Early adopter feeling like a newb

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snowshyn

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Jul 9, 2011
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Hi! I was an early adopter of vaping, started (and joined this forum) in 2011. I quit vaping because at the time the options for hardware pretty much sucked and I was tired of burnt cartridges.

I see that a lot has changed! I'd like to get started again but so much has changed that it's really overwhelming. Hopefully someone here can lead me in the right direction.

I liked the Vaporesso Tarot Nano I was looking at but here are my questions/concerns. I don't understand what sub-ohm is all about. Is it just hotter? I thought hotter was bad because carcinogens. How do you sample flavors anymore? Or if you want to have a variety? I don't see stuff to do drips like the old days. Just tanks and bigger tanks.

I left off at Ego-C and honestly I have no idea what's going on.

Thanks!!
 

djsvapour

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Oct 2, 2012
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Welcome @snowshyn

Hmm... sub-ohm... where to start. :confused:

Sub-ohm tanks/coils are designed to wick the liquid fast and keep the coil wet. This does mean they get hot and make lots of vapor but actually some of them make early clearomizers look positively unhealthy.

Over the years, many good and bad studies have drawn all sorts of conclusions, but recently we learned atomizers like BVC (Aspire) and BF (Joyetech) SOCC (Kanger) are far better than many despite running hotter with more vapor. Let me put it this way... a coil designed to work at 30-50 watts vaped at 30w is going to be far better than a coil claiming to be 5-15 watts that gives dry hits at 15w.

If you want to 'drip' you either do it the classic 510/306 way or use a RDA, ideally a simple one for testing liquids out.
I personally enjoy dual coil RDAs above all sorts, more than tanks and different to squonking. But during the day I mostly use plug and play tanks, yes.

Good luck. :)
 

Cf11

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Apr 22, 2017
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Hello!
The tarot nano is a really good kit.

Subohming is basically vaping on resistances that are below 1ohm.
The coils have less than 1ohm resistance and is usually for people who like to DL.
Basically if the resistance is lower then you can get more current that's passing through the wires and hence more vapor. Obviously the flavor and the production will depend on the wattage you vape at but that's the jist of it.

The vape is hot and can be very hot at higher wattages. I personally don't go above 70w. But people vape at 200watts and they report getting amazing clouds and flavor.

The vape does not get hot enough for you to have to worry about carcinogens.
It is still just vapor.
I don't know much about carcinogens but i think it's pretty safe to vape hot vapor and it won't hurt or harm you.

There are RDAs( rebuildable Dripping atomizer ) in tbe market these days too. Actually they've gotten much better. Some of the good ones that i know are goon 1.5, twisted messes, druga, peerless, icon there are tons and tons of other drippers out in the market and the products are just getting better day by day.
So you can do the flavor testing by using rdas.

I agree that there are a lot of tanks in the market today, we have tanks that are called super subohm tanks... For people who like to go super low with their resistances.
A lot of companies are focusing on super sub ohm tanks these days maybe that's why you just saw those.

But there's RTAs in the market too, i don't know if you had them back in 2011.
Rta(rebuildable tank atomizer) - basically an rda with a tank in my opinion.
Some of the great rtas are the azeroth, griffin 25, ammit, serpent smm... Again there's tons more.

Your choice of the tarot is a good one...
But a few other good mods are the pico, al85, alien, smoant charon, voopoo drag, battlestar... Depending on your price range you might wanna look into these.
And you might wanna buy a RDA separately as it doesn't come with the kit if you like building your own coils.
HTH.
Happy vaping.
 
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JustWondering1

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Aug 29, 2015
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Hi! I was an early adopter of vaping, started (and joined this forum) in 2011. I quit vaping because at the time the options for hardware pretty much sucked and I was tired of burnt cartridges.

I see that a lot has changed! I'd like to get started again but so much has changed that it's really overwhelming. Hopefully someone here can lead me in the right direction.

