ECF RBA warning

[skipdashu]

ECF advisory warning

Until rolygate can explain items #3, #4 and #6... I'm branding this as mostly rubbish!

Test it on a unprotected straight battery mod instead of something that'll just turn off or throw a code??? I don't comprehend the logic behind that.

 

[kwalka]

Then why dont you reply to his post that you linked to and call his very accurate info rubbish. This way he will see it and be able to respond if he feels your accusations warrant a response. I am a highly experienced genny user and what is taking place in the vaping community with the flood of RBAs is an accident waiting to happen.

 

[skipdashu]

Then why dont you reply to his post that you linked to and call his very accurate info rubbish. This way he will see it and be able to respond if he feels your accusations warrant a response. I am a highly experienced genny user and what is taking place in the vaping community with the flood of RBAs is an accident waiting to happen.

First off I didn't think I made any "accusations" per se. What I really want is an explanation for those items... mostly around testing on a straight battery device like a SB instead of something that'll just throw a code.

Second, I can't respond there or I would have.

This, from VVTV is likely better stated. Relevant part starts about 2:22 into it.

 

[rolygate]

It's because we were getting complaints that "vendor X's RTA destroyed my APV", or "the vendor sent me an APV and an RTA which self-destructed when I used them together", or "I'm going to post this warning about xxxx vendor everywhere on the forum, their APV melted when I put an RTA on it", and similar stuff.

For a time it looked like there was going to be a war between buyers of RTAs and vendors. At the same time, there had been an outbreak of flame wars in negative reviews between the tribes of one vendor vs the tribes of other vendors, and the RTA thing was going to be used to fan the flames. Things get hot round here sometimes.

So, we posted the RTA info to stop it dead in its tracks. Also, it lays it out like it is: don't use an RTA unless you have some experience, and for sure don't use one unless you have a meter and test it before you put it on your APV. There were people complaining about meltdowns who don't even have a meter, as if they thought the rebuildable atty they bought is some kind of carto you screw on and it will all work fine.

The main issue is that RTAs are being treated as a normal consumer product. They aren't.

They're for people with a meter, who understand that if they make a mistake or are just plain unlucky they will get some form of damage to their equipment. That might only be a melted hot spring (enough of us have done that in the last week or two), but in less common cases we've heard of APVs being wrecked. And then you have to consider the case of someone using a faulty RTA on a mod with no protections of any kind...

So now, all of a sudden, the complaints about 'faulty RTAs' or 'faulty APVs with RTAs' have stopped.

Job done.

 

[skipdashu]

It's because we were getting complaints that "vendor X's RTA destroyed my APV", or "the vendor sent me an APV and an RTA which self-destructed when I used them together", or "I'm going to post this warning about xxxx vendor everywhere on the forum, their APV melted when I put an RTA on it", and similar stuff.

For a time it looked like there was going to be a war between buyers of RTAs and vendors. At the same time, there had been an outbreak of flame wars in negative reviews between the tribes of one vendor vs the tribes of other vendors, and the RTA thing was going to be used to fan the flames. Things get hot round here sometimes.

So, we posted the RTA info to stop it dead in its tracks. Also, it lays it out like it is: don't use an RTA unless you have some experience, and for sure don't use one unless you have a meter and test it before you put it on your APV. There were people complaining about meltdowns who don't even have a meter, as if they thought the rebuildable atty they bought is some kind of carto you screw on and it will all work fine.

The main issue is that RTAs are being treated as a normal consumer product. They aren't.

They're for people with a meter, who understand that if they make a mistake or are just plain unlucky they will get some form of damage to their equipment. That might only be a melted hot spring (enough of us have done that in the last week or two), but in less common cases we've heard of APVs being wrecked. And then you have to consider the case of someone using a faulty RTA on a mod with no protections of any kind...

So now, all of a sudden, the complaints about 'faulty RTAs' or 'faulty APVs with RTAs' have stopped.

Job done.

Thank you. I can understand the mission.

Yea, at our last local vape meet I saw folks with RBAs that I'm sure wouldn't know if a multimeter was in ohm or volt mode or the difference.

 

[rolygate]

Thanks, I hope the explanation has helped. There were a bunch of things happening that week and something had to go in print. It might not be perfect but it's done the job.

The trouble with this sort of situation is that it always breaks on ECF first, because of the intense pressure here. That post about RTAs might well undergo some serious editing in the next year or two, to get it exactly right. That's the way things generally work. But you have to start somewhere; and when the bullets are flying you have to do something fast. It might not be perfect but it's got to be done.

Version 1 can be a bit rough, but you have to start somewhere. As an example take the health info here:
http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...hen-quitting-tobacco-changing-ecigarette.html

It didn't look like that in the early versions, it took time to build it up. There just isn't anywhere else in the world with the sheer volume of reports coming in, that can be distilled into that result. A similar sort of thing happens in other areas, and it either results in plenty of info, or pressure on us, or both.

 

[Switched]

Thanks, I hope the explanation has helped. There were a bunch of things happening that week and something had to go in print. It might not be perfect but it's done the job.

