Do You Believe in the Rapture?

[LisaLisa]

This is such a hotly debated thing amoung christians today. Some believe that the rapture will be a literal thing, others think not.

What do you think? Will we be called up in the air to meet Christ? Or will we have to endure the great tribulation?

I don't know, I'm split on it myself. The two women working in the field, one was taken and the other was left. Is this literal? Is it before the tribulation or after? What's your feeling on this scripture?


Matthew 24:36-41 "36] But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only. [37] But as the days of Noah were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be. [38] For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noah entered into the ark, [39] And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be. [40] Then shall two be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left. [41] Two women shall be grinding at the mill; the one shall be taken, and the other left."

 

[oldtechno]

Well, JESUS Himself talked about it.

'...two women will be drawing water at the well...one draws water, looks over at the other and she is not there...' (or something to that effect).

Yeal, it'll happen. I'm also sure when it does everybody left will come up with some kind of 'logical' explaination to explain it.

For my part, I just wonder if 'you' disappear like in a Star Trek teleporter...or...does your body drop to the ground (your mind and soul taken out) dead. In other words, is the body left behind.

 

[dleerl]

The Rapture is going to happen, it's just a matter of when it will occur; pre-, mid- or post- tribulation period. I have no idea which period it will occur. All I know is that I am supposed to be watchful, to look for the signs, to stay vigiliant and in the Word. Many will fall away and be deceived. Those that do not read the Bible will be easily lead astray because they are relying on someone else to interpret God's word for them instead of checking it out for themselves.

 

[dopeless-hopefiend]

I believe the Bible teaches a pre-trib rapture of the church. I haven't always believed that, however. For many years I believed that the book of Revelation had already been fufilled.

If anyone seeks Biblical truth I invite you to go to gracethrufaith dot com. This man's interpretation is unmatched and IMO inspired by the Holy Spirit. Go and see - your spirit will concede.

If nothing else - read his teachings on the parables of Jesus... never in my life have I come across such profundity. This man is truely gifted by the Spirit.

 

[LisaLisa]

I would like to believe that the rapture would happen before the tribulation, but I"m not so sure about that. If it were going to happen before the tribulation, why were the believers warned to beware of the mark of the beast and told that only those that endured to the end would be saved?

Chapter 7 in Revelations is about what happens to Christians during the Tribulation. The Seal of the Living God, which protects Christians who are ready from God's wrath during the Tribulation, is given between verses 11 and 12 of chapter 6. What John sees after the Seal is given doesn't have to do with any specific point in time. It is only telling what will happen to the Christians who don't get the Seal.

Chapter 14 is another vision that takes place in Heaven. Except for verses 14-20, which are a preview of Armageddon, it doesn't happen at any particular time. It's primary message is an exhortation to faithfulness addressed to Christians during the Tribulation, especially to martyrs.

So its really not clear, many believe that we will have to endure the tribulations, others believe in the rapture: that we will be taken up before the tribulation begins.

Here is a good website that talks about this very question.Tribulation

And here is a good argument for the pre-tribulation rapture. The Pretribulation Rapture

Frankly, I'm torn between the two. I would like to believe that we won't have to endure it, but I'm not convinced that we won't.

 

[LisaLisa]

Has anyone here read the Left Behind series? It's supposed to be really good, I'm going to check it out.

If the rapture does happen, I can't even imagine what this world will be like for those that are left behind. It would be terrifying and that's putting it mildly.

 

[dleerl]

I have read some of the Left Behind Series, although I own the entire 14 book series. There are more but they aren't all necessary to the series. This is the complete set. I tend to think that believers will have to go through the tribulation period, but then those could be the ones that that have heard the word before but never come to believe until the believers are removed from the earth. I just don't know but I have to trust that He who began a work in me will bring it to completion on the day of our Lord Jesus Christ. I know that I am weak. I don't know how I could ever stand up in those days but God has promised to bring me to completiion, to give me everything that I need to stand. It's not up to me because if it were, I'd quit the race right now. I'm counting on Him.

 

[dopeless-hopefiend]

Has anyone here read the Left Behind series? It's supposed to be really good, I'm going to check it out.

If the rapture does happen, I can't even imagine what this world will be like for those that are left behind. It would be terrifying and that's putting it mildly.

The Left Behind Series book are a fantastic read - a little corny at times but otherwise great stories with a pretty clear perspective, IMO.