I liked the Vaporesso Tarot Nano I was looking at but here are my questions/concerns. I don't understand what sub-ohm is all about. Is it just hotter? I thought hotter was bad because carcinogens. How do you sample flavors anymore? Or if you want to have a variety? I don't see stuff to do drips like the old days. Just tanks and bigger tanks.

I left off at Ego-C and honestly I have no idea what's going on.

Thanks!!

If you don't know what sub-ohming is, I'm assuming you are a mouth-to-lung vaper (MTL), which means you draw the vapor into your mouth a bit before inhaling it.

Do you want to build your own coils? If so, I would recommend you try a MTL RTA like the Digiflavor Siren 22 mm, the Coppervape Hussar RTA with the Nano tank, alternate top cap and reduced airflow pin, I've also heard great things lately about the Coppervape Skyline RTA.

[In Stock!!]Siren GTA MTL Tank 22 by DigiFlavor

22mm Digiflavor Siren Genisis GTA&MTL Tank 4ml - $19.99

$19.79 Coppervape Hussar Styled RTA Rebuildable Tank Atomizer - 5.7ml / stainless steel / 22mm at FastTech - Worldwide Free Shipping

$22.54 Coppervape Skyline Styled RTA Rebuildable Tank Atomizer - 4ml / 316 stainless steel + glass at FastTech - Worldwide Free Shipping

If you don't want to build your own coils, I would recommend a Nautilus Mini, a Vapefly Nicolas or the Joyetech Ego one Mega Tank with the 1.0 ohm CLR coils.

√ Vapefly Nicolas MTL Sub Ohm Tank

Coils for the tank are very reasonably priced and are also available at 3AVAPE.

Aspire Nautilus Mini Adjustable Airflow Tank - $14.99 : Heather’s Heavenly Vapes, Top Quality Custom E-Liquids

The best place to find coils for the Nauti Mini is ecig.com, where they are $7 plus change for a package of five.

Aspire Nautilus\/Mini BVC Replaceable Coil (5 Piece)

Joyetech eGo ONE Mega V2 Tank

Joyetech CLR Coils (5 pack)

I highly recommend the Joyetech Ego One Mega Tank with the CLR coils. They are cheap, provide excellent flavor, do not leak, have 4 ml. capacity and the best thing of all is that -- if you want to extend the life of your coils, they can very easily be rewicked and even rebuilt. If you don't want to rebuild or rewick, you don't have to! It's a heck of a deal though!

If you want a mod with an internal battery, you can get the EGO One Mega Kit at Vape Shop too for about $35 for the mod and tank. The kit is awesome!
 
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Baditude

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Good Starter Setups for a Beginner Vaper
  • Typical starter setups recommended for a new vaper. Includes a video on the use of an eGo variable voltage battery/clearomizer and of the iStick and MVP mods.
Advancing Up the Vaping Ladder
  • From cigalike batteries, to eGo's, to mods. Another picture dictionary of terminology and form factors for beginning vapers. Includes videos.
Proper Terminology: Is it a carto, a tank, or what? A Guide to Juice Delivery Devices
  • A picture dictionary for beginners with descriptions of clearomizers, nano's, drip atomizers, bottom feeding mods, cartomizers, cartotanks, and RBA's (rebuildable atomizers). Includes video demos/reviews of all devices. Includes tips on clearomizer tanks to avoid flooding or dry hit issues.
 

