"Health Officials" bust vendors, promoters at NJ Vape Expo

[Toastyroadie]

This just isn't right...

Also, some information on unjust laws.

 

[nic_fix]

first of all. I apologize for my lack of grammar skills. I am disabled(hands). second you cannot liken our plight to rosa parks. or such. sure, it can be heard in a courtroom. this is not a crime against humanity. sorry, it is our passion but it is just not that type of scenario. not everything is a right to freedom. especially when it opposes others. you guys just can't see through the wool because you are so enamored with our particular cause. I will tell you I love animals much more than ecigs but greenpeace always looses. simply because they approach their cause with tactics that are on the wrong side of the law. you can question my integrity al you wish but this would carry little weight in a court of the law. I mean this convention fiasco we are discussing. please, do read the statutes. are we under attack? yes! this was by and large brought on by the very community that now is screaming about it. also, you are correct the limit on wisonsin highways is 70mph up from 65mph. I do not know why I said 80. that was simply a formality on my part. still, you cannot go 85 at any point and not plan on getting stopped. I do agree it is fair to go 77 when merging etc and most law enforcement officers recognize that. there is in fact a cushion or threshold, margin for error. that is not to be said you can vape in a restaurant where no vaping is posted. if it is not state law and not posted go at it. come on toasty, that does not apply to this. well, it can apply to anything but this is not oppression. which is what those instances speak of. why don't we all fight for the right to be intoxicated in public? there were many cases I would not take and this would have been one of them. I just see this as a non issue. I can't understand why it is such a passion to some of you. are you that addicted that you can't wait until you get to your vehicle or dwelling? the bottom line is these devices can be offensive to others at the very least. on a greater scale they can be perceived as some as a damper to their pursuit of happiness. I respect others first and foremost. I never smoked in a non smoking section. how is this different? I know, it is not smoke. that is the vaping communities entire argument. it can be perceived as such. shall we educate the entire nation of non vapers on the subject? I would honestly be much more concerned juices and devices get banned because of the stink that is being raised. that, would in fact be an oppression of legal rights. also admissible in court and I am sure it would make it there. certain things are not a freedom if they can interfere with the (perceived) well being of others. however, having the right to use non pharmaceutical measurements at ones own discretion as a consenting adult is in fact. the right to vape indoors is just not going to become a revolution but you guys are free to prove me wrong. I am sorry I am against our very community but I am pretty sure I am on the right side of the fence. the whole thing boils down to the rights of others, not us. as it did with smoking which was a precursor to this some 60 years ago. remember at first you could smoke anywhere as well. those people ruined it for themselves as well.

 

[mcclintock]

It's just vaping. Perhaps it just doesn't dominate and control the lives of many of us. Civil disobedience about being to inhale nicotine and flavorings in public spaces just seems a bit silly. There are far more important things in life...

As I see it, the big issue here is not vaping but property rights. But it is not clear to me how "public" this building is, if it will be rented out to another event immediately, next weekend, or almost never.

I do have issue with what kind of event the promoters were trying to run, and that almost every person interviewed about doing something questionable has been not at all eloquent in their justifications. It did seem the promoters had in mind a wild public vape party ... indoors in NJ (outside wouldn't concentrate the haze enough). "Civil disobedience" doesn't mix with that.

The media still could have been sympathetic (I haven't seen any, don't live there) but I bet they suck up to the politicians because they need the stories.

 

[VCross]

This just isn't right...

Also, some information on unjust laws.

Honestly, in my opinion, the laws saying you can only vape in certain areas are not unjust at all for one reason and one reason only. The long term effects of vaping are still unknown. I'm almost certain that there are little to no long term effects since there have been many people vaping for 5+ years who haven't had any vaping related health issues, however, even if there are we still don't know them and if I were someone who never smoked or vaped then I wouldn't want anyone blowing *potentially* harmful chemicals in my face. That is the reasoning behind the Clean Air Act. They don't want any place of business to be polluted by potentially harmful chemicals that are being put into the air by customers and consumers and before you guys react by saying "Oh but there are potentially harmful chemicals in [whatever line of work you do] or [foods that you eat]" Most of these places and packages are required by law to have some sort of warning posted somewhere that you could be exposed to said harmful chemicals. That's why, in California at least, almost everything you eat, drink, consume or be exposed to has a warning label saying "This package contains [Chemical X] which is known in the state of California to cause cancer, birth defects, gangrene, ........, swamp foot and .... leakage" (that last bit is a joke, it's ok to laugh guys).

 

[aceswired]

Wish more thought this way. Unfortunatly, a LOT of folks here are heavily invested in the belief that vaping has no risks/unknowns. Talk this sensible tends to get those folks up in arms.

