I think I made a good one this time

[Maurice Pudlo]

I've been trying for a while now to get something that is very near top shelf mix quality and I feel I'm very close with this one.

30ml batch
50:50 PG/VG
6.08mg/ml nicotine

15ml (50%) VG
5.2ml (17.3%) PG
3.8ml (12.6%) 48mg/ml 100% PG nicotine solution
2.2ml (7.3%) Bavarian Cream LA
1.2ml (4%) Creme De Menthe TFA
1.0ml (3.3%) Marshmallow TFA
1.0ml (3.3%) Double Chocolate BV (Better Vapes - Premium E-Liquid, Electronic Cigarettes and Accessories)
0.6ml (2%) Koolada TFA

Percentages are extrapolated, I used the exact ml indicated for each ingredient.

Okay, no steep just a good shake and I want to vape the whole batch.

This is mostly cool mint on the inhale with a very slight chocolate back note accentuated by a mild but noticeable creamy texture I've been looking for on the exhale.

All in all I'm really excited that I have something nice at this point, I'm going to make a second batch exactly as listed and another with a few slight adjustments to the Koolada (-4ml), Double Chocolate (+2ml), and Bavarian Cream (+2ml) and put them up to steep.

Any comments or suggestions would be great I know it isn't done, but it's a start.

Maurice

 

[Huckleberried]

Just wanted to say that I'm happy you're finding your "it"! I know you had posted the missing factor, so it's exciting to hear when things work out

 

[Maurice Pudlo]

Yes, I got my order in from Wizard Labs today, I can't say enough about the way they package things ... just spectacular packaging, first class professionalism without a doubt.

I still haven't touched 9 of the flavors I ordered, so I have options available to adjust and play around. But oh yes I know I'm on the right track.

Maurice

 

[Huckleberried]

Most excellent, Sir.

 

[RocketPuppy]

WL's packaging is amazing. Wingsfan once said it could be dropped from an airplane and would still remain as perfect as when it left their facility. I couldn't have said it better, so I stole his line.
I really like your description btw. You write very well. =)

 

[Tinnman]

It's a great feeling to hit that note of excellent flavor in a DIY. This vape is for you!!!!

 

[Wingsfan0310]

Cangrats Maurice, always a great feeling to make something your proud of. I agree 100%, WL packaging is phenomenal.

Cheers,
Steve

 

[Cool-breeze]

This looks pretty good. What I really like is I have all the flavors on hand... Think Ill try it!

 

[Cool-breeze]

Gotta say that's one of the better chocolate mint concepts I've tried. I'll note all my flavors are TFA so it's a tad dif. I used my dropper which had some fruit in there previously and it got me to thinking a little orange or black cherry could be good in it. I'm all for recipes that use similar ingredients but very different end results. As far as input on your recipe, besides saying I like it, I'd say a little more chocolate could be good but I think I'd up the marshmallow in one of your tests. Btw I'm calling it Maurice's Mint.

 

[Maurice Pudlo]

Thank you thank you thank you everybody!

The double chocolate I have is a bit dry past a certain point, so if that is anything like yours do make small steps in adding that flavor.

Chocolate orange is something I'd like to nail too, in my efforts thus far way less orange is good, I just haven't found that less enough point where orange is not combating every other flavor for dominance. I think that's going to be a hard one.

Less than 12 hours in and the flavors are blending very nicely, by that I mean each flavor note seems to transition into the next far better than it did last night. The chocolate is more clearly true chocolate and less dry cocoa. Unless something really odd happens with steeping I will not be disappointed if I can't improve on the original formula, it's very nice.

Maurice

 

[Maurice Pudlo]

The Original
30ml batch
50:50 PG/VG
6.08mg/ml nicotine

15ml (50%) VG
5.2ml (17.3%) PG
3.8ml (12.6%) 48mg/ml 100% PG nicotine solution
2.2ml (7.3%) Bavarian Cream LA
1.2ml (4%) Creme De Menthe TFA
1.0ml (3.3%) Marshmallow TFA
1.0ml (3.3%) Double Chocolate BV
0.6ml (2%) Koolada TFA

mod One 25%
This tastes mainly like the nicotine base should with a slight coolness from the koolada (cool & peppery), smells great! I really do not like this mix at all, my taste for nicotine is apparently greatly diminished.
30ml batch
50:50 PG/VG
6.08mg/ml nicotine

15ml (50%) VG
9.7ml (17.3%) PG
3.8ml (12.6%) 48mg/ml 100% PG nicotine solution
0.55ml (1.8%) Bavarian Cream LA
0.30ml (1.0%) Creme De Menthe TFA
0.30ml (1.0%) Double Chocolate BV
0.25ml (0.8%) Marshmallow TFA
0.15ml (0.5%) Koolada TFA

Mod Two
This to me is a great improvement over the original with a less bite from the koolada and a far better chocolate presentation. The flavor percentage is still at 20% and the individual flavors seem to blend well. Chocolate is splitting the difference between dark and milk types, with mint clearly present but in the background, smoothness is across the entire vape without being overpowering at any one point. Throat hit is more mild to me than the Mod One mix even though the nicotine percentage is exactly the same. My perception is that while the throat hit is coming from the nicotine base, it is moderated by the flavor profile.

