E cigarette smoking and Epilepsy Seizures

[kranjo]

I have googled, searched the forum, searched epilepsy specific sites and forums, but it seems that I can't find any data which would connect seizures with smoking ecigarattes.

Several days ago my wife friend who is doctor btw, said to her that her friend had seizures which was looking much like EP ones.
The girl until now didn't have any medical issues like this.

It happened to her while she was at work smoking ecig.
The ambulance came for her, and they took her to ER. They did all tests trying to found the cause but they didn't find anything, so they released her.
Several weeks later it happened again, again they did brain scan, EEG, blood tests .... but again they didn't found anything.

After that she quit smoking ecigs and analogs, and it didn't happened again (one and half mont since then).
Unfortunately I don't know what liquid or equipment did she use.

Can those 2 things be related.

My wife is giving me real hard time, and I understand her, but I can't think of smoking analogs again

 

[Talyon]

I'm no Doctor, but I know for a fact that no Doctor on this planet can find all ailments that can ail a person. If they could we would all be cured dead or at least no what is causing our illness, but alas they can't.

I'll highly assume, it could have been the liquid she was Vapeing, but we have no idea what liquid it was exactly. Could have had rat poison in it for all I know, lol. Sorry but this would have to be tested etc etc etc....

 

[Racehorse]

No way to know, there are so few studies on anything ecig related, including testing of liquid by vendors.

In your wife's friend case, I certainly wouldn't try to vape again. Maybe she can try a different from of harm reduction.

 

[StormFinch]

There are far too many factors at play here to say what caused her seizures one way or the other. I did however find this:

Smoking cigarettes also can trigger seizures. The nicotine in cigarettes acts on receptors for the excitatory neurotransmitter acetylcholine in the brain, which increases neuronal firing.

- Seizures and Epilepsy: Hope Through Research: National Institute of Neurological Disorders and Stroke (NINDS)

While the possibility exists that the seizures might be from an unrelated problem, it's a good bet that the nicotine from her e-cig exacerbated the neural activity, especially if she was getting more nicotine from it than she was used to with cigarettes. It could also be any number of other things, we just don't know and only a very thorough doctor with an investigative bent could probably tell you. This is, however, the first time in over 3.5 years that I've heard of someone trying to link e-cigs and seizures, so it's certainly not a common complaint, or even an uncommon one.

 

[Rickajho]

There are far too many factors at play here to say what caused her seizures one way or the other. I did however find this:

- Seizures and Epilepsy: Hope Through Research: National Institute of Neurological Disorders and Stroke (NINDS)

While the possibility exists that the seizures might be from an unrelated problem, it's a good bet that the nicotine from her e-cig exacerbated the neural activity, especially if she was getting more nicotine from it than she was used to with cigarettes. It could also be any number of other things, we just don't know and only a very thorough doctor with an investigative bent could probably tell you. This is, however, the first time in over 3.5 years that I've heard of someone trying to link e-cigs and seizures, so it's certainly not a common complaint, or even an uncommon one.

And the OP did state, in context of the two episodes,

After that she quit smoking ecigs and analogs

so as a dual user who knows what her nicotine intake might have been?

Regardless, you won't find any correlative information out there because it just isn't happening. It sounds like the OP's friend could have a host of pre-existing conditions already in play to create a seizure disorder. Nicotine in a very general sense may be a trigger, but e-cigarettes creating seizure disorders? I don't think that is going to happen.

Under the best of circumstances keep in mind that Emergency treatment is only there to find something that is obviously an emergency and apply treatment for an emergency condition. When it comes down to tracking down the source of a seizure disorder that won't be forthcoming from a trip to an Emergency Medical Department. Specialists are in order.

 

[kranjo]

And the OP did state, in context of the two episodes, so as a dual user who knows what her nicotine intake might have been?

Regardless, you won't find any correlative information out there because it just isn't happening. It sounds like the OP's friend could have a host of pre-existing conditions already in play to create a seizure disorder. Nicotine in a very general sense may be a trigger, but e-cigarettes creating seizure disorders? I don't think that is going to happen.

