My first Genesis style build. Eh.

[buce15]

Hey guys, noobie posting my first genesis build; a COV NewGen atomizer from Clouds of Vapor (a local B&M as well as online store. Awesome.).
Link: COV NewGen Atomizer

I have relatively limited experience building coils, but I've been reading these forums extensively and believe I have a fundamentally sound and effective technique. I have a couple drippers going well, one with a diamond coil, one with a regular micro coil, both with cotton and working pretty well. Also a couple Protank heads (T3? T3s?) rebuilt with .4mm kanthal ribbon around 1.8ohms which are freakin' awesome. Not the greatest of vapor or flavor but better than the stock heads for sure.

Anyways, wrapped 28g kanthal around a 7/64 drill bit (it's 10-12 wraps, I didn't count), torched, pinched, back to the drill bit, fiddled, torched, reshaped. Got what I think is a pretty decent looking coil. I'll backtrack a bit and just say that the NewGen came built with a fugly twisted 30ish gauge 3 wrap around SS that I instantly ripped out. From my understanding, in a Genesis it's best to use SS wrapped mesh and/or rope, and to wrap your coil around the media then install them as "one" piece (input please). I'm stubborn and like nice micro coils, I prefer cotton (seems most "natural") and understanding YMMV... I just did it this way =).

First I installed my coil, a bit more of a pain getting that ground wire under the screw than I hoped for, but eventually got it in nice and snug. Tested resistance, came up at a nice 1.8. Next, I rolled up some sterile cotton from CVS (not boiled, is this bad? lol) to what I thought was a good size to fit through the coil, snug but not too loose or tight. This NewGen is a pain to remove the tank and access anything under the "deck", so I had to get a piece of thick wire and sorta stuffed the cotton down the coil through the wick hole into the tank until the bottom of the cotton was barely touching the bottom of the tank. Snipped the top of the cotton, leaving 1/2 inch of so of cotton up top, folded it over, dropped a couple drops of juice on the wick to get an initial saturation, put my top on, punched in 4.5v into my eVic clone (long story) and fired away. Now, I have limited experience with different atomizers, really only just an EVOD and Protank so I can't compare it to too much, but WOW was I amazed. This pull was so smooth, absolutely no gurgle whatsoever, I couldn't imagine a smoother vape. Cutting to the chase, I soon tasted a little burn, so I pulled off my top to notice the cotton between the coil and the top of the wick hole was relatively dry, my wick wasn't wicking like it should be. So, I pulled the cotton, made another wick, installed it the same way. Same experience. Did this about 5 more times, every time I got a very satisfying vape when I dripped on the wick, but never got good wicking. For the most part, I'm vaping at an angle as to keep the wick 100% saturated inside the tank where it meets the wick hole. Soooo cotton tasted really damn good but didn't wick well, so I got the extra SS mesh pre-rolled wick that came with my NewGen, and with a bit of twisting and turning and adjusting and fiddling, got the wick to where it is now. It fits pretty dang snug. Thinking this was going to fix my problem, it surely hasn't. I find the vapor isn't as good, the taste is a bit different, and after a few good pulls, I start to taste metal.

I'll add that this coil heats up relatively slow, and the stock air flow hole is relatively small, I'll be drilling that out very very soon. I've been pulling for about 5 seconds, exhaling a small vapor cloud, push the button again, 5 seconds bigger vapor cloud, push the button again, 5 seconds same "big" size vapor cloud. So it takes a little bit to get the nice vapor production that I enjoy, but I don't mind the initial "prime" to get the thing going.

So - hoping to get any input you guys can chip in, ultimately how to get this thing to wick properly, and any other ways to fine tune it. Thanks in advance everyone! Appreciate everyone and all you do in this forum for myself and fellow vapers =D

p.s. I know there's probably tons of threads out there about similar issues, but they're so damn hard to find, then read through hundreds of pages to find what you're looking for =(. If you can direct me to threads or particular posts that would be awesome, thanks again!
View attachment 295610

 

[dZXn]

I have tried cable, cable wrapped in ecowool, cable in cotton, silica, mesh, mesh in cotton and ecowool, hollow ecowool only, solid ecowool and I keep going back to cotton only as a wick in the Kraken. Cable would really heat up the atty, silica was good but the wicking wasn't perfect, hollow EW was very similar in terms of great wicking and flavor was good bit its not as easy as cotton to build, mesh tasted like metal a bit and I didn't like the whole shorting issue. So back to build one, horizontal micro coils and organic cotton wick. I boil mine, cotton is usually cleaned with hydrogen peroxide and inhalation of that after vaporization isn't something I want. It doesn't take long to boil cotton/drain repeat etc.