30ml batch
50:50 PG/VG
6.08mg/ml nicotine

15ml (50%) VG
5.2ml (17.3%) PG
3.8ml (12.6%) 48mg/ml 100% PG nicotine solution
2.4ml (8.0%) Bavarian Cream LA
1.2ml (4%) Creme De Menthe TFA
0.8ml (2.6%) Marshmallow TFA
0.8ml (2.6%) Double Chocolate BV
0.4ml (1.3%) Butter (Movie Theater) TFA
0.4ml (1.3%) Koolada TFA

Mod Three
This is a mixture of both Mod One and Mod Two in equal parts; my first impression is that it is an okay mix, certainly better than Mod One and with less flavoring (12.3% vs. 20%).

Koolada is playing a nearly equal part in the flavor with the mild note of Double Chocolate across the draw, the creamy texture has been all but lost in this iteration the same goes for Creme De Menthe, the mint is there but with Koolada in the mix it's hard to tell and split the difference. There is still a sweetness to the vape that is acceptable. Butter (Movie Theater) lingers just a bit at the end, which was not at all noticeable in the other mixes even at a higher flavor percentage.

I find this mix only okay because it is lacking in the texture I'm attempting to impart on the recipe.

With that said the mixture recipe for Mod Three is the average of Mod One and Mod Two and is as follows.

30ml batch
50:50 PG/VG
6.08mg/ml nicotine

15ml (50%) VG
7.5ml (25%) PG
3.8ml (12.6%) 48mg/ml 100% PG nicotine solution
1.475ml (4.9%) Bavarian Cream LA
0.75ml (2.5%) Creme De Menthe TFA
0.525ml (1.7%) Marshmallow TFA
0.55ml (1.8%) Double Chocolate BV
0.125ml (0.4%) Butter (Movie Theater) TFA
0.275ml (0.9%) Koolada TFA

Any thoughts from the great folks here, I have a feeling I should attempt to get the flavor percentage down in some parts, yet I'm reaching the point where percentage of adjustments are obviously doing interesting things to each other.

I don't want to drown out the chocolate, or over do the mint, those being the primary focus for flavor here.

Koolada seems spot on.

Creme De Menthe may be right, but as noted I'm having a hard time splitting the Koolada and Creme De Menthe flavors from the object of having a cool mint combination.

Double Chocolate as a flavor alone is not cocoa anymore which is a good thing.

The chocolate note seems to depend on both Butter (Movie Theater) and Bavarian Cream.

I'm unsure how Marshmallow and Bavarian Cream interact in the texture department.

I'm thinking something between The Original and Mod Three, with Koolada at Mod Three level, or up adjusting just the Bavarian Cream to 1.9ml and Double Chocolate to 0.7ml.

I have Sweet Cream TFA if replacing the Marshmallow with something sweet and creamy would serve double duty and help me get the texture back up there and still reduce total flavor percentage.

I'd like some input.

Maurice

 

[Wingsfan0310]

Sweet Cream is a light creamy flavor but really isn't sweet
Perfumers Apprentice - Sweet Cream Flavor
IMO Marshmallow is a sweeter flavor
Perfumers Apprentice - Marshmallow Flavor
Wish I could be of more help. I guess you could back off the Bavarian Cream a little and add a little Sweet Cream in its place if you want to tweak it a little. Good Luck!

Cheers,
Steve

 

[Maurice Pudlo]

Ahh, basic research fail on my part, thank you so much.

I'm very greatful to everyone who has contributed to the DIY section of the forum, I somehow doubt that I would have ever even attempted to delve into mixing myself without the knowledge base available here.

Maurice

 

[Maurice Pudlo]

EM at or sub 0.5% is sounding like it should thicken and enhance sweetness without muting other flavors, maybe chopping the Butter (Movie Theater) that I'm still tasting at the end and replacing what I removed with it would help too? Kind of thinking on the fly here so take that for what it's worth. Seems it would be a very minor tweak.

Maurice

 

[Wingsfan0310]

You're Welcome! I'm always happy to try and help a fellow DIY'er. Not necessarily for this mix, but a flavor I use quite a bit as a creamy vanilla additive is TFA Vanilla Swirl. I really like it at between 2-4%. Just thought I throw that out there in case your interested.
Perfumers Apprentice - Vanilla Swirl Flavor

Cheers,
Steve

 

[Maurice Pudlo]

I don't have any Vanilla Swirl Flavor but I'm coming up on needing to order at the very least more Creme De Menthe so I'll tack that one on for good measure.

Would you describe the Vanilla Swirl Flavor as purely creamy vanilla or is there more to it?

