EU EU plans to ban e-cigarettes?

[mc8]

I received this information from our ministry of health today. They told me, that position of EU is to classify e cigarettes as medicine or medical device, otherwise they must be forbidden.
And our agency for drugs an medical devices clearly stated that e cigarettes cannot be classified as medicine or medical device (which makes sense, but actually makes thing worse in this case).

Feels like: either you're smoking our drugs, or you are a criminal..

 

[Bill Godshall]

I haven't seen/heard any news or other reports indicating that the EU has proposed banning e-cigarettes.

It would be helpful if folks posted news articles or other documents instead of simply posting unsubstantiated rumors.

 

[Bill Godshall]

Found this hyped-up news article, but no legislative proposal is cited.
Anti-tobacco campaign heralds new regulations | EurActiv

According to the article, the EU is launching another new website to purportedly help smokers quit at
ExSmokers - Home

The article's only references to new regulations and/or e-cigarettes are:

"At the launch, Dalli told EurActiv that he was considering further legislative proposals to be announced next year as the campaign progresses."
and
"He said existing legislation could be broadened to cover potentially harmful non-tobacco products – such as electronic cigarettes – aroma-sweetening flavourings added to tobacco, advertising, packaging, and the way tobacco is marketed in shops."

 

[rolygate]

The EU has made no decision on e-cigarettes yet. However, all the signs are that within the next year, they will issue a directive classifying e-cigarettes as a pharmaceutical. The pharmaceutical industry is spending a great deal of money to ensure this happens because, as was the case with Snus, e-cigarettes are a serious threat to NRT sales.

Please give your location when making a post like this, as it helps. I do know your location but others might also be interested. Of course, if you do not want to post with your location, that's fine. It seems that in your country, one agency has taken the pharma money and another has not. That is an interesting situation because it looks as if the medical licensing agency is not within the health department.

Difficult times ahead for EU vapers. It looks as if many vendors will have to move offshore to countries that have less corruption.

 

[mc8]

Ok, let me tell the longer version.

Few months ago, i called our ministry of health, asking what their position on e cigarettes is. They told me that this "agency for drugs and medical devices" is preparing new regulation regarding them. So i contacted them, asking what its all about, and what their plan is. They replied that this is true, but also that they still don't know what to do with e cigarettes. So i send them a 4 pages long letter, explaining how it is not really fair to classify those as medicine or medical device, as it is only an alternative to smoking. And they agreed to that.
Today i called the ministry of health again, asking what the plan is now. They told me, they received proposal from EU, that they either classify e cigarettes as medicine, medical devices, or otherwise ban them. And that all EU countries were supposed to do that.

Sorry that i have no links to confirm that, its just what they told me. I wish it is only a rumor, but they sounded very convincing.

 

[Vap0rJay]

I look at it this way, they ban e-cigs... i'll just start carrying around a lightbulb vaporizer.

There is no lit tobacco this way, there is nothing electronic; Ergo, not banned.

And of course, they decide to ban light bulbs and classify light bulbs as medical devices... we start playing chemist and use say... white phosphorus or something as the heating source... Then it too is neither combustible tobacco nor is it electronic.

Then we start sprinkling nic on bail leaves oh yeah. Smoking basil in public places is not illegal -- it’s only tobacco!

For every ban, there is an equally creative loophole.

 

[rolygate]

@mc8
As far as we know, the EU has not started an assault on e-cigarettes as yet. They cannot send out directives to individual countries without a central policy, and that policy has not yet been decided.

But as I said, all the signs are that they will direct member countries to class e-cigarettes as pharmaceuticals because their policy is to ban anything that threatens pharma income, even if it will be 100 times more effective in reducing the death rate.

 

[Vocalek]

mc8: Can you call back and ask the Ministry of Health to mail (or email) you a copy of any correspondence they have received from EU that mentions e-cigarettes? I don't know what the laws are in Sovenia, but in the US we have the Freedom of Information Act that states government officials must provide copies of documents when a citizen requests it. Of course, sometimes pertinent information is completely blacked out (this is called "redacted"). The government usually claims that the purpose of blocking this information is is to prevent security breeches or to protect an individual's privacy. Nevertheless, readable portion of the document usually provides some useful information that has been overlooked or withheld when communicating with the public.

 

[Tom09]

The EU is presently in the process of revising it’s Tobacco Products Directive (which will likely cover e-cigs, among many other issues). There had been a public consultation last year, but there will be no official document publicly available until the EU Commission releases it’s Proposal. Release of the Proposal was planned for end of 2011 (see timeline here), but became apparently delayed until mid-2012. The proposed Directive then has to go through an inter-service consultation and has to be adopted by the EU Parliament and the EU Council (heads of EU member state governments). Following adoption of the EU Directive, it’s content has then to be implemented, i.e. written into national law of the individual states. [Even in the worst case, with presently 27 member states there will remain legal places for selling “e-cigs” from within the EU market /customs border for the next 5 years, at least.]
Slovenia is still a relatively new EU member (entry 2004). Could imagine that a young member’s government would feel eager to adopt and comply with anything coming from Brussels. Like rolygate said, there is nothing yet decided at the EU level, officially, but the writing is all over the wall (i.e. de facto ban by medical classification, as already done by some EU member states). Perhaps this Ministry of Health is acting to comply in advance with a law that does not yet exist. Would certainly be interesting to learn more about the alleged proposal.

 

[arbogast]

Still, this is worrying. We do need an EU organization working in parallel with ECCA and CASAA.

I'm very interested in participating, but haven't got that much experience in setting up an organization (none, actually), though I'm in the process of starting one here in Norway. It's a lot of work for one person, though - especially without the overview (legal, political, administrative) that some persons posess.

I'll be very willing to help where I can, though.

