DIY nic mixing information

[ThrashNeon]

I've been away from DIY for almost a decade, so I'm having to relearn stuff.

I've done a lot of searching for info without much luck regarding mixing your own nic juice for using in recipes - I'm sure this has been posted before, but I was having trouble finding it.

For DIY, it makes sense to consider mixing nic juice for recipes.
However, the way some online calculators handle nic strengths and/or ratios can be confusing.

I purchased 100mg nic liquid (PG base) in order to cut it for storage and safety. This is 90% PG, 10% nic (by weight). I obviously DO NOT want to be using uncut 100mg nic for regular DIY mixing.

My intention was to be able to create "max VG" recipes using PG only for the nic and flavors - and end up with at least 30/70 PG/VG for the final juice, with 8% to 15% or so for flavors.

Back in the old days (2009), I was buying 36mg PG based nic for mixing -- which I was cutting down to 12mg... which, for today's tech (sub ohm tanks, etc) is NOT what you want to do. But I needed to start somewhere, so from the 100mg nic, I mixed up 60mL of 36mg nic juice using PG as the base dilutant:

Ingredient
ml
Grams
%

Nicotine juice 100 mg (100% PG)
21.60
22.38
36.00

PG dilutant
38.40
39.79
64.00

Total base
60
62.17
100


Totals
60
62.17
100

Strength: 36 mg
PG/VG-ratio: 100/0


For my first recipe (single flavor) using the e-liquid-recipes calculator, I entered 36mg, 100% PG for the nic strength/content, and 6mg for the final desired strength. Using this and 15% flavor gives you 30/70 PG/VG. Just about perfect for 6mg recipes.

Now this is where it can get tricky...

Let's say I want to make a 12mg recipe. If I use my 36mg PG base, I would need to use twice as much of it, so the overall PG content of the final recipe essentially doubles... resulting in a final mix of 42/58 PG/VG ratio (with the same 15% flavoring).

To maintain a final 30/70 for 12mg, using a PG only base, you would want to start with a 55mg PG base nic.

I can increase the overall VG content/ratio next time by mixing my base with VG instead of PG... since I'm using PG based 100mg, my mixed 36mg base nic will be 36/64 PG/VG. This will bring my 6mg single flavor to 15/85 PG/VG - which allows me to make 12mg recipes using this same base at 21/79 ratio.



Obviously, if you want to truly do "MAX VG", you would want to buy VG based nic to begin with.

Hope this helps.

 

[IDJoel]

I purchased 100mg nic liquid (PG base) in order to cut it for storage and safety. This is 90% PG, 10% nic (by weight). I obviously DO NOT want to be using uncut 100mg nic for regular DIY mixing.

While I respect those, who choose to further dilute 100mg/mL nicotine; I don't see any particular "need" for it. Plenty of DIYers (myself included) routinely mix with 100mg/mL nic.

The higher the concentration; the less is required to achieve the desired final nicotine concentration. The less used; the less it influences the overall PG/VG ratio.

And, if you are desiring a max VG result; why would you not dilute your nic concentrate with VG, instead of PG?

Don't get me wrong... if it is working for you, and you are happy with the results... I tip my hat to you. I am just not sure what this post is about.

 

[JCinFLA]

I purchased 100mg nic liquid (PG base) in order to cut it for storage and safety. This is 90% PG, 10% nic (by weight). I obviously DO NOT want to be using uncut 100mg nic for regular DIY mixing.

I'm another 1 who buys the 100mg/mL nic base and doesn't dilute it, before using it in my DIY mixes. If I were using one of the higher mg/mL nic bases that some people buy...I'd probably cut it ahead of time though.

 

[classwife]

Moved to DIY E-Liquid from General E-Liquid Discussion

 

[ThrashNeon]

@IDJoel , @JCinFLA , thanks for your replies...