IMFire3605

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May 3, 2013
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As far as sampling juices, the old 306 and 510 dripping atomizers are still around, but more efficient and effective are rebuildable dripping atomizers (RDAs) you build the coils yourself, which needs a knowledge of Ohms Law to do safely, though there are some places you can buy pre-wrapped coils to install into an RDA without needing to wrap them yourself, after that you just need some basic tools, wire snips, tweezers (preferably ceramic tipped), pair of scissors, and some cotton wicking like organic cotton balls, or "Cotton Bacon" "Cotton Bacon Bits" pre-sterilized unbleached/non-peroxide treated cotton, to install and wick the coils. Unlike the silica wicking most cartomizers/cartridges used back in the day, cotton transfers flavor way better, though I has a lower burning temperature than silica does so you have to watch how dry the wicking gets when using cotton and other such wicking materials, most pre-made coil cartridges in production nowadays (replaceable coils) use cotton as well, don't let the tank get to low on juice or you get a very bad scorched hit, 10x worse than a dry silica hit from back in the day. The term "Sub-Ohm" is any coil or multi-coil setup that has an Ohm Rating below 1.0ohms, back in the day Low Resistance coils were lowest 1.5ohms, and high resistance was in the 2.8 to 3.0ohm range, you now have "Standard Sub-Ohm" (0.5 to 0.9ohm), and "Super Sub-Ohm" (0.1ohm up to 0.49ohm) to contend and confuse you further. Sub-Ohm does require more power, direct relation to the diameter of the wires used (thicker gauges of wires like 22 and 24awg wires) compared to the older devices you remember used very thin wires like 30, 32, 34awg wire which needs far less power than a thicker 22awg wire, compounded further with very low resistance coils out there right now in the 0.1 to 0.15ohm range due to amount of wire in them needs 100+ watts to function right, where the older cartomizers and such from back in the day needed 5-8watts max to function properly.

Carcinogens/Formaldehydes/diacetyls and other by-products, yes, if you are to hot and reaching scorching wicking temperatures on the wicking, juice, wire materials, yes you are going to produce these chemicals, especially the drier the wick is, the worse it gets. If you don't go to crazy on the watts you output, the risk decreases drastically.

There are really two types of vaping these days
Mouth to Lung (MTL/M2L) which is low wattage, tight, restricted devices that simulate the draw of a cigarette or off a straw
Direct to Lung (DTL/D2L) which sub-ohm, higher wattage, loose airflow, devices that simulate the draw off a *ahem* water pipe chamber you have to clear.

For the most part, the mod (power device) itself plays a factor in type of devices you attach to it, it is the attachment that limits your ending wattage output and you have to juggle what you are wanting, relax back and sip at juice and still enjoy flavor and such MTL device like the Kanger Protank 2, the mod can accomodate the tank readily as it can accomodate a higher power D2L storm clouding tank like the SMOK TFV8 Cloud Beast, you'll have to decide what attachment type you will want, RDA mentioned above you can build these to what ever your style is low powered single coil just for testing, or super high powered huricane making cloud champ, which can be used for sampling equally well.

If you are looking to get back in and get a starter setup that will work quite a bit better than that Old Ego-C you remember, the Tarot Mod will be flexible

MTL Tarot Setup - The Tarot Mod with an Aspire Nautilus/Nautilus Mini/(Newer) Nautilus 2 in the 8 to 15watts range will be a beauty and very low maintenance setup, with coil head replacement for the Nautilus line being in the range of every 3 days to every 2 weeks depending on juice, wattage, and frequency you vape
D2L Tarot Setup - The Tarot Mod with say an Aspire Triton/Triton 2/Kanger Subtank (Toptank) in the 20 to 30watts range would need a little more upkeep (will use more juice due to the wattage is higher and vapes more juice) with a coil life replacement of 3days to 1 week depending again on juice, wattage, and frequency you vape.
 

snowshyn

Full Member
Jul 9, 2011
15
11
Thanks for the great info. Your thorough explanation really helped me understand the difference between what I was using then and what is available now. I'm much more confident that I understand what I'm looking at/for.

The term "Sub-Ohm" is any coil or multi-coil setup that has an Ohm Rating below 1.0ohms, back in the day Low Resistance coils were lowest 1.5ohms, and high resistance was in the 2.8 to 3.0ohm range, you now have "Standard Sub-Ohm" (0.5 to 0.9ohm), and "Super Sub-Ohm" (0.1ohm up to 0.49ohm) to contend and confuse you further. Sub-Ohm does require more power, direct relation to the diameter of the wires used (thicker gauges of wires like 22 and 24awg wires) compared to the older devices you remember used very thin wires like 30, 32, 34awg wire which needs far less power than a thicker 22awg wire, compounded further with very low resistance coils out there right now in the 0.1 to 0.15ohm range due to amount of wire in them needs 100+ watts to function right, where the older cartomizers and such from back in the day needed 5-8watts max to function properly.


