Has anyone ever tried this?

[jfreitas1]

I was taught how to cook when I was 7 by Italian mother. Other than a 7.5 year stint in the Navy I have been in the food and beverage industry my entire life. With cooking and drink preparation it is not just the ingredients it is also the technique in which they are applied such as timing. In a good dish just mixing everything together just doesn't work. I have made some pretty good juice even have some local B&M's wanting to pay money for some of my recipes. So I am asking the forum does anyone know or has anyone tried mixing in stages of the aging process. Say you have a complex blend with maybe 6 flavors, mix the first 2 steep for 4 days, add the next 2 and steep say 3 days, then maybe 1 flavor steep for 3 days and follow up with the last flavor. Then conclude with final steep. Does anyone know if this will have any affect on the liquid at all or just a waste of time. I'm wondering if it will aloow the flavors to come in stages to the palette. Any help or advise will help. I want to experiment but don't want to waste $ if others have tried and it has no affect what so ever.

 

[Bunnykiller]

never tried it in that manner... altho I do wait several days before I add the nic base....

 

[HeadInClouds]

Say you have a complex blend with maybe 6 flavors, mix the first 2 steep for 4 days, add the next 2 and steep say 3 days, then maybe 1 flavor steep for 3 days and follow up with the last flavor. Then conclude with final steep. Does anyone know if this will have any affect on the liquid at all or just a waste of time. I'm wondering if it will aloow the flavors to come in stages to the palette. Any help or advise will help. I want to experiment but don't want to waste $ if others have tried and it has no affect what so ever.

Regarding wasting $ and time.. I don't see how it would cost any extra money to try or do it this. As far as time - you have a question and it sounds as if you're interested enough in the answer that you'd enjoy the process of finding out. Experimenting isn't wasted time in my opinion.

I do not have your answer, but I mix a lot and think a few observations are relevant:

* The cleaner the nic base, the less time required for a mix to arrive at its final, stable flavor.
* Some flavors seem to take longer to stabilize than other flavors.
* Different people perceive these changes differently.

...which really just raises more questions:

* Are you trying to please yourself with your mixes - or other people?
* How would different nic base affect your recipes?
* Would you be considering a recipe when fully 'matured' (mixed, stabilized, steeped, whatever term you want to use) - or trying to catch the best-tasting intermediate stage?

I would start with a mix that you perceive as changing drastically as it ages. Split it into 2 'subrecipes' and mix those in 2 separate bottles. You also need a 'control' to compare later, so use part of those 'subrecipe' bottles to make a third smaller bottle with all the ingredients combined. Then you would need to plan when and how you would test the results.

It makes sense to start small in your first experiment, just a single recipe tested all together versus two 'subrecipes' combined later. Based on your observations, you'd decide whether further experiments are warranted.

I hope you let us know what you discover!

 

[jfreitas1]

the answers to your questons

Myself mainly but if others like it all the better. By Nic base do you mean level or brand I do go down on nic on mixes and change PG/VG ratios for different types of juice. And the last is by getting getting the juice to it optimal flavor. I use 2 methods of steeping I always experiment with both of those crock pot and natural steep. I sure will leave results. I have two bourbons right now steeping in 2 differnt kinds of oak naturally. I am waiting 30 days on those to try. I have a question though, what do you mean by cleaner the nic base? I only use nic, vg and pg.

Regarding wasting $ and time.. I don't see how it would cost any extra money to try or do it this. As far as time - you have a question and it sounds as if you're interested enough in the answer that you'd enjoy the process of finding out. Experimenting isn't wasted time in my opinion.

I do not have your answer, but I mix a lot and think a few observations are relevant:

* The cleaner the nic base, the less time required for a mix to arrive at its final, stable flavor.
* Some flavors seem to take longer to stabilize than other flavors.
* Different people perceive these changes differently.

...which really just raises more questions:

* Are you trying to please yourself with your mixes - or other people?
* How would different nic base affect your recipes?
* Would you be considering a recipe when fully 'matured' (mixed, stabilized, steeped, whatever term you want to use) - or trying to catch the best-tasting intermediate stage?

I would start with a mix that you perceive as changing drastically as it ages. Split it into 2 'subrecipes' and mix those in 2 separate bottles. You also need a 'control' to compare later, so use part of those 'subrecipe' bottles to make a third smaller bottle with all the ingredients combined. Then you would need to plan when and how you would test the results.

