It's Time to protect Craft Eliquid or Artisan Eliquid

[Berylanna]

The laws protecting "Craft Beers" were apparently passed as part of the end of Prohibition, on purpose to prevent big brewers from controlling the market.

Now that BT is getting into bed with the FDA, we need to raise public consciousness of the need for the small e-liquid artists and their part in our ability to drop combustibles.

Yes, the mass market might be just fine for many but the innovation (a NICE buzzword that works on legislators, media, and businesses) that brought us where we are today came from the small vendors.

BT wants to crush that, IMO, and I think we need to decide between "Craft eliquid" and "Artisan eliquid" as a buzzword and start lobbying to make legislators aware that, at the very least they MUST NOT CRIMINALIZE that. Maybe if we start by asking for more protection for Artisans, we can bargain down to "OK, they can't make health claims but they can still sell."

I think this will be a horribly difficult fight but getting our verbiage going might be a prerequisite. How can I ask Feinstein and Boxer to support Artisan eliquid vendors if there aren't any web sites that say that's what they are?

Let's pick a word and start using it!

 

[Jibbu]

Berylanna, that's a cool idea!

How about Artisan Niquid? Craft Niquid? Eliquid, e-liquid, e-juice, e-jc ... I don't know, but somehow they don't sound as serious as niquid. But that's just my opinion, not a blanket-statement.

On the other hand, maybe "Niquid" is somebody's trademark and I just missed that fact???

 

[BakuPeg]

I'm on board. Craft eliquids sound peachy

 

[Berylanna]

Did some Thesauras-ing.

Craft Vapor Blender?
Artisan Vapor Crafter?

I like "Blender" because it makes it more clear that the ingredients come from approved sources. (The scary nano-trace of ingredient d-something that the FDA found in that ONE Chinese sample is a common, and deadly, component of counterfeit glycerine.)

I don't want anything that rules out NET's of course.

I like Vapor instead of e-liquid because 1. it's shorter and 2. it sounds better, even though it's not really precisely accurate.

 

[aubergine]

My two cents worth:
I like artisan better than craft because it's familiar in relation to products besides beer - artisan bread, artisan cheese, artisan chocolate, artisan liqueurs... Too much Etsy in 'craft'.

(Google craft foods and you get Kraft foods, and irony, ha.)
Any food that claims to be artisan simply needs to be not mass produced; consumers can decide if connotations of excellence are deserved, right?

I like 'blend' for specific flavors - especially since the word relates to tobacco and also non-tobacco ingredient mixes.

But it gets clumsy, don't it? Especially since the vapor isn't blended, the liquid is.

The stuff could be called Artisan Vapor or, more correctly, Artisan PV liquid (I agree re the lamentable 'e-cig' anything, but PV liquid now has its own not so licit connotation; I think e-liquid is here to stay, like it or not.)
and/or Artisan Vapor Blends. Or, in surrender to convention and efficiency, Artisan E-cig Liquids, and we're back at square one.

Following the convention in food prep, the maker could be Creator (or Maker or Mixer or Producer) of Handcrafted Artisan Vapor Blends. (Wordy but dunno how to invent a word that rings like the elegant 'chocolatier', the wholesome 'cheesemaker' or the trendy 'barista'. Too bad we didn't come up with anything better than joose in the first place. Joosier'? Or maybe not. )

If you really think that 'Blender' identifies ingredients as being from approved sources, Artisan Vapor Blender and etc., but it sounds like an appliance. And what of excellent mixer/vendors who extract their own flavors?

I'm only posting this because I haven't done anything productive all day, and need to justify my existence.

 

[Faylool]

I'm for Artisian

 

[hippieben]

As long as it doesn't raise prices. Cost of materials is next to nothing and prices are pretty reasonable right now, but if they go up just for the sake of being "craft" that's not cool. Most vendors are using artificial flavors, but some are making their own and I'll always be willing to pay more for more effort on the part of the vendor. But I see no reason to class someone who buys flavorart flavorings and mixes from that as craft, even if they are super talented; they're just a small business. I don't want to see the eliquid market dominated buy a walmart giant, but let's not forget that eliquid production costs are next to nothing.

I think what you're really saying is that you don't want to see a tobacco company making all the eliquid and charging a dollar+ per ml (which is what would probably happen). When I think of artisan eliquids I think of something like Ahlusion, which as long as law allows will always exist. A small vendor like MBV needs to be protected, but not necessarily classed as "artisan." If we were to do that we would end up with a bunch of new vendors out to make a quick buck with super high prices just because they call themselves artisan and want to cash in.

What we really need to do is pay attention to what the FDA proposes later this month and then voice our opinions. If they say that they want to shut down small vendors and have all eliquid produced by BT, we need to tell them hell no.

 

[Berylanna]

As long as it doesn't raise prices. Cost of materials is next to nothing and prices are pretty reasonable right now, but if they go up just for the sake of being "craft" that's not cool. Most vendors are using artificial flavors, but some are making their own and I'll always be willing to pay more for more effort on the part of the vendor. But I see no reason to class someone who buys flavorart flavorings and mixes from that as craft, even if they are super talented; they're just a small business. I don't want to see the eliquid market dominated buy a walmart giant, but let's not forget that eliquid production costs are next to nothing.

