Does it say in the report how often they are clean? that all of it is 100% food grade. We all know there is risks. But please let us know with out it seeming to be a scare tactic, or at lest I feel like it is.
Fog Machine Fog Causes Decrease in Lung Function - Comparison to e-Cigs
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No, it unfortunately doesn't say all of the above. Also, I do apologize for my reckless titling of this thread.
Thank you
Now I really feel like a heel because of my bad choice of words for the title of this thread...
There may be other factors as well which is why we should have more studies to back up vaping.
I wouldn't consider a rock concert, bar or other venue where fog machines are used to be exactly clean. What about all the dust and dirt in the air picked up by water vapor and breathed?
We don't do that with our direct vaping.
But the OP's original post is well noted by me, no problem wid it.
I wouldn't consider a rock concert, bar or other venue where fog machines are used to be exactly clean. What about all the dust and dirt in the air picked up by water vapor and breathed?
We don't do that with our direct vaping.
But the OP's original post is well noted by me, no problem wid it.
I have CT scans for watching lung nodule growth and they do pulmonary function tests as well, every 3-6 months. All my tests since quitting smoking and started vaping havee shown VAST improvement and my last function test read me as completely normal-at the high end at that
I do too CTJ, exact same thing, and also have to do CTs and pulmonary function tests every 6 months. It wasn't enough to get me to quit smoking. It boggles my mind. I haven't had the opportunity to see my pulmonologist since I started vaping. I'm due for recheck in June and I'm sure there will be a marked improvement.
It's only been a month and I can honestly say, I haven't had to use my inhaler or give myself a breathing treatment with my nebulizer. I forget to use my Advair or Symbicort most mornings. I'm that much better in only one month.
I don't believe comparing a fog machine to an e-cig is a fair comparison. The way the liquid we inhale is vaporized differently than the way fog is created from a machine. Correct me if I'm wrong but the e-liquids we inhale have been created to deliver nicotine, not just solely produce "fog".
I would hate to see anyone afraid to quit smoking and start vaping because they are frightened into believing everything they read
I'm way more afraid of smoking cigarettes today than I could have ever imagined - because I now vape
Another page on fog juice lists the contents from one common supplier (scroll down to "Table of numerous versions").
One blend, for instance, contains 30% distilled water, 35% dipropylene glycol, and 35% triethylene glycol. Others contain only propylene glycol and distilled water.
I've never heard of mineral oil (mentioned in the abstract) being used in fog machines, but if mineral oil was inhaled along with glycols in the experiments, it seriously confounds any conclusion. Acute mineral oil inhalation causes a kind of chemical pneumonia known as lipoid pneumonia, and chronic inhalation causes cough, shortness of breath and other nasties. (See OSHA's info sheet on this.)
(I should add, it's an interesting study. I just wanted to point out the potential confounders w.r.t. any conclusion on e-cig vapor. But I think it's important that we're all on the lookout for data! ~study fiend)
One blend, for instance, contains 30% distilled water, 35% dipropylene glycol, and 35% triethylene glycol. Others contain only propylene glycol and distilled water.
I've never heard of mineral oil (mentioned in the abstract) being used in fog machines, but if mineral oil was inhaled along with glycols in the experiments, it seriously confounds any conclusion. Acute mineral oil inhalation causes a kind of chemical pneumonia known as lipoid pneumonia, and chronic inhalation causes cough, shortness of breath and other nasties. (See OSHA's info sheet on this.)
(I should add, it's an interesting study. I just wanted to point out the potential confounders w.r.t. any conclusion on e-cig vapor. But I think it's important that we're all on the lookout for data! ~study fiend
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Hey Thye.
Crazy....You aren't a heel in my book. You are here trying to get informed and share more info. That's a babyface in my book.
It really wasn't about the info, just the title mislead me.
Happy Vaping!!
Crazy....You aren't a heel in my book. You are here trying to get informed and share more info. That's a babyface in my book.
It really wasn't about the info, just the title mislead me.
Happy Vaping!!
Thank you
Now I really feel like a heel because of my bad choice of words for the title of this thread...
