idiot misconceptions

[LudaCura]

I just found out from a friend, that a mutual friend, who I had given info to about vaping and recommended V4L, and who managed to successfully quit smoking for five months with PV'c, has quit vaping and gone back to smoking a pack a day. The reason why? He had seen a "report" on TV about how e-cigs contain anti-freeze and are more dangerous than cigarettes. $%&#!**&&!!!! I remember reading all about how past studies of two brands of e-cigs found one to contain trace amounts of ethly glycol, which is an ingedient intoduced to some antifreezes to make them LESS deadly if swallowed. And this whole report disregarded the fact that practically no e-cigs/juices contain diethylene glycol now, but propylene glycol, which is a completely safe and FDA-approved food and medicine additive. Their similarity is the "glycol" at the end.

A few other people, upon seeing me vape, have also mentioned that they saw on TV a report about how they are dangerous and should be banned.

It angers me so much that the idiot media, and the fecking tobacco lobbyists, are succeeding in scaring the public about what is, at the least, a FAR safer alternative to cigarettes. The fact that a biased and false report made one of my friends switch back from vaping, which he told me had made him feel much better when he was vaping, back to cigarettes, which are proven to kill, boggles my mind.

I sent him an email explaining this, and he said he would think about it. I also sent him this link: http://nicotinetruth.blogspot.com/2010_07_01_archive.html

I want nothing more than the tobacco industry to die the long, hard death that it has sentenced millions of people to.

 

[NoMatches]

The media is so often just plain wrong about so many things it's ridiculous. The impressions people can get last. One person said to me about vaping "Well, if some gimmick can get you to stop smoking, then I guess it's OK." I wanted to punch him in the nose. He hadn't listened to a word I had said about it.

It gets worse when as in NYS the Health Commision board members are equally mislead and ignorant. They heard the FDA was seizing shipmeants, they are convinced vaping just HAS to be a bad and evil thing. Just one fool suggests it's a way for kids to get addicted to nicoitine, it's a fact. So they knee jerk to write legislation to ban sales. (likely influenced by big tobacco and the drug cessation companies with lobbyist promising to fill their campiagn coffers)

Ah well. I have calls in to my state senator and assembleyman for a face to face meeting. At least I'll feel like I've done something.

 

[Goldenkobold]

Yep, I had one person tell me I shouldn't vape because of the recent airplane ban on them...

saying something along the lines of "Shouldn't you wait for the testing that travel agency is doing"
to which I replied I am sure they are not actually doing any tests and I don't think they are qualified to test anything but airplanes anyway.

Is the FDA actually doing any tests at the moment? Where is this forthcoming "further testing" everyone is talking about.

 

[keyzygirl]

My husband is always saying""I heard that its really bad and it causes health problems".But when his friends want to quit he tells them all about ECF and V4L.

 

[Clover~]

Ive had a teacher tell me he read some article or heard on some news channel or some website or whatever that they were bad, dangerous, not good for you. I just laughed and told him that its wrong. I have a friend that calls me a chain smoker cus I vape a lot. some people just dont get it.. they dont want to take the effort to figure it out for themselves. the media has too much of a grip over our minds...

 

[DawnsFolly]

I don't believe the FDA is interested in doing any testing at all. There are some universities doing testing, but they don't have the funding for a large-scale study. There are other links here in the ECF forums if you are interested. I'm enrolled in a study in Switzerland and watching to see what happens in New Zealand. Hope they don't legislate away my right to choose how to live my life any more than they already have.

 

[Morandir835]

The media is controlled by the government to help control us. Ecigs don't give them the tax money that cigs do. They will do everything in their power to deter anyone from using anything that takes money out of their pockets. This entire argument has nothing to do with the safety of vaping, but with the federal's bottom dollar. The FDA doesn't want to put out a test result saying they're a better, healthier alternative to analogs until they can tack on the 4-11 dollar tax they do to cigarettes. Anyone who doesn't think the media is controlled I have three simple letters for you, FCC.

