FlavourArt DIY

[Matt-Tucson]

Wise vape Masters,

Just starting out on DIY, I couldn't wait. I'm of the mad scientist type. Having some issues w/ FA flavors:

I must be missing something because everywhere it says that FlavourArt is so strong, but I have used up to 14% on Vanilla Classic, probably 6+% on Black Cherry, and 5+% on cola and I don't feel like I'm getting the flavor I should be. Do I need to mix these with sucralose or something to bring out the flavors? I have been adding few % water to a 70/30 for pretty much every attempt. I can't tell if I have too much or too little of the flavors, especially the cola and black cherry. It tastes strange, dare I say more chemical than flavor, not very strong though. I thought I'd consult the oracles here before I wasted anymore juice. Thx You guys kick ....

 

[Matt-Tucson]

I shook viogorously and let steep, not for 24-48 hours, but still enough to see where it's going!

 

[zoiDman]

What was your Exact recipe and how did you measure it?

 

[breaktru]

Haven't tried the FA black cherry but many brand cherry flavors taste chemical like to me.

 

[Sedateme]

I've heard from a few experienced DIY'rs you really need to let FA flavorings steep for a week before the flavors fully diffuse and are vapeable. Kind of a tradeoff... using less flavoring (more economical) but you don't get to dive right in immediately. I've got some on the way to try myself.

 

[Hoosier]

Welcome to your new obsess... errr.. hobby!

Yeah, you've found the focal point of DIY, at least for me, the flavor ratio.

Here are the Hoosier levels of flavoring from too little to too much:
Nothing (Did I forget to add the flavoring?)
Something Odd (This does not taste like the flavor I put in there.)
I Can Taste Something Kinda' Like It (I can detect the higher or spice notes, but not the actual taste)
Hooo, It's There, but Real Light (Getting close now, let it steep before adding any more)
Bingo (Duh, we have a juice)
Hmmmm, That Is Close, But Has A "Je Ne Sais Pas" of Oddness (Dang didn't let it steep and I overshot)
Kinda' Close, but the Perfumey/Chemically Kills It (Going into the too much realm here.)
Whoo, Did I Forget to Put the Flavoring In? (Too much flavoring can actually make things impossible to taste.)

Note that the first tier and last tier are much alike, the only difference is the way the unvaped juice smells. If it smells fairly close, but has no flavor then it is usually too much. (Usually, not always as there are exceptions.)

Now, for tobacco flavors, the rules change again as you can get completely different tastes depending on level and a number of them may be usable and good, just different.

 

[Rimau]

Hoosier -- I have heard that you really need to let the tobacco flavors "age" more that other flavors. True? Any advice on how long? Thanks

 

[Hoosier]

Yeah, it's true.

I happen to be staring at a bottle of a tobacco juice I mixed last week that tasted like nothing when I mixed it. It now has a full flavor without the spice notes I know would come with a higher flavoring %. (I'm working up a new recipe and this one will be a base, so I'm trying to find the right ratio for this flavor before I start combining with the others. Tobacco flavor can completely change with the % of flavoring.)

So, about a week was right for this one and is usually true for me that tobaccos need about a week in general.

 

[Matt-Tucson]

Hoosier, I love your tier system, thanks for sharing! Yes, it truly is an obsession. I have started calling my mod "My Precious" and retreating to vape in my basement "lab."

The FA flavors are significantly better after the last two days. It really is a huge difference! I still need to tweak things, but I don't think I'm totally off now! Thanks all!

 

[Rimau]

Hoosier, thanks. That's good and bad news. Good since I know what to expect, bad because of the wait, but I am sure it is worth it. I guess that is what happens with the premixed, it takes at least a week between preparing it and shipping. Sometimes it is probably much more that a week.

 

[Desertfremen]

I use mostly FA flavourings. They aren't quite like most other flavourings I used. First almost all of them even the fruits aren't sweetened. I do find them slightly acidic as well which is why almost all my fruit flavours utilise Magic Mask.

As far as concentration goes with FA fruits I use 10-20%. More often the avg is 15-20%. I've tried them at lower concentrations and higher and definitely think 10% is the bottom starting point for fruit flavours.

I too use Vanilla Classic as I like it much better than the tahiti version and I too use this at 20%.

