For your information... knowledge is power to make informed decisions...
http://gfn.net.co/downloads/2014/posters/122 Farsalinos - DA_AP.pdf
http://gfn.net.co/downloads/2014/posters/122 Farsalinos - DA_AP.pdf
Dr. F's research on Diketones
- Thread starter Kent Brooks
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Well, on a positive note...I inhaled the stuff for 24 years apparently at a rate of a pack to a pack and a half per day, and my lungs still feel better since starting vaping in place of smoking. And it reads as if it can be avoided without losing sweet flavors? reports are really hard for me to grok but that's the positive that came out of it for me.
Interesting...
"DA and AP were found in a large proportion of sweet-flavored EC liquids, at levels that were higher than the strictest safety limits but significantly lower compared to smoking."
also:
"The presence of these chemicals in EC liquids represents an avoidable risk. Proper measures should be taken by EC liquid manufacturers and flavoring suppliers to eliminate these hazards from the products, without necessarily limiting the availability of sweet flavors."
Oh look, good science....makes me all warm and fuzzy...
The thing I've found before and is reiterated here are the levels are significantly lower than traditional cigarettes...HMMmmmmm...
"DA and AP were found in a large proportion of sweet-flavored EC liquids, at levels that were higher than the strictest safety limits but significantly lower compared to smoking."
also:
"The presence of these chemicals in EC liquids represents an avoidable risk. Proper measures should be taken by EC liquid manufacturers and flavoring suppliers to eliminate these hazards from the products, without necessarily limiting the availability of sweet flavors."
Oh look, good science....makes me all warm and fuzzy...
The thing I've found before and is reiterated here are the levels are significantly lower than traditional cigarettes...HMMmmmmm...
Basically it reiterates what I have been saying since the beginning... even custard made with diacetyl is safer than a cancer stick
Yes exactly. I never have thought that vaping was 100% safe, and as my husband said, "Anything you do to excess will be a danger to some part of your body." He said this as he was telling me about his co-worker who is training for a marathon and was devastated when his doctor told him he would need knee replacement surgery on both knees within a couple years if he didn't stop running...he is 28.
Do I think vaping is a healthier alternative to smoking? Yes. Do I think doing nothing would be healthier? Yes. Will I then do nothing? Not right now as I'd go back to smoking cigarettes.
It's all a balance between informed risk prevention and making the choices that are best for you.
As for my husband's coworker he is ignoring the doctor and running 15 miles a day at least. He's addicted to running and will replace his knees before he stops. I'm addicted to cigarettes so I will vape anyway. As adults we all make our choices, as long as they are informed we can choose what we do with a basis of knowledge.
Yep...any charred meat from a grill is cancerous....so is the sun, the air and most foods you put in your body unless you grow your own and water.
Face it, humans get cancer. How quickly or devastatingly depends more on genes than anything. The genes provide the weakness cancer exploits when providing those stresses to your body.
"Conclusions. DA and AP were found in a large proportion of sweet-flavored EC liquids, at levels that were higher than the
strictest safety limits but significantly lower compared to smoking"
Yet, cigarettes are legal, readily available, and contain a myriad of other chemicals that are known to cause cancer, heart disease, circulatory system issues, lung disease, etc. and the very vocal, often uninformed "they" want to ban ecigs, ejuice and vaping?
Obliterative Bronchiolitis has many causes, including ozone, viruses, auto-immune disease, ammonia, chlorine... (among many others)
Has anyone conducted a study using proper scientific method on humans who have been vaping for (X) number of years, using (X) amount of eliquid per day and done pulmonary function tests, spirometry, chest x-ray, CT scan, and biopsy of any abnormality that may be found if indicated? Included would have to be all the variables...
My problem with all of these studies, regardless if the conclusions are good, bad or indifferent - when I see the word "probably" I am dubious.
There are risks and exposures to every choice we make. We put our trust into what we believe to be reputable and responsible vendors. Responsible vendors will take every action to produce a quality product, reduce harm and give full disclosure. Everything on either end is a choice.
I was exposed to cigarette smoke from birth. I started smoking very young and it was a miracle I was able to quit the day I started vaping. I have medical records that document the improvement in my health and lung function.
I'll read and try to educate myself but I do so with a huge grain of salt. I'll keep vaping because without it I've proven I'll go back to smoking. It's always been my body and therefore my choice.
