Massive smokeless tobacco tax increase

[ad356]

Many, many families have benefited greatly by the impact of IDEA even in it's limited and hobbled form. Now fix it!

another stupid remark. what about the many smokers that have benefited from the use of the electronic cigarette in the great help they have been in getting off of truely dangerous tobacco. so im guessing a successful way to fix it is to kill us off, that is nicotine addicts. condemn us to death while a few select people benefit instead of potentially helping millions of smokers get off of tobacco. not to mention the loss of funding that they surely will feel when the black market really starts to thrive. the level of increase in taxes that this stupid program would cause would only make people get their cigarettes illegally anyways. rest assured this "for the children" non-sense is only going to loose money since no one is going to buy their cigarettes legally anymore.

i guess we as smokers in their eyes we should die as addicts or quit in misery.

it just isnt right

 

[ByStander1]

Update: Finally got down to the local tobacco store and gave the manager paper slips with this legislation's info. The papers are just a business-card sized piece with the rate information on one side with the heading "More TAXES for the Tobacco Users." On the other side, is the contact information for Rockefeller with the heading "What you can do to stop this." The store management is as against these kinds of hikes as anyone. They are more than happy to pass the information on to their customers.

Seriously, I urge everyone to take the tiny amount of time, money, and effort this took to do. Plus, it's an incredible high to "do something, anything" against the power-hungry, insatiable, nanny state.

 

[BadThad]

I did my part! Taxed Enough Already!

 

[mostlyclassics]

Said ad356 in post 359:

jeeze 3,200 lbs for a jetta?? i have a 1987 Bonneville and it weights around 3,200 lbs and it is a much larger car than a jetta. modern cars are bloated pigs. the bonneville has a 3.8 v6 and it has decent performance even with 24 year old technology. i currently own this car, it came from Florida so the body is in excellent condition and it has a remanufacted engine so it runs wonderfully. my point is i cannot believe that a 2006 jetta weights as much as the bonne, the bonneville is a large car by today's poor standards. vehicles just get smaller yet heavier, this makes little sense.

Pretty unbelievable, isn't it, how cars have bloated up so we can safely tootle down the expressway while texting or concentrating on dialing on our iPhones?

Here are some comparisons:

1960's Mini Cooper: it might have weighed 1,600 pounds dripping wet, in stage-3 tune.
2011 Mini Cooper: 2,525 pounds (Road & Track website)

1970's VW Rabbit GTI: about 1,750 pounds.
1991 VW Golf GTI (4-banger): about 2,200 pounds (I had one of these)
2011 VW GTI (4-banger): 3,025 pounds (Road & Track website)

1986 VW Jetta GLI: about 2,400 pounds (I had one of these)
2008 VW Jetta GLI (4-banger): 3,300 pounds (Road & Track website)

All other factors being equal, a 10% reduction in weight means about a 7% improvement in fuel economy. So you do the math. If the United States were truly interested in reducing our dependence on foreign oil, we could simply roll back the automobile safety standards to what they were in the late 1980's-early 1990's. After a decade to replace the fleet, the gasoline consumption would drop by 25%. And the cars of the 1980's were nearly as "safe" as what we're driving around now. For instance, our 1986 VW GLI got rear-ended by a monstrous Chevy van (about 5,500 pounds) traveling at 45 mph (according to the police report) when it hit us. The trunk was totally crushed, but we opened the doors and got out with no injuries (no airbags in the car, but we were seat-belted). That's really safe enough.

Sorry, I got OT, but this particular hobby horse I ride a lot.

 

[sqirl1]

im getting annoyed.
It's the correct thing to do. Tax them... Nicotine is a dangerous and extremely addictive drug just as bad as Smoking if not worse

another stupid remark. nicotine a dangerous drug??? no more than caffine. it is addictive, which is why something like the e-cig is so important. it gets smokers off the smokes that cannot quit. just as bad as smoking? huh? again stupid remark. the ecig delivers nicotine, flavorings, pg/vg and some food grade substances. all in all around 20 FDA approved food grade substances. a cigarette contains around 4,000 chemicals. the science is quite sound i would reassure this ......s.


thats a list of chemicals found in cigarettes, these people should NOT have a voice until they do the research like we have. yes, the risk associated with the e-cig is not yet fully known but im sure its a fraction of the risk of tobacco which is ultimately death

notice how he and the one who said "tax e-cigs so kids can't afford them" are both from the exact same district..... you gotta wonder if it could be the same guy. I bet some of these people are from the flame war that erupted on that quit smoking forum a while back. like somebody said earlier, a lot of these ex-smokers have ANTZ propaganda drilled into them, and since they no longer smoke it's not their problem. I think part of it is that these people think everybody should have to go through the same thing they did to give up smoking, and another part of it is that they thing being a smoker is like being an alcoholic, and the people on that Quit Smoking forum had the same mentality as you would see in an AA meeting. The other problem is that VERY few people know what nicotine really does, and the majority of people I talk to who don't smoke believe that nicotine doesn't do anything except addict you and ruin your heart (IE you don't feel anything from it, etc.) so smokers are killing themselves for no reason. THAT'S what the key problem is right there. The first thing nonsmokers wonder is "what's the point? why do they do it? it has no positive effects and all negative effects" and they answer it with "they just must be stupid". we need to fix this.