 

[oldtechno]

I guess I must have miss read the Good Book.

I was under the impression ALL 'saved' Christians will be taken up in the Rapture...the 'yet to be saved' Christians will have to go through it.

The ones that don't sell out get saved.

Like I said--that's what I remember.

 

[dopeless-hopefiend]

I guess I must have miss read the Good Book.

I was under the impression ALL 'saved' Christians will be taken up in the Rapture...the 'yet to be saved' Christians will have to go through it.

The ones that don't sell out get saved.

Like I said--that's what I remember.

Well - that sounds spot on to me, lol. Those left behind can still be saved however, their salvation won't be guaranteed at the point of belief - they will have to hold fast to their faith until the end.

This is unlike us, as we live in the age of Grace. Our salvation was sealed/guaranteed at the point of acceptance of our Lord Jesus.

Does the church deserve to be punished/purified through the tribulation period? Yes. None are righteous, no - not even one.

Will the church be punished/purified through the tribulation period? No. The church was punished and purified at the cross. Kind of humbling, huh?

 

[5cardstud]

Jesus didn't make a habit of spreding gosip so if He said it you can put money on it. It will happen. It will come as a theaf in the night. No man knows when. If I'm not mistaken Jesus said he didn't even know when only the father knows.

 

[Topso]

Will God take me directly to heaven if i am one that will be taken? That sounds like a great way to go though, God taking me Himself

 

[LisaLisa]

Will God take me directly to heaven if i am one that will be taken? That sounds like a great way to go though, God taking me Himself

Yea, I'll buy a ticket on that ride too!

 

[sentrarob]

Yes, i fully believe the rapture will happen SOON!!!

 

[LisaLisa]

Are these verses in Jeremiah saying that the teaching of the pre-tribulation rapture is false? Hmmm.......not sure, but it's interesting.


Jeremiah 14:10,12 Thus saith the LORD unto this People, "Thus have they loved to wander, they have not refrained their feet, therefore the LORD doth not accept them; He will now remember their iniquity, and visit their sins." (12) When they fast, I will not hear their cry; and when they offer burnt offering and an oblation, I will not accept them: but I will consume them by the sword, and by the famine, and by the pestilence."

14:13 Then said I, "Ah, Lord GOD! behold, the prophets say unto them, 'Ye shall not see the sword, neither shall ye have famine; but I will give you assured peace in this place.' "14:14 Then the LORD said unto me, "The prophets prophesy lies in My name: I sent them not, neither have I commanded them, neither spake unto them: they prophesy unto you a false vision and divination, and a thing of nought, and the deceit of their heart.

14:15-16 Therefore thus saith the LORD concerning the prophets that prophesy in My name, and I sent them not, yet they say, 'Sword and famine shall not be in this land;' By sword and famine shall those prophets be consumed. And the People to whom they prophesy shall be cast out in the streets of Jerusalem because of the famine and the sword; and they shall have none to bury them, them, their wives, nor their sons, nor their daughters: for I will pour their wickedness upon them.


also see Matthew below:

Matthew 24:13-15 But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved. And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come. When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand)

 

[chimney55]

Interesting question. I'm firmly pre-trib, but I don't see this as a salvation issue. If one is a true Christian, he/she will be taken in the rapture whether they are pre-, mid-, or post-trib, or don't believe in the rapture at all. The invisible "church" is the bride of Christ--not brides. All believers will be taken at the time of the rapture. To understand what this means as far as the rapture goes, you have to understand what the marriage customs were at the time that Jesus walked the earth. Dr. Arnold Fruchtenbaum (a Jewish believer) has some wonderful teachings on the subject.

Before applying every verse of the Bible, one needs to see who the "audience" was. Jeremiah was talking to Jews who were living under the Mosaic law. Those verses do not apply to Christians but to Jews that would refuse to recognize Christ as their messiah. THEY will go through the tribulation. Although many will come out of the tribulation saved.

Matthew chapters 24-25 were spoken by Jesus to Jews and applies to what will happen to Jews (and gentiles who go through the tribulation period). Jesus almost never spoke of the rapture. The rapture is for the church--no one else. The church wasn't "born" until after His death and resurrection. It wasn't a concept that His followers could have understood. The first reference to the rapture occurs in John 14:1-3.