It makes sense to start small in your first experiment, just a single recipe tested all together versus two 'subrecipes' combined later. Based on your observations, you'd decide whether further experiments are warranted.

I hope you let us know what you discover!

 

[Wingsfan0310]

I think HIC means some Nics are clear with no taste (clean). Some are light yellow (or darker) with a peppery or even as bad as metallic taste (not clean).

Cheers,
Steve

 

[3mg Meniere]

Inawara is probably the apex for DIY connoisseurs, particularly for those into tobacco flavors. They have ten different bases. Bases, Glycol, Glycerine - - Inawera Shop, The Best E-Liquids, Flavours, Bases And Many More! Evidently it makes a big difference, especially for those with a fine-tuned palate. Me, except for coffees, cherries, chocolates, and honey, I'm not that particular. My search for a good honey led me there.

 

[zoiDman]

... So I am asking the forum does anyone know or has anyone tried mixing in stages of the aging process. Say you have a complex blend with maybe 6 flavors, mix the first 2 steep for 4 days, add the next 2 and steep say 3 days, then maybe 1 flavor steep for 3 days and follow up with the last flavor. Then conclude with final steep. Does anyone know if this will have any affect on the liquid at all or just a waste of time. I'm wondering if it will aloow the flavors to come in stages to the palette. Any help or advise will help. I want to experiment but don't want to waste $ if others have tried and it has no affect what so ever.

Whenever I hear of a New Steeping or Mixing Method (and I have Heard a LOT of them) I ask people... "Why Don't you do a Little Blind Taste Testing with a Benchmark?"

For the Benchmark: Mix your Recipe, give it a Good 45 Second Shake and then put the Bottle in a Cool, Dark Place and let it Sit Undisturbed for 4 ~ 5 Days.

Then do whatever you want to the Other Mix as long as you use the Exact Same Ingredients/Proportions. Paint Shake it. Ultrasound it. Run Tepid Tap Water over the Bottle. Open the Cap ever Odd Numbered Hour. Place it in a Rock Tumbler. Tape the Bottle to a Ceiling Fan. Whatever.

Then have someone fill up Two New Identical Cartos/Clearo/Tanks and Compare the Taste of each.

If One is Clearly Better than the Other, Great. Go with that Technique.

But if they Taste the Same, Isn't just putting the Mix in a Cool, Dark Place Easier than all the Other Iterations?

 

[Crunktanium]

I'm wondering if it will aloow the flavors to come in stages to the palette. Any help or advise will help. I want to experiment but don't want to waste $ if others have tried and it has no affect what so ever.

Due to the chemical bonding process it wont work the same as food. Once two chemicals are introduced together they form new bonds and new flavors are developed. There is no way to prevent this other then mixing water and oil per say.

 

[jfreitas1]

I have been using some Flavor Art flavors and they are a very good quality. I can taste the difference.

 

[jfreitas1]

Thanks for that info, I was speaking with a local guy today and he told me the same thing that the difference in taste if there is any would barely be noticable.

Due to the chemical bonding process it wont work the same as food. Once two chemicals are introduced together they form new bonds and new flavors are developed. There is no way to prevent this other then mixing water and oil per say.

 

[Art Mustel]

Thanks for that info, I was speaking with a local guy today and he told me the same thing that the difference in taste if there is any would barely be noticable.

Why?
If you have a new idea, don't let anyone to discourage you. It could work, it could not, but you'll never know if you don't even try.

 

[ZeroOhms]

I have been trying something similar but haven't quite nailed it yet.
Basic idea is, instead of having all the flavors to completely bond together, what if we let some flavors intentionally create "weak" bond? Would it introduce more complex total taste?
First, you mix the "base" juice and let it fully steep. Once ready, add the "secondary" juice but perform much shorter (almost none) steeping. This could potential create a "pop" in the flavor which otherwise would be missed if they were fully steeped.
It's like adding cheese to your pasta right before eating. Or like adding fresh milk to coffee right before drinking. They definitely have different flavor when added fresh instead of letting them "soak" into the food/drink.

If we find some good combo that works, it could open up a whole new front in mixing.