 

[burnsmary95]

It must be true... I saw it on the television....

 

[SnowDragon]

+1 Morandir, it is always about the $$$. Health concerns are trumped by the potential of state and federal revenues, P & L ratios for tobacco company shareholders, and politics.

Smoking v Vaping

I do think that the disconnect here is that you cannot cast judgement on the decisions adult individuals make. To criticize a smoker is no different than criticizing a vaper, regardless of the arguments it all comes down to personal choice. The third choice in this debate is the choice to not smoke or vape, which in the end is truly the healthiest of all choices.

In the end we can only be responsible for ourselves and understand the risk involved with our choices. The better/worse arguments are secondary to respecting the issue of personal choice.

One thing is certain, your heart is in the right place Luda.

 

[Luma]

Majority of people are inept to everything. They have no brains which in turn makes it impossible for them to think for themselves. They follow throughout their whole lives wether it be religion, family, money, politics, ect. Thats why we have the issues we do today and this runs so deep I wont even start.

Water is also ingredient in antifreeze... does that mean I should stop drinking water. ****ing idiots.

Toxicity Comparisons

This list will show how "deadly" diethylene glycol is compared to other common substances based on their LD values or Median Lethal Dose values.

Table Salt- up to 3 grams for every 2 lbs of body weight. For example, a 150 lb individual would have to consume 8 oz in a single sitting.

diethylene glycol- up to 1.4 grams for every 2 lbs of body weight. For example, a 150 lb individual would have to consume almost 4 oz in a single sitting.

Caffeine- up to .2 grams for every 2 lbs of body weight. For example, a 150 lb individual would have to consume almost .5 oz in a single sitting.

Nicotine- up to .05 grams for every 2 lbs of body weight. For example, a 150 lb individual would have to consume almost .14 oz in a single sitting.

There is no way to intelligently argue any factual matter with people who cant think for themselves. It's like trying to tell an ant to stop biting you. It's not going to stop.

I am leaving this thread now cuz I will get worked up.

In the defense of big tobacco... They mass produced a product people want. People have smoked tobacco for a long time. It is the people that smoke that are the issue. They are stupid enough not to quit then quick to blame someone else. People are stupid as you said. They made money because of this fact. They dont actually do anything wrong. The idiots who continue to buy the product are the ones who are wrong here. If you eat McDonalds every day I guarantee you will be in a world of **** real quick. But we know not to do so and nobody says anything about it. Well some of us anyways.

 

[Morandir835]

+1 to you Snow sir, it's the individuals choice what they want to do, no matter how bad it is for them or others around them. Freedom is a double edged sword.

Luma sir, I'm in the same boat you are with this. Everything can kill you, some things faster than others....

 

[Maxwell_Edison]

TRUTH: PG is added to anti-freeze to make it less poison if swallowed. PG is in asthma inhalers, food and some hospitals (children's hospitals included) pump into the air to kill germs. So you can just as easily say PG is good for you. I think this person really wanted to smoke and just needs an excuse. If anyone really believes smoking is safer than vaping, they're not playing with a full deck. The truth is ALL tobacco is sprayed with DG, which is the deadly ingredient in anti-freeze, and that's the truth. The leaves are sprayed with it, and PG happens to be in real cigs also. So his excuse to smoke reminds me of an alcoholic's excuse to drink. Any excuse will do. If he prefers to smoke, and saying he believes this makes him feel better, oh well. That's the way the ego works.

(Of course correct information needs to be made available, but in such a repressed propaganda fed nation, that's only going to happen via us - and only to those with an open mind, willing to learn).

 

[Mary Kay]

People are sheep..I have raised my children and grandchildren to think for themselves. No matter what you are told..make your up your own mind.
The media, government, big tobacco and FDA can go soak thier heads..it worked for me!

 

[deusXmchna]

The mail-order smokable anti-freeze is good, but I REALLY like the arsenic snuff (polonium flavored)..... duh.

