Glycerin Safety Study & Atty/Carto Temperature Question

[MilkyG]

1) I'm not sure if this has already been referenced on the forum (my apologies if it has), but here's a very comprehesive safety/toxicology study from the UK (2002) on the effects of glycerin (glycerol, VG, etc.) exposure via multiple routes of administration. Their conclusion is that glycerin is of low toxicity regardless of exposure method. Here's the link:

http://www.chem.unep.ch/irptc/sids/OECDSIDS/56815.pdf

Side note: There are also various references for the use of oral glycerin to prevent dehydration in runners/athletes and to prevent and break-up kidney stones...these I'll be researching until I find a reputable source and conclusion.

2) Does anyone know the typical use and max atty/carto temps for popular models? I'm trying to figure out the acroline decomposition potential of glycerin during vaping...acroline is a corrosive and toxic gas that begins to form at around 290 degC. Hopefully no attys get this hot during routine use.

Thanks!

 

[jj2]

This was discussed way back when---nothing wrong with revisiting it again because there's a lot of new people around.

I'll see if I can find the thread.

 

[jj2]

Here ya go.

http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/experiments-equipment/14359-decomposition-vg-acrolein.html

http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...n-acrolein-problem-anyone-vaping-vg-read.html

 

[johnny bobcat]

I believe attys only get up to around 350 Fahrenheit, which is nowhere near 290c

 

[kinabaloo]

The temps depend on the voltage (primarily) and can range from faint dark red glow to white hot (when coil dries). You can look up the corresponding numbers if you wish.

While pure VG will certainly produce some acrolein when boiling, when it is part of a mixture with other lower BP liquids such as water, the 'composite BP', if you will, is lower. However, there is the possibility of some fractional distillation occuring so I'd say that there is a chance of acrolein, but it's not somethng I worry too much about. AFAIK, there is no better answer than that. Sure, some studies claim zero but for reasons too complex to discuss in this quick overview I don't put much credence in them.

I think there is more to worry about from burning dry residues (that I have discussed at length elsewhere).

In short, I'd say that even with these concerns, and making a best guess about others, known and what might remain unknown, vaping is very likely ~100x safer than smoking (there might be a small minority for which it is unsuitable, however).

I'd take care to avoid use and conditions that give rise to any unpleasant tastes and smells. Keep e-liquids air-tight and cool/cold/frozen when not in use / in storage. I'd also suggest that lower voltages are likely to be more healthy. And if you want to be especially careful, consider changing atomisers at regular intervals or when no longer work well.

There are many things in terms of lifestyle, home materials, diet etc that would make more impact than anything harmful from vaping; as far as I can tell; nobody can be certain

 

[Rocketman]

I vape PG/VG blends (usually )and avoid burnt components as much as possible. Happens, but not often. Guess I'm getting the hang of the equipment and vaping.

But, you don't see much safety data on High Heat vaping (really low resistance or really high voltage). Is one safer than the other? When the heater is creating vapor I would think the temperature is held below any dangerous temperature by the heat load presented by the liquid being boiled. Is it possible to pump in too many watts and create bad chemical reactions?

When people compare vaping to smoking there isn't any mention of these special cases.
I don't think the big e-cig guys (you know the ones in the FDA court battle) would even think about mentioning some of the "special" conditions being used by some.

Is the vapor being produced by a high heat MOD hotter?

 

[MilkyG]

...While pure VG will certainly produce some acrolein when boiling, when it is part of a mixture with other lower BP liquids such as water, the 'composite BP', if you will, is lower...

I don't pre-dilute my VG with water or PGA, but I always mix with PG (usually at 50/50) for my liquids, which also lowers the boiling point. I know some use strictly VG because of allergy/sensitivity issues to PG, so cutting it with something else would be advisable to anyone using neat VG for this concern alone. Plus it keeps attys from gunking up too quickly and improves wicking. Thanks for the input.

 

[kinabaloo]

I don't pre-dilute my VG with water or PGA, but I always mix with PG (usually at 50/50) for my liquids, which also lowers the boiling point. I know some use strictly VG because of allergy/sensitivity issues to PG, so cutting it with something else would be advisable to anyone using neat VG for this concern alone. Plus it keeps attys from gunking up too quickly and improves wicking. Thanks for the input.

In the case of pure VG, partial decomposition (with some acrolein production) occurs at a temp slightly lower than the BP. When their is a mix of liquids the situation is complex but should mean a lowered acrolein production, perhaps far lower, maybe negligible. But I can't say for sure. But I feel that it is much safer than smoking. I generally use a PG / VG / ethanol (and perhaps tiny amount of water) mix.