Knowing Amperage(Amps) is important

[Some1OnThisForum]

Hello everyone. Im a noob e-smoker, and im also very noob to these forums.

Im not very sure if Amperage was discussed yet in these forums, i have not searched every thread.

First, ill let you know a little bit about myself. Im 31 from NJ, and im 10 years experienced in the heating cooling and refrigeration field(HVAC/R). 80% of service calls in our field are electrical. Usually low voltage 24volt components.

At the time of my vaping discovery I noticed a commonly discussed Atomizers, and of coincidence...I just got done fixing 3 oil burner nozzles. Atomization is a big part of the oil burner motors, and is a delicate creature indeed. Though these atomizers which we call Electrodes operate at extremly high voltages of 10,000-12,000volts. heres a quick peek at the electrodes(attys)....



those atomizers are about the length of your cell phone, and as thick at half a pencil. Lets just say i know what im doing when it comes to atomization..lol If i where to somehow pump a gallon of e-liquid through the nozzle i could engulf a city block with vapor in about 20 seconds.....with a fan blowing on it of course..LOL those nozzles push 4gallons of minute through a pin hole. Anyway...thats enough talk about those.

I noticed alot of people discussing problems with atomizers, and how they can burn out easily, or get ruined with thicker darker liquids. This is true indeed. This is because darker fluids leave a carbon staining on the coils every time it gets a too hot. ecig attys are WAY TO SMALL to clean this carbon off, and as a result you will not get alot of vapor as if you would using a lighter liquid.


Now lets talk a little about amperage


AMPERAGE

I notice when it comes to the electrical part, its always Volts for batteries and Ohms for attys, but noone talks about amperage.

Too much amperage is essentially bad...its the amperage that makes the attys too hot...hence you always hear(low res attys burn hot) When Ohms decreases...Amperage Rises, and fast. and vice versa. This is why high res attys last forever.

Follow Ohms Law to guide you in the right atty/battery combination in all circumstances.

To figure out Amps. Divide the voltage by the Resistance(ohms) a 0.75ohm atty on a 3v battery will produce the same exact amount of vapor as a 1.5ohm atty would on a 6volt battery, and the attys on both will essentially have the same life span. Only difference is you will drain the hell out of your battery on the 3volt.

The smaller difference in numbers between the atty rating and the number of volts from the battery..the longer the battery life. Voltage(energy) from the battery has an easier time leaving it with low resistance holding it in. the more resistance...the harder it will be for those Volts(energy) to leave the battery.


Batteries have their own resistance too...a 3 volt battery with half the resistance of a 6volt battery with give the same amount of battery life, and will work exactly the same in energy production


hope you enjoyed the reading

 

[yohann976]

Wow, that's a lot of information. I'm still pretty new to e-cigs so I don't know too much. I've read that a low amp atty will hit harder a regular on with a lot more vapor, but can overheat easier. Thanks for the technical info.

 

[n2xe]

Since V=I * R where V is volts, I is amps (I know, why isn't it A, A was already taken) and R is ohms (I know, deal with it) so if you know R which is the resistance of your atty and its constant, then you can use amps or volts, just do the appropriate math. So with the standard 3.7 volt battery (more like 3.4V under load) and a 1.5 ohm atty, you'll pull about 2.3 amps. Most people use volts because it's printed on the battery.

If you want to know how much heat you are generating, that's power measured in watts which is V squared divided by R or volts times amps. Either gives you the same answer.

So neither is more important than the other. With two of the three values (V, I, R) you can figure out everything you need to know. Since everyone knows the voltage of their battery and resistance of their atty, why bother with amps?

 

[AttyPops]

Thanks everyone for discussing this. Just a note:

V * V / R = watts (if the battery can supply the amps).

With e-cigs... the amps often suffer since the li-ion batteries (at least the smaller ones) don't put out enough amps. Hence all the discussion on high-drain batteries, and larger batteries. You'll find this info all over, but it is good to discuss it again. I guess that's why we care about amps. Knowing the info helps understand why super-mini batteries are so limited. In that case, you have to know how many amps the battery can supply, as well as desired/ideal amps.

Also, note that there are issue when using LR (1.5 Ω) atties and some devices (like eGo units) in that they can "over amp" and fry the MOSFETs (circuits in the battery side). So, like the OP more or less said, it's all 3 things working together in the right balance.

BTW... this discussion works well with extension cords and high-watt devices (like electric heaters) too. That's why higher rated extension cords are either thicker, or shorter. They have their own resistance, and need to be able to handle the watts. Anyone ever melt an extension cord by putting a long skinny cord on a high-watt heater? lol. So... it's good to know these things.

From a user perspective, it's too bad we even have to know. Ideally, we'd just have robust devices and "miracle" batteries that supplied a days worth of energy in a super-mini cig sized battery. Someday........

 

[Some1OnThisForum]

n2xe, amps are very important to understand. This especially to battery size since the thinner the battery, the more resistance.

and 1 watt = 3.41 volts

watts and Volts are the same thing, just a different measurement.



anyway, back to what attypop was saying.

______________________
With e-cigs... the amps often suffer since the li-ion batteries (at least the smaller ones) don't put out enough amps.
______________________



Thank you atty pop, this must be true because the thinner the path for voltage...the less amps, and more resistance...hence "smaller batteries"


hmm, im thinking...since too much amps can fry the mofset, than turning the battery on with no atty should fry it too since there is no resistance...maybe it has its own ground?

 

[tenzip]

and 1 watt = 3.41 volts
watts and Volts are the same thing, just a different measurement.

Um, in a word, no. W != V. Not in any way.

 

[n2xe]

n2xe, amps are very important to understand. This especially to battery size since the thinner the battery, the more resistance.

and 1 watt = 3.41 volts

watts and Volts are the same thing, just a different measurement.



anyway, back to what attypop was saying.