Easy....no problem. We can be a bit defensive of our habit. I'm sure you meant no harm and there is no reason not to believe it could potentially decrease lung function to a degree.
The title was inacurate though no offense taken by me.
Found a mod (first I had to figure out what color the mods names are in) and PM'd that request.
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Thank you
Now I really feel like a heel because of my bad choice of words for the title of this thread...
If my post came across defensive, or offensive , I sincerely apologize. It wasn't personally directed at you. I am just very grateful I discovered vaping - I believe it's saving my life No worries! I am sorry as well, last week I saw one post were all it seemed like was that the person was talking about how bad PG and VG. Making it sound like he was worried and to me was a you should quit it for your heath, and I still stand firm on that with the post he had through out the tread. Yet I still see him online posting about how happy he is that he is vaping.
So I'll state it again. I am really sorry I was thinking I had found another hypocrite. I am really sorry about that.
So I'll state it again. I am really sorry I was thinking I had found another hypocrite. I am really sorry about that.
Not at all
I am just very grateful I discovered vaping - I believe it's saving my life
I am too, and I too believe that it will help to save my life...as soon as I get the darn thing (tomorrow...I really hope anyway).
You've got nothing to apologize for either, although I appreciate gesture. (This really is a great bunch of people at this forum isn't it?)
I've PM'd the only mod I could find online to have them change the title.
The real purpose of my post was simply to try and start a discussion about how there is a possibility of vaping causing a decrease in lung function. I wholeheartedly believe that there is a real possibility of that....however:
I don't think it would be anywhere near what smoking definitely causes as far as lung function decrease
AND
I'm SURE vaping is light years ahead of smoking in terms of overall safety.
I would be far more worried, if what you quoted did not talk about "mineral oil" as well, as Madame Psychosis also had pointed out. And I have my doubts that even for PG based fog, they use USP-grade PG.
However, this is still not fresh mountain air we inhale when sucking on our PVs, and that's not even mentioning the potential flavour problem. Compared to cigarettes, chances are excellent that it is healtier. Compared to fresh mountain air, though, they are not exactly bad, either, that it is less healthy. Particularly since I have serious doubts that those stage workers had more exposure to the fog than we have to our vapes.
However, this is still not fresh mountain air we inhale when sucking on our PVs, and that's not even mentioning the potential flavour problem. Compared to cigarettes, chances are excellent that it is healtier. Compared to fresh mountain air, though, they are not exactly bad, either, that it is less healthy. Particularly since I have serious doubts that those stage workers had more exposure to the fog than we have to our vapes.
I posted this in another thread but here are several more references about the toxicology of PG (most in reference to inhalation) and are way better references than wikpedia..
Time:
http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,932876-1,00.html
Journal of Pharmacology:
http://jpet.aspetjournals.org/content/91/1/52.abstract
British Medical Journal- Occupational and Enviromental Medicine (have to sign up for free)
http://oem.bmj.com/content/58/10/649.full
CDC - Agency for Toxic Substances & Disease Registry
http://www.atsdr.cdc.gov/csem/egpg/propylene_glycol.html
NASA - published by the National Academies Press
http://books.nap.edu/openbook.php?record_id=12529&page=314
Time:
http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,932876-1,00.html
Journal of Pharmacology:
http://jpet.aspetjournals.org/content/91/1/52.abstract
British Medical Journal- Occupational and Enviromental Medicine (have to sign up for free)
http://oem.bmj.com/content/58/10/649.full
CDC - Agency for Toxic Substances & Disease Registry
http://www.atsdr.cdc.gov/csem/egpg/propylene_glycol.html
NASA - published by the National Academies Press
http://books.nap.edu/openbook.php?record_id=12529&page=314
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hmmm....
decrease in lung function vs. cancer and inhaling 4,000 plus chemicals into my body that is poisonous?
I'll take my chances as well. I'm not about to believe that the ecig is worse than the analog.
decrease in lung function vs. cancer and inhaling 4,000 plus chemicals into my body that is poisonous?
I'll take my chances as well. I'm not about to believe that the ecig is worse than the analog.
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