Sent from my SM-T320 using Tapatalk

 

[DeAnna2112]

At what point did some in the vaping community come to a place where acting unruly and rebellious was the way to strengthen the cause of vaping and reflect it in the kind of light we wish it to be? Preserving vaping and saving lives is far more important then behaving this way. What was wrong with conforming to the warnings and then taking the matter up at a later time as to who gave who wrong information or illegal permission to vaping in the convention center?

They could have organized a civil peaceful protest following this event that would have brought this whole issue to awareness while still maintaining self respect by all who heard their case, but given the way it all went down and how it was handled... they even lost the respect of those in the vaping community.

Justifying and glorifying this kind of mentality and behavior will perpetuate these kinds of bad outcomes to continue and it does nothing to help the cause and purpose of vaping. If the vaping community would focused more on organizing peaceful awareness protest, opposed to organizing money making indoor vaping conventions in places such as NJ, vaping would be in a far better place today then what it is. No matter what side one is on, clearly money still rules first and foremost...ehem!!

It's interesting because everybody wants to be respected as a vaper and wants vaping to be seen and respected for what it is and what it is not...yet when push comes to shove disrespect is how some in the vaping community conduct themselves.
As vapers we have to set the example of who we are and what vaping is in a respectful manner in ALL situations if we truly want to be heard and respected in return...and also stand above the mentality of our politicians and opposition.

 

[stevegmu]

At what point did some in the vaping community come to a place where acting unruly and rebellious was the way to strengthen the cause of vaping and reflect it in the kind of light we wish it to be? Preserving vaping and saving lives is far more important then behaving this way. What was wrong with conforming to the warnings and then taking the matter up at a later time as to who gave who wrong information or illegal permission to vaping in the convention center?

They could have organized a civil peaceful protest following this event that would have brought this whole issue to awareness while still maintaining self respect by all who heard their case, but given the way it all went down and how it was handled... they even lost the respect of those in the vaping community.

Justifying and glorifying this kind of mentality and behavior will perpetuate these kinds of bad outcomes to continue and it does nothing to help the cause and purpose of vaping. If the vaping community would focused more on organizing peaceful awareness protest, opposed to organizing money making indoor vaping conventions in places such as NJ, vaping would be in a far better place today then what it is. No matter what side one is on, clearly money still rules first and foremost...ehem!!

It's interesting because everybody wants to be respected as a vaper and wants vaping to be seen and respected for what it is and what it is not...yet when push comes to shove disrespect is how some in the vaping community conduct themselves.
As vapers we have to set the example of who we are and what vaping is in a respectful manner in ALL situations if we truly want to be heard and respected in return...and also stand above the mentality of our politicians and opposition.

I think many of the militant activists were Occupiers, or wanna be Occupiers, or just misguided Millennials...

 

[crxess]

http://www.nj.gov/health/ctcp/smokefree/

Sorry but I feel the CLA or actually SMOKE FREE AIR ACT has nothing to do with actual clean air and everything to do with smokers and now Perceived (E-)Smokers
The so called act only addresses one area of pollution rather than addressing all air pollution reduction statewide.

To this day I do not understand why a business owner in most states is not allowed to cater to their choice of clientele. Seems to me on some level this is restraint of trade.

I don't have an issue with going into a restaurant and not Vaping. I have done it many times. I also spent many evenings in Restaurants when I was still a smoker and got through it just fine.

The action is not the point. The restriction by dictation is.

It would seem on the surface at least, The Governor is as good at over exaggerating as anyone else involved.
He seemed to make a huge point that an IN UNIFORM(off duty) officer working the show complained of having to leave the floor because of his eyes burning. From What?
He was Very loudly Clear that there ARE 4 known Carcinogens in addition to Nicotine, though he couldn't name them.
He also made the point that something(DA) was in them that was Banned from Microwave Popcorn,but he could not remember the name.(Good Preparation)
* Diacetyl was never Banned. It was removed by choice from most Brands in response to legal concerns due to Industrial Workers health concerns. Other manufacturers progressively followed suite.*
***Point of Fact - The CDC has stated Diacetyl is associated with(NOT CAUSES) Popcorn lung. (i.e. still not clearly known )
When people use Over exaggerated statements running on the edge of Lying to pass laws the blind call them leaders/heroes of the people.
Does not matter what truths are exposed, they are the peoples savior. It their eyes we are simple trouble makers trying to hurt their feelings or disrupt their lives.
What about our lives? Do we not Work/Spent/Get Taxed just the same.
Why should our concerns be any less important than theirs?
Why should our concerns not be addressed the same as theirs?

I stand against E-liquids being classed as Tobacco Products - Only Nicotine comes from a procecss which removes it from Tobacco leafs. Water could also be an Extract from Tobacco.
e-liquids are not required to even have nicotine as a portion or the makeup in order to present the specified flavor. e-liquids do not even need to be flavored.

