Eau Claire school officials cracking down on 'Juuling'

[CarolT]

"Parents: be aware of the hand held object that looks like a USB flash drive for a computer. It could actually be an E-cigarette and school officials are cracking down on the smoking device in Eau Claire."
...
"[Memorial High School's Resource Officer Ben] Hundt's advice, talk to your children about e-cigarettes and explain to them that they have equal dangers of a regular cigarette."

Eau Claire school officials cracking down on 'Juuling'

Looks like somebody other than the students needs an education.

 

[bombastinator]

While it’s incorrect to say the dangers are equal the dangers are greater for developing brains than adult ones. Nicotine is a vasoconstrictor. It makes blood vessels smaller.
I personally think the juul is a less than ethical device. Not only does it follow the razor blade model, but it has a grotesquely high nicotine content with no path to reduction. It is designed to addict. Little wonder they were bought out by big tobacco. Dung attracts flies after all.

I am annoyed by the generalization of e-cigarettes in this instance. The juul is an exceptional device, not the rule.

 

[Rossum]

talk to your children about e-cigarettes and explain to them that they have equal dangers of a regular cigarette

 

[Rossum]

I personally think the juul is a less than ethical device. Not only does it follow the razor blade model, but it has a grotesquely high nicotine content with no path to reduction. It is designed to addict.

Or perhaps it was designed to be effective in getting smokers to switch, in a form-factor they're willing to accept, and without chucking massive, obnoxious cloudz?

 

[bombastinator]

Or perhaps it was designed to be effective in getting smokers to switch, in a form-factor they're willing to accept, and without chucking massive, obnoxious cloudz?

yet there is no way to reduce nicotine. Also it specifically is the device apparently causing the problems. Not ecigarettes in general, but it. This is an argument of intent vs effect. My statement was "designed to addict". You are taking this as "design with intent to addict" the intent cannot be measured except by the designers, but the effect is clear.

 

[sofarsogood]

It's not the parents who are speaking out on this and it hasn't been from the start. The concerns come from the people who need to be worried about funding threats to their jobs because all those Juulers don't become smokers. That would include public education. What about kids smoking, or drinking or drug or depresion or obesity or... Sping is comiing. When I was a kid the big threat was squiirt guns.

 

[Rossum]

yet there is no way to reduce nicotine.

So? It's by no means everyone's aspiration to eliminate (or even reduce) their nicotine use.

The biggest challenge is to get people off cigs. Lots of smokers look at our box mods and think: "No way". But they might just be willing to try a Juul, and if it gets them off cigs, that's a huge win. Once they've off cigs for a while, they'll probably look at other options at some point, but if they don't, it still counts as another smoker who quit.

 

[bombastinator]

So? It's by no means everyone's aspiration to eliminate (or even reduce) their nicotine use.

The biggest challenge is to get people off cigs. Lots smokers look at our box mods and think: "No way". But they might just be willing to try a Juul, and if it gets them off cigs, that's a huge win. Once they've off cigs for a while, they'll probably look at other options at some point, but if they don't, it still counts as another smoker who quit.

again: No method to reduce nicotine. I would say the biggest challenge is to continue to be able to get people off cigs. I think the JUUl threatens that.
I don't disagree with your logic train, but the Juul is not necessary to do those things. It is the device being abused though, and I do not think the trade off is a reasonable one. If the JUUl with its gigantic nicotine hit wasn't around Im unsure there would even be an issue. Ignoring it and ridiculing it isn't going to make it go away either. they have managed to pull the "save the children" lever in an actual meaningful way. there is some fairly damning photography of a sweet faced little blonde kid literally vaping behind a teachers back. The moronic little punk actually took a selfie. It wasn't on some weirdo website either. I saw it on CNN. 70mg nic is not required to get people off ecigs. nor is a device whose nicotine cannot be reduced.

 

[CarolT]

"Nicotine addiction" is a lie http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3116468/ that "could only be sustained by systematically ignoring all contradictory evidence."

