

The reduction in nicotine is great considering where I started when I first got into vaping. (24mg)

So lets say I use my 50/50/3mg nicotine base for this example at 70/30.
Nicotine Solution - 3mg Liter

Bottle size 30mil

Step 1 add Base (50/50) = 21mls.
Step 2 (Flavor 1 ) = 7mls (Strawberry).
Step 3 ( Flavor 2) = 2mls ( Vanilla Custard).
Step 4 shake well.
Step 5 steep for 24hrs.
Step 6 enjoy a good vape.

So this is what I have done however sometimes its great an others its off. This base from Heartland is vape-able right out of the bottle with now flavor so steeping time will vary that I understand.
Richard Ng, on You Tube is showing a video doing the same thing with an 80/20 ratio using non flavored base from mountbaker.



I was just looking for the simply way to make some quick e juice, seems easy enough with out getting to complicated or at least I thought.

Will have to try this differently next time I guess.
Will buy some straight PG & VG and 6mg nicotine. and forget about buying the premixed bases.

 

[Bonskibon]

If your using 50/50 base you'll never get it to 70/30 unless you add VG.

 

[sparkyslots]

Will have to try this differently next time I guess.
Will buy some straight PG & VG and 6mg nicotine. and forget about buying the premixed bases.

If your using 50/50 base you'll never get it to 70/30 unless you add VG.

In my case this is just base and flavoring mixed.
70 is the base and the flavor is 30 based on a 30 ml bottle size.
Base: 30 x 70% ( 30 ml bottle size x 70%)= 21
Flavor 30 X 30% ( 30 ml bottle size x 30%)= 9

so like on my chart 30mls = 21mls of base and 9 mls of flavor.

The chart is based on bottle size in mls. The e-juice row is the bottle size you want to make.

 

[Bonskibon]

Will have to try this differently next time I guess.
Will buy some straight PG & VG and 6mg nicotine. and forget about buying the premixed bases.


In my case this is just base and flavoring mixed.
70 is the base and the flavor is 30 based on a 30 ml bottle size.
Base: 30 x 70% ( 30 ml bottle size x 70%)= 21
Flavor 30 X 30% ( 30 ml bottle size x 30%)= 9

so like on my chart 30mls = 21mls of base and 9 mls of flavor.

Oh, I see what your saying now.... Your making this far more difficult than you need to. I have some premade 70/30/6 base that I just add flavoring to. Not the normal method, but works fine for me.

 

[Sugar_and_Spice]

Will have to try this differently next time I guess.
Will buy some straight PG & VG and 6mg nicotine. and forget about buying the premixed bases.


In my case this is just base and flavoring mixed.
70 is the base and the flavor is 30 based on a 30 ml bottle size.
Base: 30 x 70% ( 30 ml bottle size x 70%)= 21
Flavor 30 X 30% ( 30 ml bottle size x 30%)= 9

so like on my chart 30mls = 21mls of base and 9 mls of flavor.

When you mix like this you nic levels go down. And so does the vg. Flavorings are usually in pg so that is what is counted in total volume for pg ratio.

If your base is 50/50 pg/vg and you add flavoring(which is adding another 30% pg into total volume) then it ups your ratio of pg to 65% and the vg goes down to 35% plus the nic is also being diluted by an overall 30%.
To calculate the nic in the total volume of a 30ml bottle you would need to calculate what ml to put in for the whole bottle.
Using this as a guide
30ml(target volume) x 3mg/ml = 90mg in the whole bottle
With 100 mg/ml nic, its 90/100 = 0.9mls added to the 30ml bottle
with 24 mg/ml nic, it would be 90/24 = 3.75 mls
with 12mg/ml nic, it would be 90/12 = 7.5 mls
with 6 mg/ml nic, it would be 90/6 = 15mls.
with 3 mg/ml nic, it would be 90/3 = 30mls. Then there is no room for anything to be added.
It seems the way you are doing it totally cancels out the entire nic in the mix.

I am hoping others will weight in on this and check my calculations.......

 

[OlderNDirt]

So lets say I use my 50/50/3mg nicotine base for this example at 70/30.

It took me a while, but think I finally get what you mean when you say 70/30. Am I correct that you mean a mixture of 70 parts base and 30 parts flavoring? I and possibly others see 70/30 as a VG/PG ratio.

If I am correct, then you are in effect coming up with the amount of flavoring(s) you desire, then adding whichever base you choose. The result is not only varying nic levels, but varying VG and PG ratios. And those levels will change yet again if you change the amount of the same flavorings used even with the same base. And keep in mind that changes in VG/PG ratios can effect the flavor. Results can be all over the place, which is your question, no?

Sorry, but the only answer/suggestion I have is establish your desired VG/PG ratio and nic level (those can be easily changed in a calculator anytime). Then use the calculator to adjust those amounts dependent on the amount of flavoring you want to add. The only thing you need to do that is some nic base higher then your desired level.

Or if nic is unimportant to you, pick up some VG and PG and mix those alone with flavorings for a 0 nic juice. If it works out for you, use some of your 100% VG 3mg nic in place of the plain VG

 

[dannyv45]

Wow some great input, Thank you all!

Let me see if I can try another approach,

The reduction of the nicotine I knew about that and I'm OK with that, I was informed of this from this forum and Heartland Reps.

The reduction in nicotine is great considering where I started when I first got into vaping. (24mg)

So lets say I use my 50/50/3mg nicotine base for this example at 70/30.
Nicotine Solution - 3mg Liter

Bottle size 30mil

Step 1 add Base (50/50) = 21mls.
Step 2 (Flavor 1 ) = 7mls (Strawberry).
Step 3 ( Flavor 2) = 2mls ( Vanilla Custard).
Step 4 shake well.
Step 5 steep for 24hrs.
Step 6 enjoy a good vape.

So this is what I have done however sometimes its great an others its off. This base from Heartland is vape-able right out of the bottle with now flavor so steeping time will vary that I understand.
Richard Ng, on You Tube is showing a video doing the same thing with an 80/20 ratio using non flavored base from mountbaker.



I was just looking for the simply way to make some quick e juice, seems easy enough with out getting to complicated or at least I thought.

Will have to try this differently next time I guess.
Will buy some straight PG & VG and 6mg nicotine. and forget about buying the premixed bases.

You know what. If it taste good and it works for you then you've created a successful mix. Vape on.

 

[sparkyslots]

Sorry for all the confusion on the ratio mix up. I corrected the images to show the bottle size and not PG/VG which was assumed by many which was an error on my part.