I Stand against Electronic Vaporizers being classified as smoking devices. I Firmly believe the health hazard is at worst minimal and likely only slightly more so than breathing the air around us. I do not want to be Forced by some knowledgeable Politician, hoping to impress constituents, to stand side by side with someone Smoking in a Designated Smoking area out by the GARBAGE DUMPSTERS.

*Not only is the choice of DESIGNATED smoking areas an affront to Smokers and a total insult to them as human beings, it is a total insult to my understanding of Go Smoke Free - Quit tobacco use. Vaping to me IS Smoking cessation. I have the Right to NOT be EXPOSED to burning Tobacco just as much as the Never Smoker.

Off my soap box - I'm just making myself mad at this point.

 

[zoiDman]

If you Google...

vp live vaping podcast Dumb and Dumber the idiots behind vape expo nj

... you can hear the rebroadcast of Russ's Rant on Vape Expo NJ.

Disclaimer: I am NOT Indorsing Russ's View or VP Live. Just throwing it out there.

 

[WharfRat1976]

Disgusting picture. Very anti-vaping.

AT, the cloud cover was from the "fog machines" blowing PG clouds, not from the vaping. The organizers used that angle as well.

 

[RavenZ]

As being a "member of the event" as a consumer there were a few things I do disagree with about this event that took place.
I did expect to see vape in the air, what i didn't expect was how poor the ventilation system & AC system was inside this expo center. As Phil said in NJ vaping is not established so having pole dancers & half naked body painted women was not a good choice to have especially when everybody was warned the Senator was there did not make a good impression, have some taste & respect to at least not have it go on while he was onsite. As far as saying "Have it in PA" there was a vape expo and it was a total bust the space in PA is extremely small and max capacity I believe is 1000 to 1500 which includes the vendors.
The event posted "Vaping will be held in an adjacent enclosed pavilion" the pavilion was an outside roped off area by the gross dumpsters.
I feel the promoter's wanted to make a statement and they did. Whether it's going to help or hurt the vape community is to be foreseen.
As far as them paying for the fines - the fine total is $50,000.00 and they have stopped paying once the total hit $5,000.00.
Questions are now being raised by NJ Vape Shops if they will now be fined as well for letting customers sample juice. Some vape shops have now stopped vaping & sampling in fear.

 

[Wow1420]

AT, the cloud cover was from the "fog machines" blowing PG clouds, not from the vaping. The organizers used that angle as well.

Which was probably something that worked against them, making photos of the event look much "worse" than it was in reality (worse in the eyes of the authorities and media).

 

[zoiDman]

Which was probably something that worked against them, making photos of the event look much "worse" than it was in reality (worse in the eyes of the authorities and media).

I was at ECC 2014 for the B2B portion and part of the Public portion last year. It was the same and Brutal at times.

I personally Talked with about 2/3 of the Exhibitors in the Main and Indoor Side Hall. And Overwhelmingly they said the Same thing. It was WAY Too Much. And Many Asked other Exhibitors to Please Turn them Off.

Here is Something that I saw that Really Opened my Eyes...

There was a Walkway between the Main Building and a Tented Building just off the Main Hall where you could Exit to an Outdoor Area. I needed a Break so I walked Outside. There was on Fairplex Employee standing there keying on her Smartphone. She Looked up and Gave me a Smile. So I asked her how the Show was going for Her?

She Told me that it was Wild. That she felt like her Lungs were filling up. And was Blown away that e-Cigarettes could fill up such a Big expo hall.

In that Split Second I Realized what She was doing with her Phone. So I asked her... "Did you take some pictures of inside?"

And she said "'Absolutely, I'm posting them to my FB Page."

 

[crxess]

People seem to have the Idea Vapor will cover the earth if we are not stopped.
A shame really.
I have been off on a Work related injury since 2/26/15. Almost every day has been up to 18 hours on my living room couch as I can move very little most of the time without excruciating pain.
I have 3 things I can manage throughout my day. TV, ECF, Vaping. Anything else accomplished is a blessing.
I seem to have become pretty good at chain vaping, going through 15-20ml per day, same room all day, every day.
Funny, the room is still pretty clear and the furniture is not covered in this so called funk of gooey stuff.

I will admit, my 8" Tablet touch screen does need a good wipe off every few days, but it is inches from my face for several hours a day. Most of that is more likely natural body oils than vapor residue.

People need to stop trying to one up the opposition and find a common ground.
Banning something you do not understand is just as bad as standing up for something you actually believe in.

Most of us do not live peacefully because of Laws and regulations, but rather in spite of them.(D.M.Schnur7/23/15) Remember that.