Sorry for the blathering rant... vape on
strictest safety limits but significantly lower compared to smoking"
Yet, cigarettes are legal, readily available, and contain a myriad of other chemicals that are known to cause cancer, heart disease, circulatory system issues, lung disease, etc. and the very vocal, often uninformed "they" want to ban ecigs, ejuice and vaping?
Obliterative Bronchiolitis has many causes, including ozone, viruses, auto-immune disease, ammonia, chlorine... (among many others)
Has anyone conducted a study using proper scientific method on humans who have been vaping for (X) number of years, using (X) amount of eliquid per day and done pulmonary function tests, spirometry, chest x-ray, CT scan, and biopsy of any abnormality that may be found if indicated? Included would have to be all the variables...
My problem with all of these studies, regardless if the conclusions are good, bad or indifferent - when I see the word "probably" I am dubious.
There are risks and exposures to every choice we make. We put our trust into what we believe to be reputable and responsible vendors. Responsible vendors will take every action to produce a quality product, reduce harm and give full disclosure. Everything on either end is a choice.
I was exposed to cigarette smoke from birth. I started smoking very young and it was a miracle I was able to quit the day I started vaping. I have medical records that document the improvement in my health and lung function.
I'll read and try to educate myself but I do so with a huge grain of salt. I'll keep vaping because without it I've proven I'll go back to smoking. It's always been my body and therefore my choice.
Sorry for the blathering rant... vape on
That's all we can do. I have always eaten a huge amount of hard boiled eggs. All my life. And my cholesterol has been textbook perfect.
Then everyone was running around like crazy saying eggs were bad that they will kill us!!111!!1 I ignored them and kept eating eggs. Then 20 years after that they suddenly come out with a study saying only eating the yolk by itself is bad. Eat the whole egg and it cancels out bad cholesterol. Still eating eggs. Soon I'm sure they will come out with a study linking kale to some obscure disease. There is no winning, just trust your personal experience and go with that.
To me, as a scientist, there is no way on earth to complete a substantive study on ANYTHING within a lifetime of observation of a group of people...and I mean a whole life from beginning to end. And then that study has to be tried within the same parameters by other scientists to try and replicate the first study's findings. That is impossible unless we become one large group of test subjects with our every choice decided for us. How are we to agree on something that has only really become active in the last ten years? At least this study was just a recording of findings for the most part. Our supporters will point at it and say GOOD, our detractors will point at it and say BAD!!!
It is ultimately up to us as individuals. It worked for me, it worked for you. We are harming ourselves LESS by vaping. That is good enough for me!
Yes, and eggs, and hot showers, the list goes on and on and on...
As far as the study goes, I'll take it!
Obviously doing nothing is better, but for me, it ain't happenin 
Sums it up for me perfectly!
If you wait long enough, everything, in it's turn, will give you cancer ..and then it won't as it's replaced by something else
That's all we can do. I have always eaten a huge amount of hard boiled eggs. All my life. And my cholesterol has been textbook perfect.
Then everyone was running around like crazy saying eggs were bad that they will kill us!!111!!1 I ignored them and kept eating eggs. Then 20 years after that they suddenly come out with a study saying only eating the yolk by itself is bad. Eat the whole egg and it cancels out bad cholesterol. Still eating eggs. Soon I'm sure they will come out with a study linking kale to some obscure disease. There is no winning, just trust your personal experience and go with that.
To me, as a scientist, there is no way on earth to complete a substantive study on ANYTHING within a lifetime of observation of a group of people...and I mean a whole life from beginning to end. And then that study has to be tried within the same parameters by other scientists to try and replicate the first study's findings. That is impossible unless we become one large group of test subjects with our every choice decided for us. How are we to agree on something that has only really become active in the last ten years? At least this study was just a recording of findings for the most part. Our supporters will point at it and say GOOD, our detractors will point at it and say BAD!!!
It is ultimately up to us as individuals. It worked for me, it worked for you. We are harming ourselves LESS by vaping. That is good enough for me!
Huge amount huh? remind me not to sit next to you!
It's a proven fact, life is bad for your health... No way getting around it we are all going to die eventually. I just know that I'm enjoying life a lot more vaping!
I think George Carlin summed it up perfectly(as usual) when he said.... 'Death is caused by swallowing small amounts of saliva over a long period of time.'
Case closed.
Case closed.
So, Kent, I think there's a groundswell for egg flavors you should take advantage of.
Add a bacon note, with biscuits and gravy, and get some 500 ml bottles, plastic. I see another wall in the fort going up.
Add a bacon note, with biscuits and gravy, and get some 500 ml bottles, plastic. I see another wall in the fort going up.
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