Under the best of circumstances keep in mind that Emergency treatment is only there to find something that is obviously an emergency and apply treatment for an emergency condition. When it comes down to tracking down the source of a seizure disorder that won't be forthcoming from a trip to an Emergency Medical Department. Specialists are in order.

She didn't smoke while she was vaping (she was smoker before that).
And she was processed by specialists (neurologist and cardiologist, for shure I don't know for other specislists) twice, but they didn't found any anomaly.

 

[Talyon]

She didn't smoke while she was vaping (she was smoker before that).
And she was processed by specialists (neurologist and cardiologist, for shure I don't know for other specislists) twice, but they didn't found any anomaly.

To not find any anomalies, is unfortunately very normal, more then u would think. There are literally millions and millions of people out there suffering from some sort of disease yet discovered or symptoms that don't add up, in pain and discomfort and no Doctor or specialist can determine wht the cause or or causes are.

To relate theses seizures to Vapeing is quite immature, and irresponsible IMHO. I understand the grasping of straws.

 

[Sane Asylum]

Like other posters have stated, there's really no way to determine what caused the seizures especially given the fact that you don't know what liquid was used or what device. Given what we know, the only thing that there is any medical evidence for is a possible nicotine overdose.

I think if this was a side effect of vaping in of itself, we would hear of it happening.

 

[kranjo]

I agree that is really long shot to relate seizures to vaping. My initial reaction was that is nicotine overdose. But just wanted to check with you guys.

Tnx

 

[Rickajho]

We didn't mean to be coming down hard on you, but this "if-then" grasping at connections comes up here all too often and many times it can be dangerous and absurd. If someone is experiencing chest pain the last place to go is hopping on a message board, asking if it's vaping related. (But they do...) Someone actually checked in here once, reporting blood in stool and wanting to know if it could be vaping related.

Serious medical symptoms need a prompt medical response and appropriate medical follow up. It would be highly suspect if not dangerous for your friend or any MD she is dealing with to just posit "Oh, quit smoking and vaping - that cured the seizure disorder." Again, even being seen by a neurologist in an emergency room is not a comprehensive look at a person, their family history, nor an ongoing course of investigation, follow up, or treatment for something as complicated and some times medically baffling as a seizure disorder. I do hope she is following up on this.

 

[Uma]

How scarey!!
It might even be an UNDERdose of nicotine. I've heard of this happening before. I don't remember why their body needed the nicotine so desperately, but it might be worth investigating.
Good luck.

 

[Rickajho]

How scarey!!
It might even be an UNDERdose of nicotine. I've heard of this happening before. I don't remember why their body needed the nicotine so desperately, but it might be worth investigating.
Good luck.

Hey Uma

I think where you where going with that one is the fact the smoking screws with your endocrine system, suppressing it. Quit smoking and an underlying endocrine disorder reveals itself in full glory. It's the complexity of the crap in cigarette smoke that is the problem. Simply switching to vaping won't maintain a status quo in this case.

 

[Uma]

Hey Uma

I think where you where going with that one is the fact the smoking screws with your endocrine system, suppressing it. Quit smoking and an underlying endocrine disorder reveals itself in full glory. It's the complexity of the crap in cigarette smoke that is the problem. Simply switching to vaping won't maintain a status quo in this case.

That sounds like the one, thanks.
I hope the doc checks full circle, for all possible causes.

 

[ArtyPa]

I am on this 'if this then that' Merry go round.