 

[GIMike]

the people on that Quit Smoking forum had the same mentality as you would see in an AA meeting.

I would say that is more like us, not them. If we falter and go back to cigarettes, we try kindly to get you back but don't force it, and then applaud you when you give it up again. The other forum, if you even think about starting up again, you're out of their clique and they never want you back.

 

[DC2]

I bet some of these people are from the flame war that erupted on that quit smoking forum a while back.

Electricman most definitely is.
That is even the name he uses on that forum.

And so, most likely, is the Beth one.
I'm positive I even know which one of them it is.

Unbelievable, right?

 

[sqirl1]

I would say that is more like us, not them. If we falter and go back to cigarettes, we try kindly to get you back but don't force it, and then applaud you when you give it up again. The other forum, if you even think about starting up again, you're out of their clique and they never want you back.

well okay, the other forum is more like the south park portrayal of an AA meeting. either way I'm about 90% convinced that it's them writing those comments. I'm sure they look on here to see what we're doing just to do things like this. especially "greenlover" or whatever her name is, in fact I'm sure she's reading this thread now.... HI GREENLOVER!

 

[DC2]

especially "greenlover" or whatever her name is

You said it, I didn't.

 

[sqirl1]

you said it, i didn't.

LOL I ....ING KNEW IT! These idiots are stalking us! What a bunch of psychos! Do they have any idea how stupid they sound?

 

[DC2]

Do they have any idea how stupid they sound?

I doubt it.

I think they've done a wonderful job of letting the world see what kind of nuts are out there.
I think their comments do us more good than harm.

 

[OttoBahn]

Made this for a contest elsewhere on EFC, thought it'd be appropriate in this thread.

 

[sqirl1]

I doubt it.

I think they've done a wonderful job of letting the world see what kind of nuts are out there.
I think their comments do us more good than harm.

and you KNOW they found out about this from us, because I doubt these dumbasses would have figured out this bill exists on their own, much less be smart enough to figure out that this implicitly mean E-cigarettes.

 

[sqirl1]

FOUND IT. QuitSmokingMessageBoard.com • View topic - The Saving Lives by Lowering Tobacco Use Act

 

[GIMike]

i can't believe that as ex-smokers, they would be promoting this bill. that's like people from AA gathering up with whatever guns they have and going to bars and shooting people for being drunks. friggin hypocrites man....

 

[LibertariaNate]

i can't believe that as ex-smokers, they would be promoting this bill. that's like people from AA gathering up with whatever guns they have and going to bars and shooting people for being drunks. friggin hypocrites man....

Really? Equating the supporting of a bill that raises a tax to shooting people?

Not even close.

 

[rothenbj]

Remaining OT and on the same theme. We're heading for winter when the "winter gas" is mandated in many areas of the country. This gas is supposed to reduce omissions by 10% as I remember the initiation of the program. The only problem is gas mileage on the gas seems to be reduced by more than that, at least from my experience and I don't normally warm my cars up ahead of time unless it's extremely cold. We Americans are draining ourselves in the name of safety and the environment.

While I'm ranting, is anyone seeing anywhere near the life expectancy they claim with the new light bulbs? They might outlast incandescent by a bit but certainly not by months.

 

[LibertariaNate]

... While I'm ranting, is anyone seeing anywhere near the life expectancy they claim with the new light bulbs? They might outlast incandescent by a bit but certainly not by months.

I can't say I particularly care for the new bulbs (color just seems "off"), but I haven't had to change one in 3+ years. It seemed like I was changing the incandescent type every other month...

 

[GIMike]

duplicate post

 

[GIMike]

Really? Equating the supporting of a bill that raises a tax to shooting people?

Not even close.

I guess they don't have sarcasm up there in Utah....

While I'm ranting, is anyone seeing anywhere near the life expectancy they claim with the new light bulbs? They might outlast incandescent by a bit but certainly not by months.

I can't say I particularly care for the new bulbs (color just seems "off"), but I haven't had to change one in 3+ years. It seemed like I was changing the incandescent type every other month...

Yet there are cases where incandescent bulbs have been burning for over 100 years. I think it just depends on the maker of the bulb, the quality of the electricity getting to the bulb (bad sockets can kill bulbs faster than good sockets. bad power with lots of brown outs/varying voltage are bad too). But on the same note, flourescent bulbs cause much more EMI than incandescent so I'm not sure the lifespan is worth it to me....