DNA 200 Watt
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If you don't like the way things are being done with this release..... Don't be involved. Pretty simple really.
Or better yet, design your own board, start up a company, hire workers, then produce, beta test and release that board however you feel fit.
Beta testers are generally NOT employees of the company. They are in no way beholden to our wishes. They could easily take one look at this thread, see all the bickering and say heck with it and move on....I wouldn't blame them. Same token, Evolv is not required to pre release the information YOU want about their product, and have any number of reasons to withhold said info. If you don't like this, don't buy the chip. Speaking with your pocket book is the best way to show a company your pleasure/displeasure with their business or product. Disrupting this thread to do nothing but complain does nothing in the end but make you look bad, and annoy others.
If this touches a nerve, you probably need to hear it. If not, then disregard, it's not about you
Sent with one hand, the other is busy vaping.
Or better yet, design your own board, start up a company, hire workers, then produce, beta test and release that board however you feel fit.
Beta testers are generally NOT employees of the company. They are in no way beholden to our wishes. They could easily take one look at this thread, see all the bickering and say heck with it and move on....I wouldn't blame them. Same token, Evolv is not required to pre release the information YOU want about their product, and have any number of reasons to withhold said info. If you don't like this, don't buy the chip. Speaking with your pocket book is the best way to show a company your pleasure/displeasure with their business or product. Disrupting this thread to do nothing but complain does nothing in the end but make you look bad, and annoy others.
If this touches a nerve, you probably need to hear it. If not, then disregard, it's not about you
Sent with one hand, the other is busy vaping.
lol. What a s-show. I can't believe I'm saying this but I think I'll rely on ecr for my dna200 fix. Too many children here. Adios.
We so often think that the absolute maximum rating for a device is the rating we can use every day.
Perhaps another thing to consider is that voltage converters (power supplies) are usually derated to ensure high reliability and a long life. Often as much as 50% for military and aerospace applications.
So, this is really a 100W board.
Perhaps another thing to consider is that voltage converters (power supplies) are usually derated to ensure high reliability and a long life. Often as much as 50% for military and aerospace applications.
So, this is really a 100W board.
I think evolv learned something from the DNA 40 launch. They're testing the product through real users and they don't owe anyone any information. What they choose to say or allow the folks they have signed NDA's to say is up to them. I can't wait to see this product once released and if it is something I want, I'll buy it. If the documentation sucks and nobody can figure out how to use it, I won't buy it. I'm not getting worked up about it.
By the same token, your expectations are different and I can't say you're wrong, just that I don't agree with everything you say.
I also think nickel does oxidize and nickel oxide is an effective insulator.
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Nickel oxide tends not to be tightly adherent to the substrate as you no doubt know.
Duane
Well the pre-release is 79 just under 80, I hope that remains...
What do u mean they don't owe anyone anything, They do in fact owe their customers documentation of how to use temperature control and the directions for use, as well as detailed accounts of how the mod works. THEY BROUGHT IT TO THE MARKET! They charge premiums for their chips and like the claim there the market leader. This also has nothing to due with what they owe us. There choosing to selectively leak information randomly to beta testers and causing confusion. They do owe their customers more then this botched launch... They choose to have there beta testers release bits of info as a launch platform obviously, and they owe more then that to their loyal customers. Everyone needs to get over blindly defending a bad choice. This is nearly as bad as people defending the DNA40 with all its flaws.
I agree it's been hard to get information to support an intelligent decision. Some folks are happy to drink the Koolaid and that's ok for them. I've been told that I didn't need to know more and if I thought I did need to know more I shouldn't buy the DNA 200. Since I don't know much at all I guess that's good advice. Too bad because the board sounds like it has real potential.
Duane
Now that I agree with. The documentation will be what it will be and of course evolv should be encouraged to provide adequate documentation. On the other hand lol, . . . high quality documentation costs a lot of money to produce. Their target retail price for a finished mod looks to be around $250 US? Maybe if we want the aggressive price we have to live with whatever doc we get. Can't really demand both.
And I like Koolaid lol.
I don't think its because of the price. Evolv seems to be doing quite well. They also don't get the final retail price. They get the chips value. With the DNA200, they would make 80$ regardless of the end product. They do have side deals with china which is probably a sweet deal, but there printed circuit boards aren't produced by them(You can see them receiving a shipment in the P.B video) and their manufacturing process is fairly simple. There have no reason not to make a good margin, and documentation is not that costly. Its also a safety issue which they advocate they are serious about, yet there's no real info still by them. If they are reading this feedback, explain how to use your products and the method you invented.