Working with FA does need to be done differently from other flavourings. I haven't found an FA flavouring that could be used straight out of the bottle. They all need tweaking. This makes things more difficult but I find the clarity of the flavour provided to be far more worth the extra tweaking time to tailor the flavour to your preferences.

BTW I find Hoosiers table for flavouring reference to be spot on!

 

[Matt-Tucson]

Desertfremen, thanks for your share on FA %s. I thought maybe I was crazy since most people (that I've read) report low percentages. What % do you usually use for non-fruit flavors besides vanilla?

 

[Cyberpixie]

You may also want to consider how you're measuring everything. For instance if you're measuring your nic, PG and VG in syringes but using flavour by drops out of the bottles they come in then it's actually closer to 30 drops out of the flavouring bottles compared to the syringes to equal a ml. I set calculators to 30 drops per ml, measure everything with syringes by ml's then consider 30 drops from the flavouring bottles to equal a ml to match the syringe measurements. When I first started DIY I used the 20 drops for a ml for the flavouring but it was too weak.

 

[Matt-Tucson]

Thx, yeah when I made those batchs I believe I dropped them from a 5ml bottle from FSUSA. (not sure if I did 20 count, probably) Since then I recieved some 1 ml marked pipettes, so I'll most likely use those when the flavor volume is large enough to accurately use. For smaller batches I'll probably drop. You know what, FA is so concentrated I may just always drop, we'll see. I will try 30 drops/ml though. I have started testing the drop counts, but I'm hesitant to do that with flavors since they may vary and it is more of a pain. Figuring things out 30 is probably close enough.

 

[Desertfremen]

For tobacco flavours it depends. Just as Hoosier said tobaccos present themselves differently at different strengths. However anything over 10% with tobaccos seems to be too much across the board. I'd'start at 1% with the tobaccos and work up from there. Menthols seem to work very good at 5%.

There is one more thing...i wouldnt use drops with FA at all. At the very least mix up your flavourings together first then add the flavouring mixture to the final juice mixture. For example the amounts of Magic Mask that I use is only 1% in the flavouring mix so in the final juice mixture with the flavouring percentage at 15 the Magic Mask concentration is only going to be 0.15%. It is impossible to measure this small of an amount with drops unless you are making a very large batch.

 

[Rimau]

Are tobacco flavorings always so flowery? I've even got some RY4 that seems a bit too flowery. I am hoping that aging will mellow it out, if not I will try and throw in some caramel or something. I like my flavor a bit light, but I have been using much more than the 2-5% I have been seeing on other posts. Everyone is saying how strong FA is, but Desertfremen is right, 10-20% seems normal and 10 is just about right for a weaker flavor.

 

[pinellaspete]

Are tobacco flavorings always so flowery? I've even got some RY4 that seems a bit too flowery. I am hoping that aging will mellow it out, if not I will try and throw in some caramel or something. I like my flavor a bit light, but I have been using much more than the 2-5% I have been seeing on other posts. Everyone is saying how strong FA is, but Desertfremen is right, 10-20% seems normal and 10 is just about right for a weaker flavor.

Wow that's a lot of flavor!
For the FA tobaccos I typically use only 2 drops per 5ml. It does take about a week for them to come into their own though. Some of the tobaccos like Desert Ship knock my socks off at 2 drops per 5 ml.

I think the flowery taste you are tasting might be from not steeping long enough. The FA flavors generally take a week of steeping to taste right.

Pete

 

[Prettycat191]

If you use too much flavor then it also makes a weaker flavor as well, so keep that in mind too.

 

[Shilo]

I was really disappointed with all the tobacco flavors I tried but my husband likes some of them. I can't get over the moldy hay musty cheap cigarish smell most of them have. It doesn't matter what level you mix it if you are repulsed by a smell nothing can help that. And as far as the taste, don't get me going on that. Flavour Art in other flavors and Vape Wizard and Bitter Wizard are all great though.

 

[Matt-Tucson]

Anyone have any place they use to find out what % to use for FlavourArt? I have found SOME in here and another resource is flavor reviews on liberty flights (if someone happened to share what works for them.)

It would be nice if ECF had some system for people voting on their favorite percentages. The diy eliquid threads listing is not very good for this.