There are really two types of vaping these days
Mouth to Lung (MTL/M2L) which is low wattage, tight, restricted devices that simulate the draw of a cigarette or off a straw
Direct to Lung (DTL/D2L) which sub-ohm, higher wattage, loose airflow, devices that simulate the draw off a *ahem* water pipe chamber you have to clear.

For the most part, the mod (power device) itself plays a factor in type of devices you attach to it, it is the attachment that limits your ending wattage output and you have to juggle what you are wanting, relax back and sip at juice and still enjoy flavor and such MTL device like the Kanger Protank 2, the mod can accomodate the tank readily as it can accomodate a higher power D2L storm clouding tank like the SMOK TFV8 Cloud Beast, you'll have to decide what attachment type you will want, RDA mentioned above you can build these to what ever your style is low powered single coil just for testing, or super high powered huricane making cloud champ, which can be used for sampling equally well.

If you are looking to get back in and get a starter setup that will work quite a bit better than that Old Ego-C you remember, the Tarot Mod will be flexible

MTL Tarot Setup - The Tarot Mod with an Aspire Nautilus/Nautilus Mini/(Newer) Nautilus 2 in the 8 to 15watts range will be a beauty and very low maintenance setup, with coil head replacement for the Nautilus line being in the range of every 3 days to every 2 weeks depending on juice, wattage, and frequency you vape
D2L Tarot Setup - The Tarot Mod with say an Aspire Triton/Triton 2/Kanger Subtank (Toptank) in the 20 to 30watts range would need a little more upkeep (will use more juice due to the wattage is higher and vapes more juice) with a coil life replacement of 3days to 1 week depending again on juice, wattage, and frequency you vape.
 

zoiDman

My -0^10 = Nothing at All*
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Apr 16, 2010
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Hi! I was an early adopter of vaping, started (and joined this forum) in 2011. I quit vaping because at the time the options for hardware pretty much sucked and I was tired of burnt cartridges.

I see that a lot has changed! ...

It is Pretty Amazing how far things have come since you became a Member of the ECF. Light Years from Carts/Atty's and Cartos.

As to the Sub-Ohm question. Coil Resistances below 1.0 Ohm have become the Norm. And Most Atomizers/Coil Head are designed to be used as such.

But that Doesn't mean that a Sub-Ohm hit needs to be "Hot".

Way Back in the Day, the way people got More out of a Hit was by using Lower Resistances. And a LR Atty or LR Carto did run Hotter than a Regular Atty/Carto. Because the Voltage our e-Cigarettes put out were basically Fixed.

But all that Changed when Variable Voltage (VV) and later Variable Wattage (VW) e-Cigarettes became mainstream. With VV/VW, the user can Adjust the way the Hit Tastes be Increasing or Decreasing the Voltage the e-Cigarette outputs.

I'm a Sub-Ohm Vaper. Because basically all the Coils I use are below 1.0 Ohm. But I run Very Low Wattages compared to Most in my RTA's/Tanks. And the Hit I get is Not Hot at all.

So Long Story Short, using a Sub-Ohm Coils doesn't necessarily mean that you get a Hot Hit. It depends a Lot on how many Watts you use.
 
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Smoke_too_much

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Basically if the resistance is lower then you can get more current that's passing through the wires and hence more vapor. Obviously the flavor and the production will depend on the wattage you vape at but that's the jist of it.

I'm not sure Cf11's description of sub-ohm is quite clear. Sub ohm as others have said is simply vaping with a coil resistance below 1 ohm. I haven't been vaping that long but I guess this must have been some sort of threshold in the past in that the over coming of it gave it sufficient notoriety to have gained its own name and vape category.