While the smoking industry might be part of the problem, it's been largely de-fanged.
I'm thinking the pressure is coming from Big Pharma. They'd be the ones trying to give FDA (greater) authority.

There's no need for $200/month of Chantix, or $100/month of Zyban (eagerly paid out by Insurance Co's), both of which seem to have a high re-lapse, then re-administration rate. Or $200 nicotrol inhalers. $50 nicotrol nasal inhalers (with a total of 100mg/nicotine). $20-25/week for patches (often used in conjunction with other aids, or off-label SSRI's), cost of Nic gum....
if we've all switched to vaping.

I think most of pressure is coming from BigPharmaCo. Nowadays the Great HealthCare Machine owns a lots of pieces of Congress on both sides of the aisle.
Not that it matters who is against. We fight an uphill battle no matter who it is.

 

[plantlvr]

Gotta agree with ya deus, it's BP that is making a killing (pun intended) on us Boomers. Jeez the stuff they want to do to me and prescribe for me since i hit my 50's! My late Mom lived to her 80's cus she avoided doctors
I know I feel better since I quit smoking, and i know vaping is a much better alternative than smoking.
What it does come down to though is personal choice and the freedom to do what you want. The books that Orwell wrote, '1984' and 'Animal Farm' had a huge impact on me.

 

[aubergine]

Ya, I see you're in NY too, LudaCura. It's all over the TV here because of the upcoming or hopefully not upcoming legislation here - all of a sudden I've got people making stinkface at me and saying, "Ew. That's one of those things that they say isn't good for you."

 

[Luma]

The books that Orwell wrote, '1984' and 'Animal Farm' had a huge impact on me.

Great book.

 

[Morandir835]

Ms. Mary Kay you are my second favorite person from Tampa.

 

[NoMatches]

People are indeed sheep. Politicians are indeed with few exceptions, prostitutes.

I owned a landscaping company. I was a state certified pesticide applicator/technician, my company was a state registered pesticide comany. A small one man operation. This whole thing has a lot of parallels to my old business, one which the state put out of business by doubling and tripling license fees and documentation requirements.

Certainly pesticides should be controlled, but they aren't. The trained professionals are burdened by government red tape and fees, while home owners have access to the same pesticides and fertilizers, but they over apply, apply at the wrong time and use chemicals needlessly. Yet they are unregulated. It's about retail sales tax.

Nicotine is one of the most deadly pesticide posions in the landscaper's chemical tool box. Only recently in NY was it restricted by the DEC (Dept of Environmental Conservation) , you may know it by the name of Merit, a grub killer. Still, there are other posions that home owners can buy and apply, over apply and apply at the wrong time. All unregulated because of the retail sales tax it brings in.

Rant: ORGANICS

So, if it's organic it's safe, right? Nicotine is organic. So is arsenic. RoundUp is man made, not organic. 14% acedic table vinegar is more toxic than glyphosate, the AI (Acitive Ingredient) in RoundUp. It's true. Based on EPA testing, the LD50 of RoundUp is lower than your red wine table vinegar. LD50 is a test of lethal doeses of various substances, usually adminiistered orally to mice.

How much of a substance does it take to kill 50% of the test population. That is lethal dose 50%. LD50. So how can it be that a man made herbicide could be less lethal than table vinegar? Are you shocked? You probably are.

But we all know, the media has told us how harmful anything man made is. If it's organic, it's healthy. It's safe. Wrong.

Now we see it with our PV's. Ignorance, bias and of course, the ulitimate, the money motive. Same old, same old.

 

[Iowa Gal]

I'm not dumb enough to think there may not be some issues with vaping but all I know is how much better I feel and how much better I smell vaping vs the stinky cigs. I have been reducing my nicotine but honestly think I'll continue to vape even with 0 nic just because I like it, it relaxes me. Net Net as an adult I should have a choice and I find it funny how the government and so many individuals are negative to the smokers - they must not realize how much the taxes would be raised if they all quit tomorrow...