E-cigs just banned on Hennepin Cty property (Minneapolis, MN) according to Fox 9 news this morning

[VprNomi]

I can't believe it!! Not just in workplaces (my own workplace specifically included e-cigs in workplace smoking ban this year), bars, restaurants, etc. but ANYWHERE IN THE COUNTY. Hennepin County includes the city of Minneapolis as well as several residential areas. I'm absolutely stunned. You can smoke in your home in this county but you can't vape in your home now?

According to the news story (showing video of people using PV's that don't look like cigs), it's not FDA approved and they don't know how harmful it might be to those who do it & those around them yet. A quick blurb to a legislater said the same, adding that they're trying to protect people. Then the newscaster said "If you've ever been around them, they do emit a smell like smoke." HUH? At least he added, "but it isn't really smoke, it's actually water vapor." Then the other newscaster on the set said it was the first time they've ever seen a nicotine ban on a non-tobacco product.

 

[Bejeebus]

Well, ignorance wins again .. astounding.

 

[npalmy]

Of course something they do not understand and they ban it.
Link to the article. http://www.myfoxtwincities.com/stor...e-ban-hennepin-county-property-now-off-limits

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk 2

 

[VprNomi]

Thank goodness (for now anyway), I currently live in rural Wisconsin and just happen to get local news from Minneapolis because it's the largest big city despite being across the river in the neighboring state (I grew up in Minneapolis - in Hennepin County). Wisconsin has historically fought against big government policy so I'm hoping that the same ignorance won't come here - at least for awhile longer anyway.

 

[VprNomi]

Of course something they do not understand and they ban it.
Link to the article. E-CIGARETTE BAN: Hennepin County property now off-limits - KMSP-TV

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Thank you for the article, Npalmy. At least it cleared up my misconception from the TV news story that you can't vape anywhere in the county at all - just on county property (which of course includes the entire metro transit area, which is really big deal there and regularly goes all the way out to suburbs 30 min away, especially for people who work in the city and a popular way to get around as parking in the city itself is quite limited).

 

[npalmy]

I live in Hennepin CTY and hopefully this will not spread to the other metro counties. And to other public buildings. I would hate to have to find some dark corner or bathroom to sneak a vape. One vape shop in town has kiosks at the malls...wonder how they will react?

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk 2

 

[2coils]

A bunch of people that have no idea about e-cigs, protecting the rest of the public, because it looks like smoking. I have about had it with people. Saddens me to see governments have the power to take away peoples rights. I love my country, though things have certainly changed here.

 

[zoiDman]

I can't believe it!! Not just in workplaces (my own workplace specifically included e-cigs in workplace smoking ban this year), bars, restaurants, etc. but ANYWHERE IN THE COUNTY. Hennepin County includes the city of Minneapolis as well as several residential areas. I'm absolutely stunned. You can smoke in your home in this county but you can't vape in your home now?

...

I wonder what the Penalty is for an American Citizen, over 18 Years Old, using an e-Cigarette inside their Home?

BTW - just How do they Plan to Enforce such an Ordinance as this?

 

[Arnie H]

This is a shame. Some have said to me that my vapor does have an odor and asked that I not vape around them, which I have respected. But for many people if it looks like smoke, must be smoke!

 

[DC2]

1) Join CASAA please: Become a CASAA Member
2) Get ready

 

[Abbell]

So if we are using a zero nicotine liquid what can they do?... do they plan on creating a nicotine sensor?

Good luck

 

[AgentAnia]

I'm thinking that since most of these legislators haven't taken the trouble to actually talk about ecigs with people who actually use them, they don't have a clue about how ecigs actually work and interact in the real world, so in their ignorance they don't realize how impossible a total ban would be to enforce.

 

[VprNomi]

Npalmy provided a link to the article that corrected my misconception - the ban is on vaping on county property, not in one's home and in fact, not even in private businesses (yet - for now I guess that's up to the discretion of the business owner). The weird thing to me was that one of the newscasters said that being around a vapor smells like smoke (it doesn't - not at all) even though immediately afterward he did say that it wasn't actually smoke but water vapor. Both newscasters gave the impression that they thought it was silly (yay!) and the associated video shown was of vapors using larger PV's that looked nothing at all like cigarettes.