As for the EM comment above I was thinking that given the sweetness that remains in the mix at my Mod Three level and the buttery taste that lingers a bit in combination with EM's supposed ability to both thicken and enhance existing sweetness it should kill two birds with one stone and maybe allow a slight reduction in total flavoring, maybe.

Thanks again,

Maurice

Edit: Using this as sort of a notepad for the next batch recipe, this is 17.3% flavoring which is a reduction in flavoring of 2.7% from the 20% it all started with.

Mod Four

Born on 4/28/2014 at 11:55pm
30ml batch
50:50 PG/VG
6.08mg/ml nicotine

15ml (50%) VG
6.0ml (20%) PG
3.8ml (12.6%) 48mg/ml 100% PG nicotine solution MFS
2.0ml (6.7%) Bavarian Cream LA
1.0ml (3.3%) Creme De Menthe TFA
0.8ml (2.7%) Double Chocolate BV
0.5ml (1.7%) Marshmallow TFA
0.3ml (1%) Sweet Cream TFA
0.3ml (1%) Koolada TFA
0.2ml (0.7%) Butter (Movie Theater) TFA
0.1ml (0.3%) EM TFA

I certainly need to place another order for flavorings, no doubt about it.

4/30/2014 12:43am, shake the living daylights out of the mix, crack it open for a smell. Smells wonderful, put it back without vaping, this one gets to steep.

 

[Maurice Pudlo]

Sampled 2.5ml of Mod Four between last night and today, all together it's a very nice mix that I could vape all day every day but I have a feeling that it could be cleaned up quite a bit. After doing even more research it seems some of the flavors might be fine at even lower concentrations than I'm using. My interest in lowering flavoring to the very least required to get the desired effect is something I feel is very important. I'm unsure if I'm overdoing some flavors and yet to find that point where they 'POP' for me, I'm keeping good records at least.

I think Koolada TFA can be reduced to something like 0.22ml (0.73%), the vape is cool and far from harsh, yet I am thinking when combined with the Creme De Menthe TFA it can stand to be reduced a bit without a negative effect.

I also think I might drastically reduce Marshmallow TFA to 0.15ml (0.5%), the thickness I'm looking for is only slightly there and to some extent I feel it is accompanied by a something I can't quite describe, maybe just too much flavoring. Others have mentioned using this ingredient at just 0.5% to get thickness, so that makes for a huge cut, we shall see.

Adjusting Creme De Menthe TFA to 0.48ml (1.6%), again looking at other recipes that use this ingredient I'm finding that I may be overdoing it by nearly twice as much as needed.

I may try Bavarian Cream TFA which is suggested to try at 3ml (10%), I am inclined to try 2.58ml (8.6%) as the original was quite thick and flavorful and I don't want to over do it.

The following mix is 16.1% flavoring, potentially bringing the Bavarian Cream forward, keeping Chocolate noticeable but somewhat subdued, and finishing off with a cool mint.

15ml (50%) VG
6.0ml (20%) PG
3.8ml (12.6%) 48mg/ml 100% PG nicotine solution MFS
2.58ml (8.6%) Bavarian Cream TFA
0.8ml (2.7%) Double Chocolate BV
0.48ml (1.6%) Creme De Menthe TFA
0.3ml (1%) Sweet Cream TFA
0.22ml (0.73%) Koolada TFA
0.2ml (0.7%) Butter (Movie Theater) TFA
0.15ml (0.5%) Marshmallow TFA
0.1ml (0.3%) EM TFA

Maurice

 

[Heabob]

Just a thought:

Reduce the Bavarian Cream and add some FA Vienna Cream, Vanilla Swirl, or Tahiti Vanilla.
I think mixing several different creams/vanillas can do wonders IMHO.

 

[Maurice Pudlo]

Mod Five

Born on 5/15/2014 at 1:00pm
30ml batch
50:50 PG/VG
2.88mg/ml nicotine
12.3% flavoring

15ml (50%) VG TFA
8.7ml (29%) PG TFA
1.8ml (6.0%) 48mg/ml 100% PG nicotine solution MFS
1.3ml (4.3%) Creme De Menthe TFA
0.8ml (2.7%) Double Chocolate Dark TFA
0.6ml (2.0%) Bavarian Cream TFA
0.4ml (1.4%) Menthol Liquid 10% PG Solution TFA
0.3ml (1.0%) Vanilla Swirl TFA
0.3ml (1.0%) Sweet Cream TFA
0.2ml (0.7%) Koolada TFA
0.2ml (0.7%) Butter (Movie Theater) TFA
0.1ml (0.3%) Brown Sugar Extra TFA
0.1ml (0.3%) Vanilla Bean Ice Cream TFA
0.1ml (0.3%) Marshmallow TFA
0.1ml (0.3%) Honey TFA

Best yet.

I may try reducing and splitting the 1.3ml (4.3%) Creme De Menthe TFA to 0.4ml each of (Creme De Menthe, Mint Candy, and Mint Chocolate Chip all TPA).

Needs a steep I'm sure, I just nuked it for 6 seconds, shook and drew off 2.5ml to test.

Maurice