Ideas for Edition 3 cartomizers

[K24A3]

To avoid the burning smell in carto's, the ceramic material from Water Filters could be used. They seem to let a lot of water through very efficiently.

We would need to experiment with different ceramic densities so ejuice runs through them efficiently, but not excessively so they leak.

Here is a quick diagram I whipped up in mspaint

-The Green part is a container that holds the liquid.
-The Yellow part is the high temperature ceramic part that sits in the container wicking up the juice to the element (red)
-The Blue part is the vaporizing area.
-The purple bit is the rubber gasket/valve that opens when you push in the plastic syringe/bottle tip to refill the container.
-The outside area next to the container is see-through so you can see how much juice is in there.

And here's another design idea (Keeping it as simple as possible)

 

[Adrenalynn]

You're trying to describe ceramic capillary action. You don't want the juice to "run through them", you want it to be drawn upward through capillary action, which is probably most efficient with discs.

Your proposal, although interesting, looks pretty expensive. And as-drawn, pretty inefficient since the heating element isn't surrounded by the wick. It's going to bake on one side causing the juice to "singe" and the cartomizer to become incredibly hot (the juice is also the coolant)

Which is why ceramic heating elements available "everywhere" in "everything" wrap the heating element in the ceramic. But then the flow-through isn't going to happen as-drawn.

Read up on "capillary action" and give some thought to embedding your heating element in the ceramic capillary and how the airflow and vapor flow will work and then revisit it. There are a bazillion current designs to look at. The only other issue is convincing someone to design and build the heating elements in these tiny volumes. The number of commercial materials labs capable is limited to two or three that I'm aware of.

 

[v1John]

I would like to see the drawing for the CE2, we don't even have it yet.

 

[K24A3]

Yes the element would need to be inside the Wick near the surface of the air tunnel.

And yes I meant "drawn upward", which would be achieved by the vacuum made by sucking air through the carto. I guess the refill nozzle could act as an inlet for air to enter the container to replace the juice.

It would indeed be more expensive, but if they dont burn, they last 10 times longer, and are easier to refill, clean, and use than normal cartos, I would gladly pay twice the price.

 

[Adrenalynn]

Sorry - I was editing. Read the edited version. And capillarity isn't caused by airflow.

[edit to be more complete] Capillarity is a function of gravitational force overcoming intermolecular attraction. The amount is described as "affinity" or "capillary affinity", those technical phrases will probably help you search for the best materials.

 

[v1John]

It would be like a rock storing heat cooking the liquid, but up or down really don't mean much.

If you want something absorbent that doesn't burn, that's what the rope wick is already made of.

 

[Adrenalynn]

Ummmm - no?

Have you considered this as an avatar instead of Bugs? http://www.fishheads.net/images/chickenhawk.jpg

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K24 - you're on the right track, just not quite there with the physics yet. I'm not trying to be discouraging, just provide some more material for you to consider.

 

[v1John]

Ummmm - no?

Then what if porous ceramic filled the entire empty space inside the carto? (Except for the wind tunnel) --Refilling could be similar, but way slower and directly into the ceramic.

 

[K24A3]

K24 - you're on the right track, just not quite there with the physics yet. I'm not trying to be discouraging, just provide some more material for you to consider.

Thats cool, I'm no engineer or anything but I'm pretty cluey with things like this (even if I do say so myself lol). The 'ceramic' idea was mainly for V4L to consider the use of a solid material that can withstand high temperature and act as a wick.

The Edition 2 carto is a step in the right direction, but that rope/wick needs to be replaced with something solid and doesnt burn, such as carbon nanotubes

 

[Adrenalynn]

[edit] @ v1John Then where's your heating element?

 

[Adrenalynn]

such as carbon nanotubes

Good choice since they can be grown into quite outstanding wicks. But that's very definitely going to put them out of our price range. (yes, I see your tongue-in-cheek, but it warranted a straight response anyway).

>> I'm no engineer or anything

I hesitate to note this, because someone(s) will get uppity- I started life in physics/math intending to head to astrophysics, but then decided to make money and jumped to physics/math -> electrical engineering/math. I'm not a materials engineer, nor do I even play one here. I know the physics involved and can look up materials properties but at some point a materials engineer has to get involved.

 

[K24A3]

Carbon Nanotubes sure would be expensive.

If the juice can't be drawn 'through' the Ceramic, perhaps Ceramic/Carbon Microtubes or a Ceramic/Carbon spiral would work. I'm trying to steer away from using metals since they transfer heat too efficiently.

We have the power of suction from our mouths, so all we need is a fluid transport system that retrieve the juice from its container and carries it to the heating element. This 'transport system' needs to be able to withstand the temperature of the element, while keeping the juice container cool.

 

[v1John]

[edit] @ v1John Then where's your heating element?

in the wind tunnel


K2: then why not simply just replace the rope wick in the CE2 with a porous rock worm

 

[Adrenalynn]

Then how do you cool the heating element?

You're trying to reinvent things that don't need reinventing.

 

[K24A3]

K2: then why not simply just replace the rope wick in the CE2 with a porous rock worm

A rope of ceramic probably wouldn't transfer much liquid over the length of the rope in the Edition 2 carto, so I redesigned the Carto so there is more surface area for the heating element to vaporize the liquid, and less travel distance for the juice to go through the ceramic material.

 

[v1John]

Ok, then how about a small cermaic bit (mostly just for the part inside/outside the coil), the extended part(s) could be made of the materials currently used?






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[K24A3]

v1John, do you mean that the current rope material should be used between the reservoir and the ceramic/coil? If the ceramic part was large enough so it doesn't burn the rope, that may work. I just think that the juice would have a hard time running up the rope, then onto the ceramic, being absorbed by the ceramic, and finally being drawn to the heating element. After seeing the huge surface area of water filters, it looks like they need a lot of surface area to absorb a sufficient amount of water/juice.

@Adrenalynn, sorry if that made anyone uppity, that wasn't my intension. I just wanted to make it clear that I'm just throwing ideas onto the table, rather than let people think that I know the properties/physics of ceramic at a professional level.

 

[v1John]

Ok, then how about a small cermaic bit (mostly just for the part inside/outside the coil), the extended part(s) could be made of the materials currently used?

This is what I was thinking

(2 Dimensional, cross-section view)







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[K24A3]

That wind tunnel theory is interesting, it may actually work if the rope was far enough away from the heating element.

The thing to consider is that when the juice is exhausted, the element can get very hot and burn anything nearby that can't withstand the high temperatures.

Thats where the Ceramic idea comes into play. Ceramic can withstand an amazing amount of heat, plus it can transfer liquid.

In your diagram, if we replace the rope with Ceramic (and if there was Ceramic protecting the sides of that tunnel so the reservoir doesn't boil), it may actually work.

 

[v1John]

...
In your diagram, if we replace the rope with Ceramic (and if there was Ceramic protecting the sides of that tunnel so the reservoir doesn't boil), it may actually work.

That's kind-of what I meant, sorry if I drew it badly. Most or all of everything within the red wind tunnel is only made of ceramic and metal.

You can adjust the red lines (wind tunnel diameter) according to the requirements.

There is no silica rope wick inside the ceramic/coil bit.

This is a two dimensional representation, but the ceramic/coil bit could work better multidimensionally, with additional juice inlets feeding the rock.



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