 

[rolygate]

People in many EU countries have now woken up to the fact that maintaining the status quo and their right to vape is simply a dream.

They need to take action. It's true that we are limited in what action we can take unless we have large funds to go to law, but nevertheless the first step is to organise, then make sure the media have the true facts, and that bans only benefit the pharmaceutical industry and not public health. A great deal more publicity needs to take place. Silence only allows the pharma industry to shut down all competitors.

This has all happened before, and your local media need to be made aware of the fact that Sweden reduced the number of smokers by 40% due to the free availability of smoking replacement products; and that they negotiated an exemption to the EU ban on Snus when they joined the EU - rightly, since why would they want to join a federation that would otherwise kill tens of thousands of their citizens. In contrast, smoking prevalence is virtually the same year on year in many countries, including the UK and US. The sickness and death rate is artificially maintained in the EU in order to accommodate the pharmaceutical industry, and it looks as if they will also be able to include e-cigs soon.

Sweden has the lowest smoking-related death rate in the developed world by a wide margin, so there is plenty of evidence that tobacco harm reduction works. More than 150 clinical trials and surveys add to the argument, as if that were needed.

 

[arbogast]

Snus is legal here in Norway as well (Norway isn't a member of the EU, but of the EEA agreement). I haven't found any similar statistcs reg Norway. Public opinion is, that snus is as 'wrong' as tobacco, it seems.

I'm looking into concrete actions as well as setting up an organisation of users. But not having the organisational experience, skills or, I suspect, talent. It's an intimidating endeavour. TW has a small Norwegian forum and a cpl of members have expressed their interest in helping. But nothing concrete so far.

Rolygate. Do you know if a group is working on setting up an EU association?

Thanks for answering, btw. I've read a great any of your posts. Enlightening!

 

[rolygate]

Arbo, it does not need any talent in order to set up a national consumer's association, but it does need motivation. The methodology can be acquired. Normally, our groups start out from the forum members. Those who want to fight for their rights instead of accepting what they are told to do by others will get together and form an informal group. It gradually evolves into something more concrete.

So far we only have formalised associations in the UK and Holland. Germany is just starting. It is thought that when there are three European countries with consumer groups, we could start a European federation of electronic cigarette consumer associations.

Why we need consumer associations
It is important to have consumer groups for these reasons:

1. To counter the accusation that e-cigarette activism is entirely a commercial activity organised by vendors to promote sales. Politicians and the press need to be told that there are thousands of consumers who won't accept their rights being removed, without protest.

2. To act as a contact point for the media. The press will look for consumers to speak with, when they need information, because they are well aware that vendors have a commercial agenda and will promote their own products. Consumers give an honest answer. We have already liaised with the giant commercial market data researchers and major media names such as the NY Times.

3. To provide truthful information in order to counter the lies and propaganda that commercial rivals produce and propagate.

4. To point out that the current situation with regard to the smoking-related death rate is stagnant, with no change for several years, despite the expenditure of huge sums that have been completely wasted. In contrast, one country reduced the death rate by 40%, but this fact is being concealed from the public and the decision-makers.

 

[arbogast]

I agree with all of your points - though I might want to add one, namely that the appearance of PVs challenges the present stance to harm reduction (as you know, surely)

Oh, and I'm motivated, which is why I'm slowly trying to get the ball rolling here in Norway. I'll make posts here at ECF when that happens.
Hopefully I'll manage to find others to work with (or they'll find me).

Thanks a lot for your input.

 

[Tom09]

A recent short note in Tobacco Reporter Mag. and check on EU Commission’s calendar indicates that the awaited Commission’s Proposal on a revision of the Tobacco Products Directive is now expected to be published end of year 2012. So, E-cigs have gained just a little more time to prepare for a possible EU end game.

 

[rolygate]

Thank you, Tom.

 

[arbogast]

Yup. Thanks for the heads-up.

I'm in the final stages of registering the norwegian user organization, Norsk Dampselskap (which means something like Norwegian Steam Association).

Next up is building a memberbase. Hopefully a few members will want to participate actively.
A year is NOT a long time if national organizations are to be built, not to mention linked well enough to coordinate their efforts.

So every european vaper:

* Spend some extra time on the web today to find out if someone in your country has started, or are in the process of starting a user organization. Become a member. Volunteer if you have the time.

* If there's no such organization where you live. Start one.

 

[Frody]

...So far we only have formalised associations in the UK and Holland. Germany is just starting. It is thought that when there are three European countries with consumer groups, we could start a European federation of electronic cigarette consumer associations.

I'm a member of the first german association, the "Interessengemeinschaft E-Dampfen". We're in big trouble at the moment in Germany (and many other countries). Every day a new press article with the same horrible lies and some states want to ban the e-cigarette due to presumptions.
We're very interested in the idea of a European federation of electronic cigarette consumer associations.
Rolygate, Arbogast, please get in contact with me (private Message). Thanks.

 

[arbogast]

Will do as soon as possible.

 

[Tom09]

Parliamentary question to the EU Commission concerning “e-cigarettes”

Although there are signs on the wall, it is still not known - officially - how the EU is going to address e-cigs in their pending Revision of the Tobacco Products Directive. A recent parliamentary question by K.-H. Florenz apparently aims to provoke an official answer. MEP Florenz is from the German state (Land) of North Rhine Westphalia (NRW), where e-cig prohibition and denial of basic harm reduction principles is presently running wild (health minister Barbara Steffens). Traditionally, Florenz acted as a figure at the political forefront of the German tobacco control establishment. Accordingly, his question implies a pharmaceutical regulatory framework (de-facto prohibition), and his accompanying German press release was all about “think of the children.” Nonetheless, it could be useful to watch this EU site for the Commission’s official answer, expected to be published within some weeks.