I notice that my vaping does produce a scent in the air but it usually smells at least similar the flavor I'm vaping, which is nothing at all like smoke (granted, I generally vape dessert/sweet, fruit and coffee flavors - good scents to most people - but I'd venture to guess even a tobacco flavor probably doesn't smell like smoke because there's no combustion/ashes!), it dissipates quickly and it's only visible when I'm exhaling (though sometimes the scent lingers a little longer) - unlike a cigarette which is giving off smoke the entire time it's lit whether the smoker is inhaling or not. I've never had anyone complain - but I don't try to vape in places where smoking isn't allowed. It just feels wrong to me - like I'd be picking a fight with someone who wouldn't have the power for a "win" to be worth all the hassle anyway.

IMHO, it's a difficult subject because people who don't understand vaping (probably the vast majority of the public) are looking to the FDA for answers on whether it's safe or not (both for vapors and those around them) while at the same time we as vapers would much rather not get the FDA involved (for various good & valid reasons) and also because many e-cigs look like cigarettes despite the fact that they aren't so people who see them & don't know any better assume they're cigarettes. Even though that doesn't help public perception, I can't say that ecigs (or PVs) should never look like cigarettes because honestly, it's how a lot of us started and learned about vaping in the first place. If you would have shown me a Provari, tanks, bottles of juice, adapters, etc. back when I'd never heard of vaping, I would have looked at you like you were crazy and certainly declined to partake. However, a humble Blucig kit piqued my interested and started me on my way.

I wonder what the Penalty is for an American Citizen, over 18 Years Old, using an e-Cigarette inside their Home?

BTW - just How do they Plan to Enforce such an Ordinance as this?

 

[Angiebubs]

I sure hope they take up "Smokeless Mn" offer to come visit them and receive some real information on what vaping is all about. Scary-even though its only on public land, its a start-and needs to be stopped before other smaller county's take their lead and follow suit.

 

[Boiler]

Well, I may be gone for a while:

 

[VprNomi]

I forgot to actually address the questions about 0 nic and how do they plan to enforce. I actually work in one of many court systems in the US so based on that, this is my opinion on those issues:

As far as enforcement - that would be the same as any law. Assuming the consequence would be a ticket/fine (I don't really know but this seems most likely), then once the law is in place, police watch for & enforce it (if they see you vaping, they will give you a ticket). Nicotine %, from what I understand is irrelevant (though I could be wrong). The people putting these bans in place probably haven't even considered that somebody might vape 0% nic. The ban is on using e-cigs, not inhaling nicotine. Police aren't judges, so they don't have the final say to determine if you're guilty or not, they're just the ones who are in charge of giving out the ticket (summons) based on their duty to enforce. Then it's up to the defendant (the person who got ticketed/fined) to either decide it's not worth the time/hassle/energy to fight & just pay the ticket (i.e. guilty plea and paying the consequences) or to go in front of a judge to plead innocent and attempt to prove that he or she wasn't breaking any laws. Until the latter happens, we won't know how a judge would rule and until a minor court judge's ruling is appealed to a higher court for a decision, "case law" (which is usually what lawyers use to determine whether and/or how to defend a similar case) won't be established (because minor court judges notoriously rule differently on similar cases, so one minor court judge's decision doesn't "case law" make).

I understand not everyone may follow this whole explanation but to put it as simply as possible, most people caught vaping where it's banned will probably get a ticket with a fine (again, type of juice is irrelevant from what I have heard about the ban so far - it's against vaping on county property, not against something as specific as using nicotine via an inhalant device on public property) and most who get ticketed on minor offenses just pay the ticket and let it go at that because it's easier, so the matter usually doesn't even become anything that a judges is required to listen to arguments for and against, consider and then render judgement on. The legal battles with vaping have only just begun with "ordinances" (I'm not even sure if they're actually "laws" - though possibly) just starting to pop up around the US so I definitely wouldn't expect any judicial deliberations or decisions involving individual vapor's rights or anything like that for quite some time.

 

[SavePaperVapor]

It's a ban of ecigs on county property. NOT a county wide ban. Change the title please.

 

[VprNomi]

Ummm... I would change the title to "on all Hennepin County property" instead of "in Hennepin County" if I could but I don't know how.

 

[VprNomi]

1) Join CASAA please: Become a CASAA Member
2) Get ready

Done !

 

[TLS01]

Why is it that when you get closer to the taller buildings, the fewer rights people have?
I saw this last night on the channel 9 news, I just shook my head.