GT CCELL coil issues!

[Mordacai]

Punk In Drublic, the coils are SS316L.

They coil is placed inside a porous ceramic tube which acts as the wick and is held in the metal housing with cotton to prevent leaking.

Been using them for quite some time at the settings I've posted on a vaporesso Switcher, and then a luxe. They seem to give you the best results.

Also forgot to mention Wattage, 30 Watts.

 

[Mordacai]

TrollDragon, did you create a custom TCR with Escribe?

 

[Punk In Drublic]

Punk In Drublic, the coils are SS316L.

They coil is placed inside a porous ceramic tube which acts as the wick and is held in the metal housing with cotton to prevent leaking.

Been using them for quite some time at the settings I've posted on a Vaporesso Switcher, and then a Luxe. They seem to give you the best results.

Also forgot to mention Wattage, 30 Watts.

I understand the coil is SS316. But the coil is only used to heat up the ceramic element. No juice touches the SS coil as it does with a non ceramic setup therefore the amount of saturation does not influence the temperature of the coil as it does with a regular, non ceramic setup.

The mod is trying to control the temp of the SS coil, not the ceramic heating element which has a difference temp coefficiancy than Stainless.

 

[Mordacai]

Punk In Drublic, TCR relates to the change in resistance of the coil. Not the wicking!

 

[Punk In Drublic]

Punk In Drublic, TCR relates to the change in resistance of the coil. Not the wicking!

I understand that. But the ceramic is neither the coil nor the wick – it is a heat distributor (for lack of better explanation).

If your SS coil raises in resistance by x amount, the algorithms within the device will predict the coils temperature therefore adjust its output. With a regular coil this is influenced by how saturated your wick is. So if your device is trying to calculate the temperature of the SS coil, what is the temperature of the ceramic? This is not a 1:1 ratio for the ceramic has different temperature properties than a SS coil.

 

[Mordacai]

Punk In Drublic, the ceramic is an insulator and part of the wicking system. It is indirectly heated by the SS316L coil.

 

[TrollDragon]

TrollDragon, did you create a custom TCR with Escribe?

Tried quite a few, gave up in the end as SS316L is not my first choice for TC vaping. If I have to play with it to get the TC working then I just don't bother.

It's either NiFe48 or SS430 here, I'm wondering how the new Crown 4 SS904L coils will fare under TC.

 

[Punk In Drublic]

Punk In Drublic, the ceramic is an insulator and part of the wicking system. It is indirectly heated by the SS316L coil.

The ceramic is not part of the wicking system. It is part of the heating system. You apply current to the coil, the coil heats up which in turn heats up the ceramic to a point where it is the ceramic that vaporizes the juice. If your device is trying to maintain a coil temp of 250°C by reading its rise in resistance, and calculating its output, then what is the temp of the ceramic?

 

[TrollDragon]

Don't drag all the loons in here guys with the TC Science Friction.

 

[Mordacai]

Punk In Drublic, you obviously don't understand how TCR works at all. As I have stated it is dependent on the wire used that is a conductor, it has nothing to do with an insulator or wicking. As it can and is used by folks using RBA and RBTA, and they don't account for the wicking!

TrollDragon, even worse is TCR values can be different for the same material from different suppliers due to manufacturing processes. So one manufacturers SS316L TCR value will not be the same as another, so it can take a while to find the right values.

 

[TrollDragon]

TrollDragon, even worse is TCR values can be different for the same material from different suppliers due to manufacturing processes. So one manufacturers SS316L TCR value will not be the same as another, so it can take a while to find the right values.

Hence the reason SS316L is never my first choice for TC vaping. I can't be bothered playing around with TCR/TFR values, it was fun in the early days of TC vaping but the novelty has long since worn off.

 

[Punk In Drublic]

Punk In Drublic, you obviously don't understand how TCR works at all. As I have stated it is dependent on the wire used that is a conductor, it has nothing to do with an insulator or wicking. As it can and is used by folks using RBA and RBTA, and they don't account for the wicking!

I do know how TCR works. TCR = Temperature Coefficient of Resistance. As metal heats up its resistance rises - given the type of metal we can apply a certain value to an algorithm and calculate its temperature based on this rise in resistance.

In a vaping situation, TCR is used to keep certain coils below a prescribed temperature that is set by the user. The device reads the resistance of the coil x amount of times per second, and based on the TCR algorithm along with the resistance of the coil, the device will attempt to predict the coils temperature and adjust it’s power output accordingly in order to maintain the prescribed temperature.