While I respect those, who choose to further dilute 100mg/mL nicotine; I don't see any particular "need" for it. Plenty of DIYers (myself included) routinely mix with 100mg/mL nic.

Once I've finalized some recipes that I use regularly, I'll probly do the same. Just getting back into it, I haven't settled on any particular method yet.

And, if you are desiring a max VG result; why would you not dilute your nic concentrate with VG, instead of PG?

Well... you would. This is why I specifically wrote:

I can increase the overall VG content/ratio next time by mixing my base with VG instead of PG...
and
Obviously, if you want to truly do "MAX VG", you would want to buy VG based nic to begin with.

Flavor, throat hit, and cloud production will be factors in the ratios.

Don't get me wrong... if it is working for you, and you are happy with the results... I tip my hat to you. I am just not sure what this post is about.

There seem to be plenty of threads/discussion on 100mg handling, mixing, and diluting - but I wasn't really finding concrete numbers or strategies for those folks who wished to premix their nic juice - so I figured it was worthwhile posting this. Especially for newer DIYers.

Additionally, as far as I can tell from all the 100mg nic threads, there still seem to be a wide range of opinions on the safety and handling practices of 100mg nic. Probly more conservative the further back in time you go (gloves, goggles, etc). Additional observations/information can't hurt, right?

Having children, grandchildren, or pets around; varying degrees of nicotine sensitivity; and comfort levels of handling lower nic levels for day to day use, may be reasons that people might choose to premix a lower nic base.

So that's what this post is about.

 

[IDJoel]

Additionally, as far as I can tell from all the 100mg nic threads, there still seem to be a wide range of opinions on the safety and handling practices of 100mg nic.

Agreed... and there should be. Many of us (DIYers) have no issue safely/conveniently working with 100mg/mL nic. That, in no way, means it is right for everyone. Not by a long shot.

I recall a lady, who was new to DIY, as well as ECF. She had an extreme skin sensitivity to even low levels of nicotine (6-9mg/mL?). Getting just a few drops on her skin resulted in emergency room visits. She was so poo-pood, and her situation dismissed as excessive and "just in her mind," that she soon left ECF... without ever receiving the help she was seeking.

Each of us, has to decide for ourselves, what is safest/best, for our own unique situation. I, in no way, meant to dismiss, demean, or discount the use of lower percentage nicotine concentrates. Homemade, or store bought. I sincerely apologize, if that is how my previous post read to you, or anyone else.

What I found confusing; was your repeatedly saying you were striving for higher VG ratios, and max VG mixes. And yet, you were using PG based nic, cut further with PG. As a tutorial; this seemed counter-intuitive to me. Yes; you closed with the idea that you would do things differently, going forward. But, that seems to contradict:

I wasn't really finding concrete numbers or strategies for those folks who wished to premix their nic juice - so I figured it was worthwhile posting this.

At this point, your numbers and strategies, seem to be anything but solidified.

And, along that same line of thought; the likely reason you find an absence of specific numbers, is because of the variable nature of final goals. A person targeting 9mg/mL nic @ 40PG/60VG, is going to have different values (numbers); than the person who desires 3mg/mL @ 20PG/80VG result. Same for the person that never uses more that 5% total flavoring; compared to the person that may use anywhere from 5% to 30% total flavoring. When you put all the possible variables into the equation, along with the individual's acceptance/tolerance for being over/under, the results are almost limitless.

That does not mean, it is worthless to discuss analytics and methodology, and how one might arrive at an acceptable range. Quite the opposite. Understanding all the variables one should consider, to arrive at a satisfactory result, is a wonderful idea.

Your theory is valid. And, your shared experience is a good demonstration, of the impact of the chosen base carriers (PG, and/or VG) have on the final PG/VG ratio, as the nicotine becomes more diluted. That just didn't seem to be what you were trying to point out.

Having children, grandchildren, or pets around; varying degrees of nicotine sensitivity; and comfort levels of handling lower nic levels for day to day use, may be reasons that people might choose to premix a lower nic base.