Was in hospital for sudden seizure. Hospital permitted vaping. While in hospital encountered another seizure. The common 'wisdom' now has vaping as cause due to some internet stories read by family and friends. Medically seizure causes by brain swelling viral infection.
Convenient layman causal relationship ties it to egigs.
My use of egig was relegated to mixing 12 mg nic peach with 0 mg peach . Basically making a 6mg eJuice.
Used an ego c4 . Stopped analogs jan 4 2014 via this method..have not had analog since.
During hospitalization family 'confiscated' my ego setup and being adamant about returning it to rightful owner ( lol).
Rightful owner doing a 'work around' by purchasing Provari with money saved by using egig...below see the banner stats.
Provari arrives soon. Non nic vaping will be new normal for me. My vaping success is due to nic reduction,coupled with mimicking of smoking ritual . I consider myself an egig success story and will continue without the nic kick...love the egig ritual substitution...it works for me and I have finally beat cigarette addiction.
Family will adjust ...they are used to having a 'hard head' around them. Lol

The truth of responsible vaping will prevail , one puff at at a time.

 

[ArtyPa]

I am on this 'if this then that' Merry go round.

Was in hospital for sudden seizure. Hospital permitted vaping. While in hospital encountered another seizure. The common 'wisdom' now has vaping as cause due to some internet stories read by family and friends. Medically seizure causes by brain swelling viral infection.
Convenient layman causal relationship ties it to egigs.
My use of egig was relegated to mixing 12 mg nic peach with 0 mg peach . Basically making a 6mg eJuice.
Used an ego c4 . Stopped analogs jan 4 2014 via this method..have not had analog since.
During hospitalization family 'confiscated' my ego setup and being adamant about returning it to rightful owner ( lol).
Rightful owner doing a 'work around' by purchasing Provari with money saved by using egig...below see the banner stats.
Provari arrives soon. Non nic vaping will be new normal for me. My vaping success is due to nic reduction,coupled with mimicking of smoking ritual . I consider myself an egig success story and will continue without the nic kick...love the end o post siezure flowup ritual substitution...it works for me and I have finally beat cigarette addiction.
Family will adjust ...they are used to having a 'hard head' around them. Lol

The truth of responsible vaping will prevail , one puff at at a time.

Am on the tail end end of post seizure followup. Cause of seizure found and will be getting final clearance from Neurosurgeon as to current state of brain 'health' , An MRI will confirm all Neuro needs to know within next couple weeks.

State DMV pulled drivers license for 3 months so this Neuro work up is critical.

Family Doc is giving me 'coaching' re vaping even though he is unaware of the recent research on vaping both nic & non nic juices. He is still my work in progress and I am gathering PEER reviewed research for his edification.
just trying to move him to at least a 'do no harm ' stance.

He is THAT good that HE is worth all my time,trouble, and effort to educate on vaping.i know i am on the right track and need these final clearances to finish up...otherwise its 'ALL just speculation as to real cause...not just the final effect of having a seizure.

To that end, AND in the name of science (hehehe), i bought a ProvariMini w/ zero nic American made ejuice. I just started vaping last night ( since i haven't vaped or had analog anything since mid-March nic is out of my system).

The final MRI can be compared w/ Seizure MRI ( w/enic) for decent BEFORE & AFTER COMPARISON.

FAMILY RIGHT NOW REALLY ...... that i started any vaping at all. I will miss them all so terribly ( hehehe.).

BTW.
AFter test will follow up in this space BUT...BUT...BUT Will answer NO Medical questios ( even if PM).

Semper Fi

 

[RichM76]

If you want a clear diagnosis of epilepsy get a 72 hour ambulatory EEG (outpatient EEG) or a sleep study. That's really the only to find out. I have epilepsy, but just small seizures (simple partial seizures). A regular EEG didn't find anything for me and an MRI didn't find my seizures. I have noticed since I quit smoking they are less common. What triggers it for me are stress and lack of sleep. I don't contribute mine to smoking at all, and especially not to vaping.

Epilepsy is a neurological disease. An MRI most likely won't find a cause unless you have an underlying condition (ie; stroke, tumor). Your friend needs to see a neurologist for comprehensive care. Not a GP.
Getting an ambulance ride to the ER after every seizure gets expensive real fast, especially when they can't find anything.

I do agree with some that this is grabbing at straws and wouldn't jump to the conclusion that it's caused by vaping.