 

[clh2121]

I have been trying something similar but haven't quite nailed it yet.
Basic idea is, instead of having all the flavors to completely bond together, what if we let some flavors intentionally create "weak" bond? Would it introduce more complex total taste?
First, you mix the "base" juice and let it fully steep. Once ready, add the "secondary" juice but perform much shorter (almost none) steeping. This could potential create a "pop" in the flavor which otherwise would be missed if they were fully steeped.
It's like adding cheese to your pasta right before eating. Or like adding fresh milk to coffee right before drinking. They definitely have different flavor when added fresh instead of letting them "soak" into the food/drink.

If we find some good combo that works, it could open up a whole new front in mixing.

Issue with that is vaping it quick or adding that last note to small parts of a bigger batch right before you vape it... Like having 30mLs of base flavor, pulling off 5-10mls, add last note, shake and vape... If it sits then you've done undermined what you were going for. In essence it would work if that's how you were going to do it...

 

[jfreitas1]

I tried somthing like this last week. I had this juice I made that I call tawdry. It is a creamy vanilla hazelnut. I added some cinnamon and and sweetener to about 5 ml's, shook it up and vaped. It was good but too much cinnamon. I let the rest steep for a week and a totally different taste, the cinnamon mellowed and really popped with the hazelnut. I haven't tried many other things like this yet, I was just asking if anyone has tried. Right now I am waiting for my reserve to finish aging I have to jars of a Bourbon style juice with some other flavorings steeping in oak chips for 30 days.

I have been trying something similar but haven't quite nailed it yet.
Basic idea is, instead of having all the flavors to completely bond together, what if we let some flavors intentionally create "weak" bond? Would it introduce more complex total taste?
First, you mix the "base" juice and let it fully steep. Once ready, add the "secondary" juice but perform much shorter (almost none) steeping. This could potential create a "pop" in the flavor which otherwise would be missed if they were fully steeped.
It's like adding cheese to your pasta right before eating. Or like adding fresh milk to coffee right before drinking. They definitely have different flavor when added fresh instead of letting them "soak" into the food/drink.

If we find some good combo that works, it could open up a whole new front in mixing.

 

[dannyv45]

I tried somthing like this last week. I had this juice I made that I call tawdry. It is a creamy vanilla hazelnut. I added some cinnamon and and sweetener to about 5 ml's, shook it up and vaped. It was good but too much cinnamon. I let the rest steep for a week and a totally different taste, the cinnamon mellowed and really popped with the hazelnut. I haven't tried many other things like this yet, I was just asking if anyone has tried. Right now I am waiting for my reserve to finish aging I have to jars of a Bourbon style juice with some other flavorings steeping in oak chips for 30 days.

Issue with that is vaping it quick or adding that last note to small parts of a bigger batch right before you vape it... Like having 30mLs of base flavor, pulling off 5-10mls, add last note, shake and vape... If it sits then you've done undermined what you were going for. In essence it would work if that's how you were going to do it...

That raises a very good question expecially regarding Crunktanium's quote .

Due to the chemical bonding process it wont work the same as food. Once two chemicals are introduced together they form new bonds and new flavors are developed. There is no way to prevent this other then mixing water and oil per say.

Once saturation and steeping have completed does molecular bonding complete or cease?

If so then my thoughts are if 2 completely matured mixes, if mixed together after molecular bonding has completed. Would they blend together and not bond to each other, essencially creating a totally different flavor then if those 2 flavors were added at the same time and allowed to molecularly bond together (or attach to each others molecles)?

Now I'm just thinking out loud and I have not tried any of this but it's worth some thought.

Any opinions on this....anyone?

 

[zoiDman]

That raises a very good question expecially regarding Crunktanium's quote .



once saturation and steeping have completed does molecular bonding complete or cease? If so then 2 completely matured mixes, if mixed together after molecular bonding has completed would blend together and not bond to each other, essencially creating a totally different flavor then if those 2 flavors were added at the same time and allowed to molecularly bond together? Now I'm just thinking out loud and I have not tried any of this but it's worth some thought.

Any opinions on this....anyone?

Since I started using an e-Cigarette, late 2009, I have seen e-Cigarettes/e-Liquids Knowledge Evolve Exponentially. But there is One Area where it Hasn't. And that is in the Area of e-Liquid Maturation.

