Its all in what it is called

[NY JETS]

It might be possible to use your example in reverse - start off with cigarettes and move away to other formats as the market establishes itself and products become regulated and patented.

True, it could happen. I have just seen in the past that it is very difficult for that to occur in an instance like this.

Like I mentioned with Xerox, where they filed a number of lawsuits and tried to raise public awareness on the word Xerox. The thing is, people got so accustomed to saying "Can you xerox me a copy of that?" or "Make me a xerox of that report."

I could see a similar thing happening with Ruyan and "electronic cigarette" if the patent is awarded and reuglation is instituted, but how successful they will be with it remains to be seen. I still hear people say Xerox all the time in the workplace while not referring to a machine made by the actual company...

 

[Kate]

Yes, there are a few words that has happened to (hoover, coke, etc.). The difference is that electronic cigarette doesn't sound good and it's not a brand name. It might be argued that it's become genericised but it's not attractive, short or snappy and I'll bet the trend with the general public will be for something more accurate and/or easier to justify legally and socially.

EDIT

It's not Ruyan who own most of the ecig trademarks, it's Cixi - http://e-cig.com/shopping/shopcontent.asp?type=About

 

[NY JETS]

I wonder about those trademarks that Cixi claims to own. I see its also on the wikipedia page for e-cig. That is interesting though, thanks for pointing that out Kate.

I would also think the general public would look to change the term to something more easily justifiable, but only if it was required. The major vendors are not going to change their language unless it is necessary, and then there would be a trickle-down effect.

It just seems very silly to me to be using an 84mm e-cig with a brown mouthpiece, orange LED, and white battery in public, and say "No it's not one of those electronic cigarettes you have heard about, this is actually called a ________." It just seems very "politician" to me.

Very tricky situation indeed, but I personally will still call it an e-cig. If I am forced to change it on my site for marketing reasons, then I guess I will have to follow the rules. I just fail to see the logic.

 

[Kate]

"... an 84mm e-cig with a brown mouthpiece, orange LED, and white battery ..." proportionally that might not be a majority.

Anyway, well see how it all plays out.

 

[lotus14]

If it looks like a cigarette, performs the same action as a cigarette, looks to bystanders like a cigarette, and serves the same exact purpose as a cigarette, how can you not call it a cigarette?

E-cigs or personal vaporizers do NOT perform the same action as a cigarette. Cigarettes Burn tobacco which produces smoke which contains tar (and thousands of chemicals) which coats your lungs and turns them black.

Calling them electronic cigarettes was a natural choice - in the beginning. But make no mistake - they are NOT cigarettes.

 

[NY JETS]

You are right lotus, I misspoke there. I meant to say that they serve the exact purpose, which I put in a little after, but didn't remove that it performs the same action. I should have been more careful in a thread discussing the specifc language lol.

 

[Bryn]

If it was called "personal vaporizer" I would have ignored it, moved on thinking it was for people with asthma. "Electronic Cigarette" was what caught my eye and I investigated it. The rest is history. Yes, it's great for marketing and bringing to attention the smokers who want to quit smoking analogs.

I know it sucks that FDA, Big Pharma, Big Tobacco co. etc. just had to .... in, but truth be told, calling it "e-cigarette" is way to go for smokers mainly.

 

[Kate]

I get what you're saying Bryn and that was an important way to spread awareness of vaping when it started off but now we are faced with regulation, partly because of language and claims. It might be possible that using 'cigarettes' to raise awareness will bring the whole thing down when regulators decide to put a stop to it.

I don't think publicity is as important now, it might be most prudent to rely on word of mouth and recommendation.

 

[arogyam]

Yea. On my site I go just short of telling you it will send you to the grave.

yes ! correct.. smoking is too injurious to health.

 

[Bryn]

I get what you're saying Bryn and that was an important way to spread awareness of vaping when it started off but now we are faced with regulation, partly because of language and claims. It might be possible that using 'cigarettes' to raise awareness will bring the whole thing down when regulators decide to put a stop to it.

I don't think publicity is as important now, it might be most prudent to rely on word of mouth and recommendation.

Yes, you're right, Once FDA allows "personal vaporizer" or "xxx inhaler" or "cloud maker" whatever they're satisfied with, we could go back calling it e-cig, can't we?

 

[harmony gardens]

Are we going to press the founders of this forum to change the name of the forum??

Call them what you will,,, it will boil down to the test results showing that these claims are basically true.

In reading through some of the studies that I have been reading that the anti people are putting forward,,, it shouldn't be hard to run some studies to prove the claims. If they can't, some adjustments will be needed. That is the responsibility of the ECA, and it's members. They have a big job!

As vapors, we can share our expiriences, express our opinions, offer support for fellow nicotine addicts, hope and pray together, and enjoy our new found "hobby" as best we can.

The arguements against ecigs are too lame to stand the light of day.

 

[galaxywd]

Time to get creative ;-) , How about a battery powered portable heater and oil aroma burner

 

[Bad Newz Blare]

what should be done is slowly getting the name of the "nicotine inhaler" out there. a very true point is that by any other name besides "electronic cigarette" will cause a loss of business and exposure but all the people of the e-cig community and suppliers have to do is just explain that is Actually NOT a cigarette of any sort but more of a PV or NI.

for example john doe has heard about a device called an "electric cigarette" so he googles it and comes across a site named electric-cig.com or whatever. the site should introduce it as a "e-cig" but inform john doe that its actually a "nicotine inhaler" and from there on out ONLY refer to it as a nicotine inhaler. making the links to the device nicotine inhaler kits instead of any other name. naturally if john doe sees 901 nicotine inhaler and yeti nicotine inhaler under the picture of the products he will refer to them as so. I doubt this would happen but IMO this would be the only way to get rid of the cancerous "cigarette" word from these devices.