______________________
With e-cigs... the amps often suffer since the li-ion batteries (at least the smaller ones) don't put out enough amps.
______________________



Thank you atty pop, this must be true because the thinner the path for voltage...the less amps, and more resistance...hence "smaller batteries"


hmm, im thinking...since too much amps can fry the mofset, than turning the battery on with no atty should fry it too since there is no resistance...maybe it has its own ground?

Watts is power or heat it you prefer, volts are electromotive potential or the "push" behind the electrons. So power is volts times amps. Volts is just volts. If you had a million volts and an infinite resistance, that would produce zero work or zero watts. On the other hand, if you had a million volts across one ohm, that would be a megawatt. Big difference and it all depends upon the load (resistance). So volts are potential and watts are work. Two completely different animals. I'm an electrical engineer, I know that much at least...

 

[Liv2Ski]

And I thought my Phsysics lessons had long past. Thanks PV's for allowing me to use some of that knowledge I paid big $$$$$$ for.

 

[n2xe]

And I thought my Phsysics lessons had long past. Thanks PV's for allowing me to use some of that knowledge I paid big $$$$$$ for.

Volts? Amps? Who cares, a Cisco LR 306 atty really puts out.

 

[Liv2Ski]

Volts? Amps? Who cares, a Cisco LR 306 atty really puts out.

Yes it does. My box is stocked w/about 30 Cisco LR 1.5 306's right now along with 5 of the 2.0ohm 306's and a dozen of his LR 510's. Waiting till Iken gets some stock on his for a nice well rounded collection of the finest atty's out there! Big clouds to you n2xe

 

[VaporMadness]

hmm, im thinking...since too much amps can fry the mofset, than turning the battery on with no atty should fry it too since there is no resistance...maybe it has its own ground?

Um... that would be infinite resistance... the exact opposite of no resistance... when the button is pressed no current flows without an atty screwed on.

You might have some luck grokking DC electricity by thinking of it in terms of water flowing. Voltage is like a bunch of water high up in a water tank, the higher the water the higher the voltage. Current (amps) is like the rushing of water thru a pipe, the greater the volume/second of water, the greater the current. A skinny pipe has high resistance (harder to force water thru), a wide pipe low resistance. A lot of water falling a long distance releases a lot of power (watts), a trickle of water falling a short distance is not so much power.

To get a lot of power out of a 3.7v setup, you need a lot of current. It's falling a shorter distance, so you need more current to match the power of a 6v setup. To allow that much current to flow, you'll need wide pipes (low resistance), and your battery (water tank) needs to be able to spill water out fast enough to fill the wide pipe... maybe you get the idea...

 

[n2xe]

Yes it does. My box is stocked w/about 30 Cisco LR 1.5 306's right now along with 5 of the 2.0ohm 306's and a dozen of his LR 510's. Waiting till Iken gets some stock on his for a nice well rounded collection of the finest atty's out there! Big clouds to you n2xe

I know it's off topic but I'll try to make it relevant. I have some cisco 510s on order and I'm really amped up about them (see how I wedged in an amp reference), how do the Cisco LR 510s do for you?

And likewise liv2ski, big clouds to you!

 

[n2xe]

Yes it does. My box is stocked w/about 30 Cisco LR 1.5 306's right now along with 5 of the 2.0ohm 306's and a dozen of his LR 510's. Waiting till Iken gets some stock on his for a nice well rounded collection of the finest atty's out there! Big clouds to you n2xe

Big clouds to you too liv2ski. How do you like the Cisco 510s? Sorry about the redundant post...

 

[Liv2Ski]

Big clouds to you too liv2ski. How do you like the Cisco 510s? Sorry about the redundant post...

No problem. I do like them. Not as much as the 306's but they are much better than a standard run of the mill LR 510. Nice for those more delicate flavors that can get overpowered bt the 306. His 901 is also nice and I would say produces the coolest vape of the three. That is what is so neat about this hobby so many awesome gadgets and gear that you can pretty much dial in the sweetspot for any juice. I am certain you will enjoy the 510's but my guess is you will most likely still hit the 306's more.

 

[res125]

I've never seem ohms law explained so many different ways. LOL

 

[Some1OnThisForum]

id really like to create some sort of super e-cig using those electrodes from the oil burner..like i 300gallon tank attached to it with a hose you place in your mouth. couple of puffs of that, and your probably set for the day in nicotine..either that or your calling 911 LOL

 

[n2xe]

id really like to create some sort of super e-cig using those electrodes from the oil burner..like i 300gallon tank attached to it with a hose you place in your mouth. couple of puffs of that, and your probably set for the day in nicotine..either that or your calling 911 LOL

Already been done. I think it's called the Tesla Thumb tack mod. YouTube - Broadcast Yourself.

 

[Maast]

I dont actually think amps alone is all that useful as a number, however I often wondered why we dont use Watts in ref to attys, as its a composite number of volts * amps thats governed by the resistance.

That way when you're comparing a LR atty on (X) batterys voltage you can compare apples to apples if you're talking about a HR atty on a different battery and its voltage.

You can go ahead and say "this setup is generating (Y) watts of heat as compared to this other setup which is only generating (Z) watts which is why this one is better". Better being defined as more heat being produced - up to a certian point at least.

 

[VaporMadness]

yes... watts is the right metric to use for comparing ecig setups from the electrical point of view... about 7 watts is right for me... more and more vapers are talking in terms of watts... the Darwin's lets you dial in your desired wattage for example.

you do have to consider amps when sizing your batteries... can they provide the amps that you need to produce your desired wattage... 16340 IMRs work for me.

 

[BuzzKill]

Just vary it man ! and here is a cool Ohms law app. Ohm's Law Calculator