I have Waited for Year after Year to see a Thread from a Food Chemist shedding some light on what is Going On when an e-Liquid "Steeps". I haven't seen it yet.

About All I know for certain is that there Are Multiple processes going on. And that the Slang Term "Steeping" has No Real Unique Meaning.

Maybe when the Regulations Come we will Finally get Our Answers?

Albeit a Terrible Way to gain Understanding about e-Liquids.

 

[jfreitas1]

This I have tried several times and with the same results. I have taken juice that I thought I loved in the shop only to hate it. Let it steep for about 4 weeks and if it still wasn't there, I have already steeped juices such as Bav cream, chocolate, caramel and some different mints. I will mix the 2 to see if it gives it that little something. I will let it steep for a few hours and it will taste one way but if I still don't care for it I will age it for another month Sometimes its great and sometimes its crap. I always try to write down what I did when I'm doing it so if it turns out to be the best juice I have ever tasted I can replicate. I gues I have really answered my own questions. If you stagger the steeping process during mixing it will taste differently at different stages of maturation, once all mixing has matured and melded the final product will taste the same as one where all items were mixed together at the same time and let to mature all together. I am anxious for my aged in oak process to complete. 10 more days till the first test having a hard time waiting.

That raises a very good question expecially regarding Crunktanium's quote .



Once saturation and steeping have completed does molecular bonding complete or cease?

If so then my thoughts are if 2 completely matured mixes, if mixed together after molecular bonding has completed. Would they blend together and not bond to each other, essencially creating a totally different flavor then if those 2 flavors were added at the same time and allowed to molecularly bond together (or attach to each others molecles)?

Now I'm just thinking out loud and I have not tried any of this but it's worth some thought.

Any opinions on this....anyone?

 

[Kr3wsk8er]

Since I started using an e-Cigarette, late 2009, I have seen e-Cigarettes/e-Liquids Knowledge Evolve Exponentially. But there is One Area where it Hasn't. And that is in the Area of e-Liquid Maturation.

I have Waited for Year after Year to see a Thread from a Food Chemist shedding some light on what is Going On when an e-Liquid "Steeps". I haven't seen it yet.

About All I know for certain is that there Are Multiple processes going on. And that the Slang Term "Steeping" has No Real Unique Meaning.

Maybe when the Regulations Come we will Finally get Our Answers?

Albeit a Terrible Way to gain Understanding about e-Liquids.

I can not attest and say this is 100% accurate, so do not quote me verbatim but a mutual friend of mine who works for a major name juice vendor explained the process to me as something along these lines firstly we have natural/artificial flavoring which is composed of anywhere from one to hundreds of chemical compounds to make a flavor profile or profiles. Next with time after mixing some of these the ratio of sugars, acids and phenolics is a key determination of how a profile can be pronounced or muted. Some mixtures of chemicals simply overload our taste buds hence a muted flavor, or the chemicals in fact cancel out the intended flavor when mixed with others. Lighting, temperature, and agitation can all benefit, and or harm a profile. There is a shelf life for our juice, and I am unsure of the process, and what compounds might be breaking down after a certain amount of time? He said it is similar to wine, that time both has a benefit, as well as can compromise the juice. He recommended not using juice over 6 months old. I shall bug him, as I am dying to know a little more as well.

 

[DeloresRose]

I have done a similar thing, maybe this will help you. I'm still trying new flavors all the time, and only have a few which I have the recipe the way I like. And I do mix all the ingredients at the same time. Some juices don't come out so well in the test round, and I'll add a little something later. If I find that has worked, I will mix subsequent batches all ingredients at the same time.

I have also made my nic base ahead, so all I have to do is add some flavor to it to make test batches quickly.

I have not found any of this to affect the end results.

That said, some flavors do seem to *bloom* more quickly than others, and I can see where you might want to make one that needs to steep (coffee or tobacco?) , and later mix in something that just needs a shake (fruits?). I haven't tried anything like that yet - I like single flavors mostly, and similar flavor recipes.

Good question. I'd like to see what you come up with on this.

 

[dead not sleeping]

Interesting idea. I've got two juices that I like separately, and another that's just the two mixed together 50/50, also awesome. I'll have to whip up one that has all ingredients in one mix and see if they taste different. I'm all mixed out right now so it will be a good future comparison.