1 "Do not let your hearts be troubled. Trust in God; trust also in me. 2 In my Father's house are many rooms; if it were not so, I would have told you. I am going there to prepare a place for you. 3 And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come back and take you to be with me that you also may be where I am.

The first references to the rapture didn't occur until years later with Paul telling people of a "mystery" (previously unrevealed truth). Peter also told believers that they are not "appointed to wrath". Careful reading of the book of Revelation shows that first part of the judgments are the "wrath of the Lamb", the rest are the "wrath of God.

Speaking of the book of Revelation, if you read it, it's basically in chronological order (more or less). Chapter 1 is the "introduction". Chapters 2-3 are the letters to the "churches". Reference to church or churches in these 2 chapters are abundant. Chapter 4 is when John is taken up to heaven where he is sees "24 elders" (which is a term associated with the church) and multitudes who sing about the "lamb being worthy". This can apply to only the church. After appearing numerous times in chapters 2-3, the word church is not mentioned again. Throughout the chapters speaking of the tribulation. The next reference to come is about the bride of Christ and that doesn't occur until after all of the judgments are passed. (Why would the church go through judgments when we are "in Christ" and our sins have been covered by His sacrifice? We are in God's eyes "sinless" although for the moment we know that we are not.)

As far as the reference in Matt. that you posted. That was addressed to Jews and people who have become believers after the beginning of the trib. We don't know when the rapture will be---it's imminent. It could happen at any time. If we had to wait until the gospel was preached in all of the world, we would know that there was something else to wait for. And as far as there being a witness to the world unto all nations, God's got it covered. There will be during the trib the 2 witnesses, the 144,000, as well as angels flying around the world proclaiming the gospel. There will also be "fence sitters" who didn't believe the gospel when they heard it but believe when they see all of the rest of Bible prophecy come true.

 

[eHuman]

I don't have time to detail now and it has been a long time since I've done the study that put me in my current understanding.

I started out believing that a pre-trib rapture was right. Primarily because I was taught that, and secondarily because it's what we all want to believe. Even the mid and post-ers want to believe they are wrong and pre is correct.

That being said I believe that it will be a post tribulation rapture.

Cart before the horse but yes I believe in the literal rapture:

The same word used in Acts 8:39 of Phillip being caught up by the Spirit of God.

 

[Saintscruiser]

I'm pre-trib.....hands down....Thank You, Jesus.

What bridegroom would unleash his wrath onto his bride at the wedding feast?

Like another poster said, the rapture of so many will be logically explained away. I've heard different scenarios. All the unmanned planes will crash, trains, buses, cars, helicopters.....anything that moves that had a Christian driving will crash. All literal hell will break loose.

As for the bodies, they will be quickly changed to a glorified body, like what Jesus has. The dead in Christ rise first, so that the bodies can be reunited with the spirit and soul.

As for post tribulation stance, please consider one thing......we come back with Jesus on horseback at the 2nd Coming. So if you're not there, how do you get there so that you can come with Jesus? My sister changed her stance when I pointed that out. Now she's a mid-trib.

 

[LisaLisa]

This is one instance where I really hope and pray that I"m wrong. I don't want to go through the tribulation.

 

[eHuman]

We are not destined for wrath, but it is through much tribulation that we enter Heaven.

Acts 14:22 strengthening the souls of the disciples, encouraging them to continue in the faith, and saying, "Through many tribulations we must enter the kingdom of God."

John 16:33 These things I have spoken to you, so that in Me you may have peace. In the world you have tribulation, but take courage; I have overcome the world."

Rev 2:10 'Do not fear what you are about to suffer. Behold, the devil is about to cast some of you into prison, so that you will be tested, and you will have tribulation for ten days. Be faithful until death, and I will give you the crown of life.

Just points to ponder, maybe open a discussion:
What is the difference between:
The wrath of God
The wrath of Satan
Tribulation
The great trubulation

A verse that appears to directly say that we will be taken out pre:
Rev 3:10 'Because you have kept the word of My perseverance, I also will keep you from the hour of testing, that hour which is about to come upon the whole world, to test those who dwell on the earth.

The Greek that represents "will keep" above is "tereo" (tay-reh-o) means to protect and preserve in place like that of a heavily guarded prisoner. "keeping and guarding in the midst of danger as apposed to removing from danger to a safe place."

Just some things to ponder, not start an uproar over.

What is our common confession? He's coming back for me!