 

[CarolT]

It's not the parents who are speaking out on this and it hasn't been from the start. The concerns come from the people who need to be worried about funding threats to their jobs because all those Juulers don't become smokers. That would include public education. What about kids smoking, or drinking or drug or depresion or obesity or... Sping is comiing. When I was a kid the big threat was squiirt guns.

That's kind of a stretch to claim that public educators would lose their jobs if "all those Juulers don't become smokers." They're really just brain dead robots obeying Tobacco Control. And Spring is the season of mass hooky events thinly disguised as social justice demonstrations.

 

[stols001]

I refuse to blame anyone for "Juuling" and that would include the Juul. I don't even blame teens for being interested in it... It is what teens DO..

I DO blame the educators in this instance, one for being uninformed and acting like a flock of lemmings, and two, for wasting their valuable time focusing on "Juuling" instead of "educating" although it sounds like, in this case, if a bunch of EDUCATORS can't get some GD simple facts right, I don't want them teaching kids "math."

I'm imagining "Juul math" at the moment now.... "If Freddie starts to Juul at age 13, while Sally decides to steal a pack of smokes and get addicted for a life time, who will DIE FIRST?" That kind of "math" might be helpful.

IT IS NOT THE JUUL. IT IS NOT TEENS. IT IS THE ADULTS AND EDUCATORS "protecting them" that are showing their ignorance and blind inability to do anything other than what the "Media" says in that instance. If my parents would have been called in to such a conference//media scare, I would probably pull out my provari (I had good taste as a teen too) and consider how "sturdy" it was and who might need a little sense "knocked" into them.

Just my opinion ,as always.

Anna

 

[bobwho77]

I remember smoking in high school.
It was a kind of game.
Not even tht teachers who had to enforce the rules by patrolling the bathrooms took it seriously.
Teenagers are GOING to try to experiment, and push the boundaries.
It's what they DO.
Aside from the gross misinformation about the relative risks of vaping, this isn't really anything new.

 

[sofarsogood]

That's kind of a stretch to claim that public educators would lose their jobs if "all those Juulers don't become smokers." They're really just brain dead robots obeying Tobacco Control. And Spring is the season of mass hooky events thinly disguised as social justice demonstrations.

Here in Michigan I believe the tobacco tax raises something like $600 million per year. If that revenue went away the financial pain for government and their dependents would be extreme. There would be cuts everywhere. Ecigs are a funding threat. Make no mistake about that.

Gottlieb at the FDA has said smoking is one of his priorities because, he claims, it's the leading cause of preventable death in America and around the world. I've recently discovered he's wrong about the leading cause claim, at least going forward. Half of all American adults are either Type 2 diabetics or "pre-type 2 diabetic", meaning they are eating more carbohydrates than their bodies can properly metabolize. One of the main markers is over weight and obesity. There is an epidemic of obesity in the US (becaue of the high carb diet) and it's starting at younger ages and and has been growing for 40 years, since the government decided to tell us what too eat. There are informed estimates that iif we don't head off the increase in type 2 diabete it will bankrupt the healthcare system. It's hard too talk about becaue everybody is addicted to carbs.

Getting all rigged up about Juuling or vaping at school, kids making mischief, is a bunch of mickey mouse silliness. The kids have way more important challenges.

 

[stols001]

That's okay, I'm being informed by my kid that they're cloning meat. Newfangled things are all adored by youth, so there need to be field trips to these newfangled "cloning meat" factories and it will be all the rage, or so I'm told.

Food can be as much of an addiction as anything else.... In fact, when poor, it's often the "addiction of choice" for some people.