I wholeheartedly agree!

However, I would posit, that you missed two of the most common reasons (alone, or in combination with the reasons you have already cited), that some DIYers choose to dilute/create their own nicotine base, in more recent times. Cost being one. And, convenience being the other.

As DIYers; we are often looking for means to minimize the cost of our creations. Whether it is buying in bulk, meeting "free shipping" minimums, or controlling cost of paid shipping; we want to spend as little as possible. Buying higher nicotine concentrations, in smaller volumes, and diluting it ourselves; is one way to do this.

But, the most common reason, I read these days, is simply for convenience. There are more than a few DIYers, who prefer the convenience of reaching for (and measuring) one bottle of unflavored low nic base (that is close to their final percentages/ratios); rather than three separate bottles of PG, VG, and nicotine.

The folks who like it for this reason, are most often(?) more flexible/accepting of variations in final nicotine content, and final PG/VG ratio.
(And, the reason why I choose to stick with 100mg/mL nic. I am just too obsessive about hitting specific targets. It doesn't make my e-liquid any better, or make me a "better" mixer. It just satisfies my need for "control." )

Once I've finalized some recipes that I use regularly, I'll probly do the same. Just getting back into it, I haven't settled on any particular method yet.

I have been exclusively DIYing since 2015. I still haven't "settled." Not entirely. It seems, each time I mix, I am doing things just a bit differently. And, I am okay with that. The only "constant" of my DIY journey; is that it is constantly changing/adapting. And, that has become part of the fun.

That, to me, is the beauty of DIY: we get to make it as simple, or as complex, as we choose it to be. There are very few absolute "rights," or "wrongs." It becomes only a matter of finding what works best for each of us as individuals.

So that's what this post is about.

I applaud your willingness to share your experience. And, I thank you for taking more of your time, to further explain it to me. Sharing thoughts, and ideas, are what has always made this community something extra special. It is folks, like yourself, who have taken the time to share their own experiences; that have greatly reduced my own learning curve. Together we grow; and at the same time, find our own unique/beneficial way.

 

[Sugar_and_Spice]

I've been away from DIY for almost a decade, so I'm having to relearn stuff.

I've done a lot of searching for info without much luck regarding mixing your own nic juice for using in recipes - I'm sure this has been posted before, but I was having trouble finding it.

For DIY, it makes sense to consider mixing nic juice for recipes.
However, the way some online calculators handle nic strengths and/or ratios can be confusing.

I purchased 100mg nic liquid (PG base) in order to cut it for storage and safety. This is 90% PG, 10% nic (by weight). I obviously DO NOT want to be using uncut 100mg nic for regular DIY mixing.

My intention was to be able to create "max VG" recipes using PG only for the nic and flavors - and end up with at least 30/70 PG/VG for the final juice, with 8% to 15% or so for flavors.

Back in the old days (2009), I was buying 36mg PG based nic for mixing -- which I was cutting down to 12mg... which, for today's tech (sub ohm tanks, etc) is NOT what you want to do. But I needed to start somewhere, so from the 100mg nic, I mixed up 60mL of 36mg nic juice using PG as the base dilutant:

Ingredient
ml
Grams
%

Nicotine juice 100 mg (100% PG)
21.60
22.38
36.00

PG dilutant
38.40
39.79
64.00

Total base
60
62.17
100


Totals
60
62.17
100

Strength: 36 mg
PG/VG-ratio: 100/0


For my first recipe (single flavor) using the e-liquid-recipes calculator, I entered 36mg, 100% PG for the nic strength/content, and 6mg for the final desired strength. Using this and 15% flavor gives you 30/70 PG/VG. Just about perfect for 6mg recipes.

Now this is where it can get tricky...