In all cases, regardless if RBA or RBTA, or even a subohm tank, there is a relationship between the coil and the wick. The more saturated the wick is, the cooler the coil is and in turn, the less the mod has to scale back the prescribed power to maintain that temperature. As the wick dries, the coil becomes hotter, resistance rises and the device scales back more power in order to maintain that temperature. So yes, the wick, or better put how saturated the wick is, has much to do with how TCR works in a vaping situation.

The ceramic within a cCell is not an insulator, it is a conductor of heat that is generated by the Stainless Steel coil. It is the ceramic that is in contact with the wick (see my above picture), therefore it is the ceramic that vaporizes the juice and it’s temperature is influenced by how saturated the wick is. In temp control, your device is trying to maintain the temperature of the coil, not the ceramic. So, as I asked earlier, if your device is trying to keep the coil at 250°C, what is the temperature of the ceramic? The device will know or predict the temp of the coil based on the TCR value and resistance. But that is not the temperature of the ceramic. We have added a 3rd element to the equation (the ceramic) which given it’s properties will always be a different temperature than the coil.

 

[Mordacai]

Punk In Drublic, you quoted resistance which refers to conductors in your own post. Ceramic is an insulator, unless it is a metalloceramic. And in GT CCell coils it is an insulating type ceramic.

TCR only applies to the coil, which is a conductor. And you state this in your post.

So in conclusion, you've concluded in your own words that it has nothing to do with wicking or insulators.

 

[Punk In Drublic]

Insulator: A material or an object that does not easily allow heat, electricity, light, or sound to pass through it.

Now if the ceramic is used to vaporize juice with heat, does that make it an insulator?

The resistance in which I referred to is the resistance of the coil, not the ceramic. I referred to the ceramic as a conductor of heat, not a conductor of electricity.

In a cCell, the coil heats the ceramic, the ceramic vaporizes the juice. It is conducting heat not insulating.

So in your own words, please explain how juice is vaporized within a cCell coil? You can leave out Temp Control for the purpose of simplicity.

 

[Mordacai]

Punk In Drublic, just like any other wicking system or method.

The material is indirectly heated releasing vapour.

And nice copy and paste of the description of an insulator, the only description that was relevant and right was that it does not easily allow electricity to pass through it. The other descriptions are moot.

 

[Punk In Drublic]

What with the condescending remarks? Would my post be any different should I have applied my own meaning of what an insulator is?

You want to discuss this further that is fine with me – perhaps both of us can come out learning something. But leave the condescending remarks at the door.

 

[Smokey James]

I have tried looking everywhere I can for advice on this, and everything seems to turn up a dead end.

I am currently using the GT CCELL coil 0.5 ohm (15-40w) in my SWAG and I have been having serious issues with it.
I prime them as told by the vendor I bought it from, only for them to taste like they've burnt out or taste metallic a couple of days later.

I am currently using a 70/30 mix with the actual kit being on 25.0w on normal, at 300f on SS.

Is there anything I'm doing wrong? (Only had this kit a couple of months and still a bit of a vaping n00b, haha)

Any help would be greatly appreciated!

My GT CCELL 0.5 OHM coil in my Cascade Baby tank works very well for me. I have the tank attached to my Wismec Predator. I'm currently running the coil at 54.8 watts with a 70% - 30% VG/PG E-Juice and I haven't had any problems thus far. I've been using a Target 75 vtc kit for four years now and it operates a CCELL made for 15-20 watts. Mine runs at 26 watts. Maybe you have bad karma? I cannot help you.

Sent from my Moto E (4) using Tapatalk

 

[Mordacai]

Smokey James, the original GT CCell advised wattage range is 25 to 35 watts. So be careful, as your outside it.

OP's issue could be to do with manufacturing variances or possibly even fakes, as it sounds like the coils aren't wicking liquid well.

 

[greek mule]

The ceramic is not part of the wicking system. It is part of the heating system. You apply current to the coil, the coil heats up which in turn heats up the ceramic to a point where it is the ceramic that vaporizes the juice. If your device is trying to maintain a coil temp of 250°C by reading its rise in resistance, and calculating its output, then what is the temp of the ceramic?

Hi @Mordacai,@Punk In Drublic,i did a little search and found a trusted article:Ceramic coils: Advantages and Disadvantages | Vaping Post
[QUOTE:
The ceramic element itself is a wick; because of its microporous structure the juice climbs by capillarity.

 

[TrollDragon]

I prefer Boden's BD13 Al203 sintered alumina wicks...