And ooohhhh getting kids to eat right is such a struggle! The number one thing you can do psychologically to keep your family healthy is a sit down dinner at the table, and I was working full time for most of my kiddo's life. I wasn't a food Nazi, I'd just make him the "kid version" of what we were eating and serve it up (different spices, maybe a different vegetable). My Sunday afternoons were spent cooking five meals that I could refrigerate or freeze and just shove in the oven. I always cooked the "family thanksgiving" because my mom would get overwhelmed and/or whatnot resulting in "flying turkeys" (long story) but as far as I was concerned, it was pretty restful since I was only cooking "one" meal. LOL. No one in our family was fat. The husband was when I met him but I took him hiking and bought a house in severe need of rehab, and otherwise have kept myself amused keeping him busy.

He's at the weight he was in his twenties, and I'm slowly gaining weight, currently I weight about 10 lbs less than in my twenties, but 18 months of pneumonia really kills your appetite.

I wish they hadn't gotten rid of home ec, shop, and PE. YES, when I moved here and discovered that they were all so frantic about test scores that they removed PE from his schedule (along with music, art etc..) well that is when I went school shopping. Some of the Charter schools were noticeably less sucky, if not in actual test scores, at least by letting kids be kids. Etc.

The Juul is a passing fad, or it freaking WOULDA been if MADD MOMMIES and the MEDIA hadn't done their thing on it. I say MADD did more for juvenile drinking and driving than anything yet. I made sure to obtain a bumper sticker.... LOL.

Anna

 

[Rossum]

The Juul is a passing fad, or it freaking WOULDA been if MADD MOMMIES and the MEDIA hadn't done their thing on it.

Hey, if the media hadn't run so many articles whining that they FDA wasn't doing their jobs because they hadn't yet regulated "electronic cigarettes" back in the second half of 2013, there's a good chance I wouldn't have gotten interested in trying vaping.

 

[Just Me]

Back in the prehistoric days when I was in high school, my algebra teacher (who lived three houses down and was a friend and fellow bridge player with my mother) was absent from class most of the class every day, because she hit the teachers' lounge quite often to smoke.

My, how times have changed.

Wonder if all those educators these days concerned about kids Juuling go home to have a few cocktails in the evenings. Or other things.

As Ricky Ricardo used to say, "It's just so ridiculous."

 

[CarolT]

Nicotine is a vasoconstrictor. It makes blood vessels smaller.

If you knew more about physiology, you wouldn't utter a simplistic generalization like that. Do you know that their experiments are based on measuring blood flow in a finger, while keeping people motionless in rooms that are at at the precise temperature where if it gets warmer there's vasodilation, or if cooler there's vasoconstriction? Anyone can see that if there was anything of practical consequence they wouldn't have to be so incredibly fussy to even detect it. Plus there are autoregulating vascular beds in some body parts which are resistant to effects of vasoconstriction in the first place.

 

[bombastinator]

If you knew more about physiology, you wouldn't utter a simplistic generalization like that. Do you know that their experiments are based on measuring blood flow in a finger, while keeping people motionless in rooms that are at at the precise temperature where if it gets warmer there's vasodilation, or if cooler there's vasoconstriction? Anyone can see that if there was anything of practical consequence they wouldn't have to be so incredibly fussy to even detect it. Plus there are autoregulating vascular beds in some body parts which are resistant to effects of vasoconstriction in the first place.

Neither of which negates the statement. Of particular note the claim about temperature requirement is exceptionally weak. That’s the only way an accurate measurement could be made in the first place regardless of the amount of change.

 

[CarolT]

Neither of which negates the statement. Of particular note the claim about temperature requirement is exceptionally weak. That’s the only way an accurate measurement could be made in the first place regardless of the amount of change.

My point is that if the change was of any practical consequence, it would dwarf those puny effects of temperature, rather than the other way around. The claim is a good example of making a pimple look like a mountain to impress the ignorant.

By the way, skin is poorly autoregulated, muscle is more so, and heart, brain and kidney are strongly autoregulated.

 

[CarolT]

Looks like they're having hissy fits in Milwaukee, too. Don't they have more important stuff to worry about, such as gangs?
https://www.jsonline.com/story/news...g-fad-taking-over-school-bathrooms/378192002/