Wicking can be a female dog with the cotton, I usually take a chunk that I think will work for one wick and make it two wicks. I roll it very lightly, then pull very gently to get the fibers kind of lined up, twist the tips and then shove it into the atty with a wire. Thread through the micro coil (i run 1/4 - 3/8" past the coil) and make sure it isn't binding where it turns to the horizontal coil(s). If I get it right (and sometimes wrong happens) I can pull 4-6 big draws on the atty without any burnt taste at all. Getting it wrong means playing with the wick and often times installing a new wick. When you start to lose flavor (2-4 days) and the micros are gunked you can back the cotton out of the coil and heat it clean. Insert the cotton back into the coil, go a bit further than before and clip a bit off.

I usually shoot for. 0.8 - 1.2 ohm and it is the perfect mix of being enough like a dripper with out having to drip and has ok battery life. I don't know if there is ever a best way to build an atty, having a safe build that you like is what seems best to me.

 

[Thrasher]

well, that coil is pretty fugly first of all. no offense.

and you never said what type of device your trying to run this on. regulated? mechanical?

I cannot see that much 28g wire ever heating up correctly. usually i run geni's around .8 for a mechanical with 28g or 1.3-1.5 with 30g for regulated. 1.8 is really kinda high and the efficiency will suffer with that much thick wire at that high of a resistance. and i am almost sure it is the coil causing the issues and not the wicking.

the top leg looks very loose and im sure your metal taste is a nasty hotspot or hot leg.

if you really want to do a microcoil style wrap maybe do a true micro with a cotton wick instead.


.8 ohm 28g on 500 mesh

 

[buce15]

Hey guys -
Thank so much for the input =) I'm running on a crappy evic clone while I await my mvp from notveryfasttech. That package also comes with a proper ohm meter, a Kayfun, and a bunch of other fun stuff... can't wait. My next two purchases will be a Semovar and some sort of mech. No particular order, but probably the mech clone and some batteries due to budget.

dZXn - thanks for sharing your experiences with different wicks, it's a HUGE help to me. I ripped my previous setup out, and installed a poorly wrapped 1.6ohm 7 wrap 28g coil around an ekowool wick with a thin piece of SS mesh inside the coil.
Picture:


It's an ugly coil, and just an experiment of the wick, but so far I'm really liking it. I haven't had any burning taste whatsoever and haven't had any leaking either. I think I'll pull it out soon and try it with a better coil.

Thrasher - I understand what you're saying about the 1.8 coil being too high, thanks for the input =). On the other hand, I seem to like it. Again, I don't have any benchmark or anything to compare this vape with other than a Protank, Evod, and a couple poorly built drippers. What about that coil is fugly? I thought it was pretty damn nice. Any constructive criticism is desperately wanted! It takes a little while to heat up, but once it does it gives me a slow, cool vape. A bit of a tight draw because of my small air hole, but I literally can't feel the vapor it's so smooth.
Is your coil wrapped on a drill bit or the wick itself? What's a "true" micro coil build?

Is there any advantage to a micro coil vs a "normal" coil in this set up?
Looking for a good, low maintenance, constant vape I can use on any battery... trying to stay above 1ohm until I get proper equipment.

p.s. I'm currently running the setup in the picture above on my vision spinner (for giggles) at 4.1v and it's still pretty satisfying. Surely not "chucking" vapor but it ain't shy either.

 

[Thrasher]

well i am sort of at a disadvantage as I dont use silica or softwicks in a genesis style tank. and micro coils are very small diameter, just having the wraps close together doesnt make it a micro.

I really dont know the atomizer itself but i think thats the Iatty or zen clone looking at it.,


I would say either look up the microcoil thread right here in this subforum as well as nano, dragon and all things small lol.

i dont doubt the flavor is ok, it could be an airhole issue, the smaller the airhole the less vapor you will get up to a certain point.

but I would say if going for higher resistance try stepping up the wire gauge some. the speed at which it heats up is part of the problem, it should get hot fast.

i think riptripper on youtube has a softwick setup guide for genesis atomizers. we really need some of the people doing this to stop by and help you out. (Donna where are you!)

maybe pop onto the tube and search for microcoil in a genesis or something similar.