Let's say I want to make a 12mg recipe. If I use my 36mg PG base, I would need to use twice as much of it, so the overall PG content of the final recipe essentially doubles... resulting in a final mix of 42/58 PG/VG ratio (with the same 15% flavoring).

To maintain a final 30/70 for 12mg, using a PG only base, you would want to start with a 55mg PG base nic.

I can increase the overall VG content/ratio next time by mixing my base with VG instead of PG... since I'm using PG based 100mg, my mixed 36mg base nic will be 36/64 PG/VG. This will bring my 6mg single flavor to 15/85 PG/VG - which allows me to make 12mg recipes using this same base at 21/79 ratio.



Obviously, if you want to truly do "MAX VG", you would want to buy VG based nic to begin with.

Hope this helps.

I think if you add your mathematical formulas in your text it would be most beneficial to further understand what you are doing. Otherwise I also found it confusing. Some of us do pre-mix our 100mg nic down to workable levels(more for convenience than safety) or to near strength but there are calculators free online that will do that easily. To show how one arrives at their conclusions is much more beneficial than just giving the end results.

just my 2 pennies.

 

[DeloresRose]

I’ve been mixing for 5 years usding 100 mg/ml nic. Just when I think I have my routine down, I find a new way...

But for the most part, I buy liters during sales and keep them in the freezer, so I don’t want to dilute large quantities. Takes up more storage area.

When I mix, I make up a base of unflavored- which works for most of my recipes because I have several that are the same flavor percentage. Should I run out of a juice and not have time to build a lab in the kitchen, it’s simple to mix up what I need from a base.

Otherwise, I don’t dilute the nic at all. I currently make juice in 3 nic levels and 4 pg/vg ratios so it would be more bother than it’s worth.

I imagine everyone who replies to this thread will tell you a different way of mixing, and that’s why there are no hard fast rules.

 

[ThrashNeon]

What I found confusing; was your repeatedly saying you were striving for higher VG ratios, and max VG mixes. And yet, you were using PG based nic, cut further with PG. As a tutorial; this seemed counter-intuitive to me. Yes; you closed with the idea that you would do things differently, going forward. But, that seems to contradict

Sorry for the confusion... I had ordered the PG nic before I had really started digging into all of this, and I had just received it. This was my first bulk nic delivery (500mL). I was messing around with the calculators and trying to plan things a bit before I even got the delivery.
I chose the PG based nic based on my previous experience (PG for throat hit, flavor, and possibly viscosity- I'm really not concerned too much with cloud chasing) and with the idea that I would be using PG nic & flavors and the rest VG.... which would still result in higher VG content. But in mixing my first 120mL, I maybe should have used VG to mix it. I may do this for my next bottle to compare, and perhaps buy entirely VG based 100mg the next time if I like it. But even with the PG based nic I did buy, I can still get 15/85 PG/VG if I premix with VG as I mentioned in the OP. The few flavors that I've made so far seem pretty good ratio-wise, tbh. Good flavor, nice vapor at the wattage that I'm vaping at. Still experimenting.

However, I would posit, that you missed two of the most common reasons (alone, or in combination with the reasons you have already cited), that some DIYers choose to dilute/create their own nicotine base, in more recent times. Cost being one. And, convenience being the other.

Yes. These are definitely the primary reasons why I bought in bulk and why I'm diluting.

I am just too obsessive about hitting specific targets. It doesn't make my e-liquid any better, or make me a "better" mixer. It just satisfies my need for "control." )

Like I said, I may very well end up doing just that for exactly those reasons.

 

[ThrashNeon]

I think if you add your mathematical formulas in your text it would be most beneficial to further understand what you are doing. Otherwise I also found it confusing. Some of us do pre-mix our 100mg nic down to workable levels(more for convenience than safety) or to near strength but there are calculators free online that will do that easily. To show how one arrives at their conclusions is much more beneficial than just giving the end results.

I suck at math, lol.
Those numbers in my OP came directly from the e-liquid-recipes online calculator.