Hey...I'm retired, relatively literate and willing to do technical writing for Evolv for free if I know what to write about. I'll bet there are others here willing to make the same offer. I like the baseline technology Evolv appears to be developing and I'd like to see it succeed. I do think that good communication with their potential customers is the only way for it to succeed in the end though.
Duane
I wasn't a vaper at the time of the DNA 40 launch, I started in March, so I'm not familiar with that reference.
I think a key word is owe - I think this might be at the heart of a lot of what happens in threads like these, which for some reason I still can't fully fathom tend to become quite emotional.
You're right, they absolutely don't owe anything to anyone who isn't a customer. To customers they owe that the product does what they said it did and that they will support it in the way they said it would, but those are different issues.
They could choose to distribute the boards in an oily rag and never say anything to anyone about it if they wanted, and no-one would have the right to say they were owed anything different so long as they knew that that is what they were getting.
My point is not that they owe anything, but rather they should be doing this as a responsible manufacturer who wants to be maximally successful and as beneficial to their customers, and potential customers, as possible. That if they communicated more, and better, they would be providing a better service to their users and this would benefit everyone; Evolv included, in terms of sales and good will (which leads to sales.)
People have different expectations of different companies and services. If one buys an unbranded cheap product at a market stall, one expects exactly zero after-sales support. If one buys from Apple, Samsung, Microsoft or any number of other big manufacturers, or one uses the services of Google, Facebook, Yahoo or an any number of other big providers, one has a very different expectation. Evolv is not the former, but nor do they appear to be aspiring to be the latter - even by the lax standards of vaping manufacturers in general. That is what I feel they should be trying, at least proportionally to their size. We seem to get more direct information out of the Chinese firms like Yihi than we do out of a company that makes a point of being "Made in the USA."
I gave the example of Dicodes because I was genuinely impressed with their publications: in fact they published just one seven page PDF (in English; there might be more in German.) But it was highly notable and visible to me because it was literally the first technical document I had seen from a manufacturer describing TC - and coming out many months after TC had revolutionised the vaping market. It made me think highly of Dicodes, but more than that it made me look askance at Evolv - "shouldn't some of this info have come months ago, from the pioneers of TC vaping?" That made me think how really nothing had come from them directly, only fed to certain high profile individuals - well, really just Busardo, that I saw anyway - to be trickled down piecemeal, and to a limited, random audience. If one didn't happen to watch all of his 1.5 hours of DNA 40 reviews, and if you don't read forums all day, that's tough if you missed crucial info.
That for me is an example of how communication "wins hearts and minds" - and loses them, too. It's also an example of how I feel all vape manufacturers, not just Evolv, should be trying to raise the bar on the industry as a whole, trying to move it from a niche, back-room, part-time industry into something reputable and long lasting. That was fine in years past, but it feels to me that the industry should aspire to be doing better now - should aspire to any number of examples in any number of other industries. Press releases, complete documentation, blog posts, twitter posts, comprehensive customer service, manufacturer's own forums, etc etc. (And if that sounds expensive, Evolv surely have a rabidly dedicated fan base who I am certain would fall over themselves to help.)
Like you I base my purchase decisions on the facts available and where there is a lack of information I weigh up the pros and cons accordingly - and usually go ahead anyway and figure it out myself. Sometimes, lack of information is even a pro - the challenge of figuring something out! But that's not the general case for most people.
For some reason others seem prone to get emotional over this - and really would use a word like owe. But I don't think the overreactions of some should cloud the fundamental point that by any standard Evolv clearly could do better at communication. The Evolv fanbois are want to exclaim that Evolv are raising the bar in every way with their hardware. In some areas, and in a more limited sense, I agree. But what I don't think anyone can claim is that they're raising the bar in terms of communication and education -a bar already set very low by their competitors. In my view that is something they should try to improve; not because they owe it to anyone, but because we all, Evolv included, will benefit from it.
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hum.... alot of pages to read from this afternoon to get to this point ..... info given by Mike and etc.
Sounds like a plan.... here is a link where you can contact Evolv and offer your expertise.... there is a drop down box to select your type of correspondence to them... might be good to ask that you offer of free technical writing for them be passed to Brandon or John as the staff (as I understand) takes care of the contact process.
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Sounds like a plan.... here is a link where you can contact Evolv and offer your expertise.... there is a drop down box to select your type of correspondence to them... might be good to ask that you offer of free technical writing for them be passed to Brandon or John as the staff (as I understand) takes care of the contact process.
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Um.....to clarify, it hasn't been BROUGHT TO MARKET, as you so boldly yelled. It's in beta. Many items in beta don't even get this much info released..... So no, they don't owe you this info. Once it's released then you can complain about lack of info. Till then, it's pointless.
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