I think what you're really saying is that you don't want to see a tobacco company making all the eliquid and charging a dollar+ per ml (which is what would probably happen). When I think of artisan eliquids I think of something like Ahlusion, which as long as law allows will always exist. A small vendor like MBV needs to be protected, but not necessarily classed as "artisan." If we were to do that we would end up with a bunch of new vendors out to make a quick buck with super high prices just because they call themselves artisan and want to cash in.

What we really need to do is pay attention to what the FDA proposes later this month and then voice our opinions. If they say that they want to shut down small vendors and have all eliquid produced by BT, we need to tell them hell no.

Right now they're calling ALL of our favorite e-liquid vendors bathtub chemists. I think that BEFORE they deem, we need to have the media buzzing about Artisan e-liquids, and be writing our congresscritters about not letting the FDA deem against them.

Not a heavy campaign, but just setting the idea in the public's mind that these are artisans blending food-grade and pharmaceutical-grade pg, vg, nicotine, and flavorings, NOT cooking up something weird in the bathtub.

As far as the things *I* vape, they are soaking tobacco in the pg before mixing in the nicotine and vg, or they're adding WTA, but they are still not buying cold medicines on the black market and cooking them up into a batch of poison in a rented house, leaving a toxic dump behind.

I think E-liquid vendors are either going to be compared to the current makers of illegal and often-deadly substances, or else Artisan vitners and Craft Brewers. I'd rather see the latter. Maybe we should ask CASAA whether before or after the deeming is better but I'm getting tired of playing defense.

 

[Lessifer]

Crafters of Artisan Nicotine Juice Blends?

Just kidding, I like the idea, Artisan I think is better than Craft, just sounds nicer. Niquid or something like that is a brand, so I think that's out. E-liquid, is probably the way to go, like it or not, the world knows them as e-cigarettes.

 

[hippieben]

Right now they're calling ALL of our favorite e-liquid vendors bathtub chemists. I think that BEFORE they deem, we need to have the media buzzing about Artisan e-liquids, and be writing our congresscritters about not letting the FDA deem against them.

Not a heavy campaign, but just setting the idea in the public's mind that these are artisans blending food-grade and pharmaceutical-grade pg, vg, nicotine, and flavorings, NOT cooking up something weird in the bathtub.

As far as the things *I* vape, they are soaking tobacco in the pg before mixing in the nicotine and vg, or they're adding WTA, but they are still not buying cold medicines on the black market and cooking them up into a batch of poison in a rented house, leaving a toxic dump behind.

I think E-liquid vendors are either going to be compared to the current makers of illegal and often-deadly substances, or else Artisan vitners and Craft Brewers. I'd rather see the latter. Maybe we should ask CASAA whether before or after the deeming is better but I'm getting tired of playing defense.

I do see your point, it's a matter of public perception. What I see happening is some kind of license being needed to sell eliquid (which is much the same as craft breweries as far as I know). This will be a good thing though, all the established vendors (and even new vendors) will (should) be able to afford a license, and it will protect consumers from those vendors out there (and I'm sure there are some) that are mixing in their kitchen, then making dinner in the same space, then mixing some more liquid later that evening without proper cleaning or a dedicated space. As of now we self regulate to a degree. If someone gets a toenail in their bottle of juice, a post goes up, and it becomes a huge thing and we either demand answers from the vendor or we just stop buying from them. The issue with this that we represent such a small portion of the vaping community (then again, most people are probably buying prefilled cartos and this is totally irrelevant).

The other issue with this is that there really isn't enough time between now and when the FDA will put out their proposed regulations to get enough of a media stir going to affect what will be proposed. I don't think we really have any option other than to play the defense at this point.

But that being said, there is a huge value in keeping the little guys around and even though innovation is a nice buzz word, it's exactly what will be missed if the little guys are stomped out. Like I said, I see your point and I'm not trying to be a downer, but I think the best course of action is to wait and see what the FDA wants to do and go from there. The argument that the small vendors are artisan mixers is the perfect thing to reply to the FDA with and it won't be a bad idea at all if articles were to be published drawing comparisons between craft brewers and private eliquid vendors (vapor by vapers for vapers type of thing).

I would definitely get in contact with CASAA (or Bill G, as he is a member here) and see what they would recommend. They're not god, but they know how to play the game better than I do.

 

[aubergine]

Remember this? Back in Black - Artisanal Foods - The Daily Show with Jon Stewart - 05/01/12 - Video Clip | Comedy Central

So, want to impress the FDA?:

Prole-Steam! 100% Monsanto flavorings! Real, pure, taxable nicotine! Pink Slime option! GMO option! Ingredients 100% factory produced by many many many hands, all within our global commercial empire! Toenails and other detritus carefully sealed in sterile, closed cartridges! Packaging carefully designed to repulse children and hedonists! Labelled out the wazoo! Prole-steam has friends in high places! A Lorillard compliant vendor!
So damned taxable you don't need to care if it was made in a bathtub! But it warnt.

Congress?:

" Oh look. Your SON vapes. Surprise! 'Evolve' or perish!"

 

[jaamzhow]

Equid
vapquid