 

[Cloud boy]

I just did a dual coil genesis style build for my cousin in his Kraken tank. I used 28 gauge coils and did 6 wraps on each coil on a bamboo skewer. Came out to .56 ohms ( it was suppose to be higher but i was too lazy to rebuild) but for higher ohms you can wrap more. I placed the coils on top of the wick hole and ran 2 strands of thin cotton through it. Cut them and place accordingly. It produces a lot of vapor and gives really good flavors.
I did it cause he tried ss rope and ss mesh but didnt like the vapor and flavor production.

Hope this helps.

 

[Dellamorte]

Looks good to me, LOL I have never used a genesis type atty.

Offtopic:

How do you guys compare a genesis atty (like the kraken) tot an Kayfun lite Plus?

 

[buce15]

From my understanding, having the wraps close together does make it a micro coil. Having a very small diameter makes it a nano coil. I could be way off, but that's what I've gathered from this forum so far.
After doing a bunch of reading, it seems as though I was just using too much cotton to get good wicking. I tried ekowool with a mesh "jacket" pictured above. Worked well, but I pulled it out mostly because I didnt like the coil. Last night I installed a similar 2mm with mesh "jacket" but stuffed cotton between them to get the mesh tighter to the coil. Didn't work so hot. Right now I have the same thing without the mesh, just ekowool and stuffed in cotton, and it's ok.
I think my issue is contact between my coil and my wick. I need to do some MORE homework.
I want my entire coil touching my wick, regardless of the wick correct? Gaps in contact create hotspots?

 

[dZXn]

When I have used ecowool only as a wick I torch the portion where it will be in contact with the coils first, clip the top to clean it up a bit. Slip a safety pin into the EW center and then wrap a micro over the two. Trying to wrap on something flimsy will only cause anger and heartache. I then work the other half of the EW to make sure it is compressed a bit and torch it, and the coil. Then I slide the pin back in and carefully prep the legs of the coil to match the deck of the genny. I have found this helps when installing the coil/wick setup in keeping the coil stable. Torch again. I use a chunk of Kanthal to help push the EW into the wick hole. Pulse to check for hotspots, check ohm meter, tweak, check again then clip off extra EW and Kanthal leg ends.

All of that was just too much work and the reason why I went back to cotton. I have to rewick it every 4-7 days, but the coils don't have to be changed for a long time. After you have finished a build and filled your wick/tank let the juice do its thing, it will generally expand the wick slightly and allow the juice to supply your coils with goodness. Gaps (dry spots) can create hotspots but stuffing could also choke your wick.

I am also under the same impression as you as to micro/nano coils, micro is small, uniform coils, tightly wound around a (insert what ever here). Nano is smaller, uniform coils etc. I use these to build micro/nano coils.

I tried to run pics inline but I have failed. Here is a link to some photos from this morning. The weird looking wire things are my jigs for building coils, the hook holds the wire and you wrap around the opposing wire (atty, 2mm ecowool, and tweezers to show size). You can get a tight wrap and clean legs. The others are the build I have on my atty. I run the coils horizontal for ease of cleaning and rewicking. This build is dual coil Kanthal A1 30awg (9 wraps per side @ 0.78") coming in at .78 ohms. It produces good vapor and the flavor is great. I am trying to get away from dripping again and needed something that had some umph to it, I will rebuild next week at closer to 1 ohm.

 

[VaPreis]

I built a contact coil (microcoil if you like) on a mesh wick earlier this week in my AIOS. The key is that coil needs to fully contact the wick, and the only way I found to do that was to actually pre-wrap the coil on the wick, then remove it to torch it closed and tighten it up. When I was happy with the coil, I carefully slid it back on the wick.

But that was for AIOS, which is a huge PITA no matter how you decide to build it.

My I-atty has been collecting dust and I've been on a mission to build all my genesis atomizers and have them running well.

Today I built my I-Atty, and this is how it turned out:

4-wrap of 28 gauge on 2mm SS cable, wrapped with 400 mesh at the top for the coil. Came to .8Ω and vapes pretty sweet. Need to drill the air hole out some more though I think. I have it at 1/16" and still seems a little tight for me.

 

[bender817]

Looks good to me, LOL I have never used a genesis type atty.

Offtopic:

How do you guys compare a genesis atty (like the kraken) tot an Kayfun lite Plus?

The way I'd compare an apple to an orange. lol Both are great in their own respects.

Now everyone... If you don't love the stainless setups, you haven't done it right. That's just how it is. It took practice, practice, and more practice, but all in all it was very worth it. I set up my genny's with either all stainless or all cotton, but that's because I'm just not into silica wicks.