The trouble with this sort of situation is that it always breaks on ECF first, because of the intense pressure here. That post about RTAs might well undergo some serious editing in the next year or two, to get it exactly right. That's the way things generally work. But you have to start somewhere; and when the bullets are flying you have to do something fast. It might not be perfect but it's got to be done.

Version 1 can be a bit rough, but you have to start somewhere. As an example take the health info here:
http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...hen-quitting-tobacco-changing-ecigarette.html

It didn't look like that in the early versions, it took time to build it up. There just isn't anywhere else in the world with the sheer volume of reports coming in, that can be distilled into that result. A similar sort of thing happens in other areas, and it either results in plenty of info, or pressure on us, or both.

Chris,

I never saw the original version that caused all the hoopla, but the 2nd amended version looks fine as is. A vaper without a DMM is like a doctor without a stethoscope.

OTOH knowledge as stated is key, these devices are intended for intermediate to seasoned vapers. Knowing the capabilities of your electronic device is key here (it will protect itself). I am not to fussy with the recommendation of testing them on a simple battery mod as a coil can test good and fail within moments/minutes of firing and could result in a thermal runaway.

All that being said... you can get a decent DMM with on off switch and an audible continuity alarm, leave it on the "alarm" setting. It is a quick reference check. If it beeps all is well, if not, start troubleshooting. Never check with another device (which a lot of folks do)

 

[st0nedpenguin]

If you're using an electronic device that doesn't have enough protection to handle a shorted coil then in all honesty you needed to buy a better one anyway.

I haven't metered a coil in months and haven't had a single issue.

 

[rolygate]

Chris,

I never saw the original version that caused all the hoopla, but the 2nd amended version looks fine as is. A vaper without a DMM is like a doctor without a stethoscope. ...............

I changed a couple of words because after a few days and looking at it again, it didn't read how I wrote it, if you see what I mean.

Someone complained that a 'faulty' RBA had taken out their electronic APV, I forget now what the device was. It wasn't one of the big names as I'd remember that.

After I've built and tested a coil/wick, it's run up on a basic 3.7v device. That way it gets cooked in nicely on a low voltage, and you also know exactly what the volts are. Who knows what the real voltage of some of these devices is, it's unlikely to be what the LCD readout says. Chopped or pulsed voltages do make a difference to whatever they're being fed into, the waveform sometimes has an effect (try using a stepped square wave inverter vs a sinewave inverter). Who knows if this affects a simple resistive load much; but on the other hand, look at a slow-blow fuse - it's physically different because there is a physical component to electrickery. If it works OK for half an hour on my SB I just feel happier.

Just old-fashioned I guess.

 

[tierrataz]

Roly, I found your usage of 'Electronic' unclear. Do you mean only devices with electronics on board? Many seasoned gen heads prefer mechanical devices for obvious reasons. IMO, anyone recharging batts is foolish to not own/understand/use regularly a multimeter. Then there is that vendor slogan...just vape it. Scary times.

 

[rolygate]

Someone in that crazy week told us that an RBA had fried their electronic APV. It wasn't one of the big names or I'd remember it.

Properly built electronic devices have short-circuit protection. But to say that *all* electronic mods are protected against a dead short might be a little optimistic. All we can do is tell people that RTAs aren't for beginners; you need a meter; you need to take care; if something goes wrong and you melt a hot spring or worse - that's just par for the course, you can't blame anyone (except yourself or bad luck).

How would you like to see the Negative Reviews forum full of complaints about 'faulty' RTAs or 'destroyed' APVs or demands for compensation?

No, we didn't think it was great idea, either

 

[Switched]

Someone in that crazy week told us that an RBA had fried their electronic APV. It wasn't one of the big names or I'd remember it.

Properly built electronic devices have short-circuit protection. But to say that *all* electronic mods are protected against a dead short might be a little optimistic. All we can do is tell people that RTAs aren't for beginners; you need a meter; you need to take care; if something goes wrong and you melt a hot spring or worse - that's just par for the course, you can't blame anyone (except yourself or bad luck).

How would you like to see the Negative Reviews forum full of complaints about 'faulty' RTAs or 'destroyed' APVs or demands for compensation?

No, we didn't think it was great idea, either

The downside of ECF Chris if there is one, is that a spark on ECF = a wildfire, and from that I mean, everyone that may or may not have occurred an instance jumping on the "latest" bandwagon because the "device" is not what they thought it was. The responsible sites I have visited do have that disclaimer e.g for advance users. So we do need to be cautious here, just saying...

 

[BJ43]

If you're using an electronic device that doesn't have enough protection to handle a shorted coil then in all honesty you needed to buy a better one anyway.

I haven't metered a coil in months and haven't had a single issue.

Some of the most experienced electronic gurus here have had their Provaris blow with s shorted SS wick or continually using them at their minimum ohms, protection is just that, it is not fail safe. Continually stressing them to their limits is the same as redlining your engine all the time.