 

[personalvoid]

Cmon tobacco companies paid 290 billion in fines! And they somewhat regulate popolation by increasing death rate!

They must be allowed in more places than ecigs! And if you have to ban ecigs you could just say it is unhealthy, at least as cigarettes. Not more, not less. Equal. But less supported by the general laws lets put it that way.

I am not saying that you should be allowed to vape everywhere. I would hate eating in a vape fillled environment, or working without actually seeing my keyboard... But should be regulated by everyone besides the health and safety department and clean air acts. And i am pretty convinced it would, because sometines you cannot bear the vapor density in the air, people will self regulate that! People will start fleeing conventions, Q&A sessions or focus groups will find out the reason and bam! Change.

What happened, reminds me of laws against black people or laws against native americans, laws against selling alcohol during prohibition age, laws not recognizing same sex marriage etc.

Everything that apparently undermines some establishment or bring change in the way people are used to perceive life is deemed as not fair, not according with the law, or worthy being punished or violently suppressed. Until some time in the future where it CAN be allowed because:
A: too many people in your country are changing their minds and fighting for change
B: too manu people on foreign countries will make you change your mind (aka sanctions or bad rep)
C: the government makes money from it or government officials and parties are being lobbied by some entity invested in the business

Sick of how people dont recognize the same patterns over and over again.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[nic_fix]

all of you make valid points. I hope we can find some common ground. this is the usa. things like occupy only serve to irritate officials and others. I hope the vaping community can have peaceful talks with lawmakers. honestly this is not so important that we need to scream about it. plenty before us have quit smoking without the use of vaporizers. more so than anything this has become a sport. along the way it has garnered public attention. I am betting in the end their will be some common ground. it may be heavily restricted but hopefully still allowed in some venues. I am certainly not against vaping. everyone must consider each other rights. I remember when we smoked in high school classrooms. things change.

crx, I hope you are not on the very strong pain killers. bad road to go down. I know.

 

[stevegmu]

Cmon tobacco companies paid 290 billion in fines! And they somewhat regulate popolation by increasing death rate!

They must be allowed in more places than ecigs! And if you have to ban ecigs you could just say it is unhealthy, at least as cigarettes. Not more, not less. Equal. But less supported by the general laws lets put it that way.

I am not saying that you should be allowed to vape everywhere. I would hate eating in a vape fillled environment, or working without actually seeing my keyboard... But should be regulated by everyone besides the health and safety department and clean air acts. And i am pretty convinced it would, because sometines you cannot bear the vapor density in the air, people will self regulate that! People will start fleeing conventions, Q&A sessions or focus groups will find out the reason and bam! Change.

What happened, reminds me of laws against black people or laws against native americans, laws against selling alcohol during prohibition age, laws not recognizing same sex marriage etc.

Everything that apparently undermines some establishment or bring change in the way people are used to perceive life is deemed as not fair, not according with the law, or worthy being punished or violently suppressed. Until some time in the future where it CAN be allowed because:
A: too many people in your country are changing their minds and fighting for change
B: too manu people on foreign countries will make you change your mind (aka sanctions or bad rep)
C: the government makes money from it or government officials and parties are being lobbied by some entity invested in the business

Sick of how people dont recognize the same patterns over and over again.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

That was a joke, right? Vaping is just included with smoking prohibitions in some places. That's a big deal? If one can't wait like they did when they smoked, the stories about e-nic being more addictive than cigarettes is true...

 

[nic_fix]

come one. this is not the same as oppression of race, gender,sexual preference etc. this is not that big a deal. that is just how I see it. I left a vape convention because I could not stand it and I had a vaporizer in my hand! you just said the same thing! how is this oppression? it interferes with the well being of others. perhaps not from a health standpoint but one of personal enjoyment. this not only encompasses out rights but the rights of others. freeing slaves for instance only served to better a population and harm no one else.

 

[personalvoid]

That was a joke, right? Vaping is just included with smoking prohibitions in some places. That's a big deal? If one can't wait like they did when they smoked, the stories about e-nic being more addictive than cigarettes is true...

And even if it was? Nicotine is legal, juices are tastier and customized, and smoking at low nic doesn't bring that nausea feeling you have with cigarettes.

Even if they rule nicotine as not legal, people will continue vaping at 0 nic. It will be an expensive juice vapour delivery device...


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[stevegmu]

And even if it was? Nicotine is legal, juices are tastier and customized, and smoking at low nic doesn't bring that nausea feeling you have with cigarettes.

Even if they rule nicotine as not legal, people will continue vaping at 0 nic. It will be an expensive juice vapour delivery device...


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

People have nausea smoking cigarettes? I find cigarettes quite delicious and relaxing. No nausea...
Who has outlawed nicotine? You do know this thread is pertaining to the US, correct?