To achieve a lower resistance in the coil you would either use a shorter piece of wire, a thicker piece of wire, and/or a more conductive piece of wire. He is correct in saying to achieve the same temperature a lower resistance wire will require more power through it however acceptable vaporization for vaping purposes takes place within a certain temperature range which itself dosen't change with the resistance or the power. What can change it however, within a limited amount, is the airflow. The better the air flow along with higher power to the coil and the resulting higher heat can be carried away that much more efficiently. It is called heat flux and you will have to read about it because I've now reached the limits of my knowledge concerning it.

With a thicker wire in the coil you present that much more heated metal surface to vaporize from so that increases the cloud size. Sub ohm attys typically have more effecient air flows and juice flows because the larger clouds need both. Higher power also gives a quicker ramp up time to get to the required temperature though I'm sure that folks simply learn to vape around slower ramp up times and never think of it as a problem.

The other thing with sub ohm is that they are more often DTL (direct to lung) devices and have very easy draws. For myself I've tried MTL (mouth to lung) devices and I'm just not comfortable trying to draw with a restricted air flow but that is a personal thing and lots of folks feel the exact opposite.
 

listopencil

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In Partibus Infidelium
I left off at Ego-C and honestly I have no idea what's going on.

Thanks!!

How familiar is this to you:

eGo-C Starter Kit - Joyetech

EGO-C.jpg
 
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IMFire3605

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I'm not sure Cf11's description of sub-ohm is quite clear. Sub ohm as others have said is simply vaping with a coil resistance below 1 ohm. I haven't been vaping that long but I guess this must have been some sort of threshold in the past in that the over coming of it gave it sufficient notoriety to have gained its own name and vape category.

It was, especially considering the hardware at the time about 4 years ago, very few mechs and rdas, genesis, and or rebuildable anything at the time. People were making mods out of broke down cordless drills, Altoid tin boxes, anything they could, the batteries available at the time also were lack luster compared to what we have today, AW IMR 18490/18500s, and 18650s were at max the best the batteries available. Then some knucklehead in EU started going down, down, down in resistance. Sub-ohm was born very slowly when people were posting 0.9ohm, 0.8ohm, more common 0.7ohm builds on RSST's Genny or an A7 Dripper mounted on such classic mods as the GP Paps and Caravela.

Then the MNKE 18650 was found to be 20 to 30amps, then the Sony VTC3 hit the market, the Nemesis mod, King Mod, Chi Yu Mods, Patriot, Helios RDAs, Kayfun and Russian RTAs all started hitting the market, and then boom, the super-sub-ohm craze caught on in Malaysia and the Philipines, transitioning over to Cali and the east coast of the US, and the rest as they say is history and the "Clone Wars" topics that began popping up shortly after.
 
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BrotherBob

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Dec 24, 2014
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Hi! I was an early adopter of vaping, started (and joined this forum) in 2011. I quit vaping because at the time the options for hardware pretty much sucked and I was tired of burnt cartridges.
I see that a lot has changed! I'd like to get started again but so much has changed that it's really overwhelming. Hopefully someone here can lead me in the right direction.
I liked the Vaporesso Tarot Nano I was looking at but here are my questions/concerns. I don't understand what sub-ohm is all about. Is it just hotter? I thought hotter was bad because carcinogens. How do you sample flavors anymore? Or if you want to have a variety? I don't see stuff to do drips like the old days. Just tanks and bigger tanks.
I left off at Ego-C and honestly I have no idea what's going on.
Welcome and glad you joined.
The information below may help bring you up to date.
Might like to read:
https://www.vape-town.co.uk/vaping-guide/useful-links-&-further-Information.html
http://www.vaporauthority.com/pages/learn
http://www.ecigarettedirect.co.uk/a...tte-college-guides-tutorials-information.html
Beginner – Guide To Vaping
http://vapingcheap.com/vaping-101/
(10) Advancing Up the Vaping Ladder with Egos and Mods | E-Cigarette Forum
(1) Proper Terminology - Is it a carto, a tank, or what? A Guide to Juice Attachments. | E-Cigarette Forum
Regarding sub ohm'g:
How is sub-ohm vaping dangerous?
Guide For New Vapers | Spinfuel VAPE
All About Sub-Ohm Vaping | Spinfuel VAPE
 
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