 

[Kate]

Yes, you're right, Once FDA allows "personal vaporizer" or "xxx inhaler" or "cloud maker" whatever they're satisfied with, we could go back calling it e-cig, can't we?

Yes, we can call it what we like, it's the traders and manufacturers who have to be careful about language and claims.

I understand that in the US it is legal to sell 'water pipes' or 'hookahs' but not 'bongs' and they must be sold without association with controlled substances. When the customer gets their hookah they can call it a .... if they like and nobody is going to know what substances they use it for at home.

 

[GreySaber]

Yes, we can call it what we like, it's the traders and manufacturers who have to be careful about language and claims.

I understand that in the US it is legal to sell 'water pipes' or 'hookahs' but not 'bongs' and they must be sold without association with controlled substances. When the customer gets their hookah they can call it a .... if they like and nobody is going to know what substances they use it for at home.

True. In my state, it's illegal to sell 'sex toys' but legal to sell 'adult novelties.'

 

[Tallgirl1974]

It is an electronic cigarette. If you have a SD or GG or other mod where the thing is bigger than your hand, than ok you are free too call it whatever you want and get away with it.

When you are going to use a 901, Pen-style, mini, super duper mini, or whatever it is, that is small and replicates the same basic shape as a real cigarette, I'm sorry but going around saying this is my personal nicotine inhaler isn't going to fool anybody. If it looks like a cigarette, performs the same action as a cigarette, looks to bystanders like a cigarette, and serves the same exact purpose as a cigarette, how can you not call it a cigarette?

Sure it is easy to point the finger at the initial suppliers and call them stupid and greedy for ever naming our devices e-cigs (gasp.). The name of this forum is e-cigarette-forum. Some models look EXACTLY like a cigarette (8084). Even as there are a ton of new vendors trying to start businesses every day, I have yet to see one called personalvaporizer-shop or nicotineinhalertreats or anything of the sort. Why? Because nobody will have any idea what the hell it is you sell, unless they came to this specific website first and put in a few hours of research. Not good for business IMO.
You really expected the manufacturers and first supplier's of these products to call them anything but electronic cigarettes? If that did happen. I would bet this forum would be 95% smaller if it even existed under a different name. The useage of these devices would be far less prevalent, and most of us would still be sucking down analogs like it was nobody's business. I guess some would be chewing Nicorette for a few weeks.
My point is sure, the word cigarette has horrible connotations attached to it in this overly society that we all live in today. However, without that word being used for e-cigs or whatever you want to call them now, most of us wouldn't have heard about it, or taken it half as seriously.

I half agree and half don't. I hate the box we get painted into, like we are immoral because we are (ex)smokers and calling it something positive appeases the bloodthirsty masses. We let them put us in the box by changing the name to make them happy. But, if people let us keep them because we do call it something "positive sounding"....
However- yeah- had I heard it called an inhaler it wouldn't have got my attention.
What do you do though- its a double edged. Name it one thing we might slid under the radar- but as a cop out. Name it another and we chance getting the negative spot light on us.

 

[donei]

at work I don't call it an e-cig, vaporizer, inhaler..... I cal it my "not cigarette"

It's not a cigarette but it gives me what I need to keep from smoking.

 

[silverfox]

a couple of alternatives may be, "smoke simulators", "virtual cigs", "non-smoking device", "un-cigarette", "vapor sticks",...I personally like the "NON-smoking device" because it claims only that it does not smoke...and actually, it doesnt help you quit smoking, if you are vaping only, technically you have already quit..

there are some interesting examples of how the govt selectively applies the use of terminology...i have never had a 3 day waiting period while the FBI checked me out so I could buy a "paint gun" (sprayer)...or been investigated for buying "bomb-pops"(popsicles)...any outrage over the fact that "anti-freeze" is actually a coolant?..a "hot water heater" only heats cold water?.....where is George Carlin when we need him!..lol..

oddly enough the Govt seems to thrive on mis-labeling for itself...the "assault weapons ban", which has nothing to do at all with assault weapons ( fully automatic weapons )...the "fairness doctrine" which is actually completely unfair...you get the idea..

we have to realise that, in the US anyway, we arent working with a Republican vs Democrat problem..this is a Libertarian vs Statist issue and its gaining momentum (tea parties)...if we manage to get the govt on the track of libertarianism we will get our e-cigs, if not we will get them at 3x the price in a few years and not before...
our best bet is to keep putting pressure on our reps, the more noise we can make the more they will respond, but yes we have to be smarter than they are about it..as long as we can make a legitamate argument for our position there will be someone with power willing to argue all day long about it..

 

[silverfox]

oooo.. heres a thought...how about stating,.."not yet FDA approved"...and disclaimers about being "unproven"...
the Cheerios incident really shows what exactly their angle is, its about advertising claims, not facts...if this is the case, all we really need to do is find the advertising language they would find acceptable...
if a drinking glass was labeled a "water delivery device" they would be stating that water has been proven deadly in certain amounts, especially in cases of inhalation, has never been proven harmless, and is highly addictive....it is used to treat or cure dehydration...etc. etc....

 

[AnimeFur]

Eh, I most of the time call it an ecig, then at huh add mini fog machine.
If interested I mention other fun facts.

In a world of cessation products and drug Water pipes/ hookahs all being available, I have little doubt that these will have the following needed to survive, and the connections needed to stay available.

My be some rough patches though. Namely, that it considered a drug delivery device and that it is thereby considered a tobacco product. Tough road there, fellows.

Stock up, read up, in some cases,may need a little shut up, and we will ride this storm out.