Need to vent....again

[becky127]

This has been a real ride. Going into the 2nd month of vaping. Started with Blu and immediately went to an ego. Love, love, love it. The juice is my problem. Started out with BWB (best flavors ever) and within 3 weeks couldn't bear to vape anymore because of tongue irritation. So...went to BlueMist Vg...even worse tongue irritation. Narrowed that down to a sensitivity to their flavoring. Others confirmed this. Not knocking BlueMist...I just am too sensitive for it. Also was vaping the lowest nic level possible. I previously smoked Now Menthols (2mg nic). If I wanted an analog I forced myself to smoke an orange box Marlborro...whatever that is (the worst of the worst). Found myself between a rock and hard spot...vaping irritated my tongue horribly and the Marlborro's were unbearable. So....ordered organic 100% vg from Vaporlite. No irritation from the juice, but.....terrible oily film and sadly really didn't like the fruit/sweet flavors..got gaggy. Day before yesterday decided to just stop it all !!!! Big mistake..went into bad withdrawal. Then....back to Now Menthols and ordered Johnson Creek tobacco flavors vg based. Also upped the nic level to 11mg rather than the 6mg. I know I can stop smoking....I was so close and so close to being satisfied with vaping. I am a 40 year pack a day smoker. Someone, please tell me that I'll find a vg based liquid that will work for me. Can't take that oily filmy feel !!!! Any suggestions from another "only vg vaper?"

 

[TL1000RSquid]

Well I don't vape only VG but I've found vaperite to have the best 100% VG stuff, vaping some of Todd's blueberry pancakes right now with my cup of coffee.

 

[Jetmec]

I started with Johnson Creek original smoke juice found Tennessee cured and love it. I keep trying other juice from different places but keep going back to JC Tennessee cured and haven't touched an analog. I have no issues with mouth irritation but occasionally my throat will burn when I vape. Hang in there I am sure you will find your go to juice.

 

[deback]

I found that too much VG caused gum pain and sometimes pain in other areas of my mouth, so I lowered the amount of VG in my liquids, and now I don't have pain in my mouth. I also started with 18mg of nicotine, that was fine, increased to 24mg, that was too much and caused some mouth pain, then lowered the nicotine back to 18mg, and now that's fine. My mouth is sensitive to sweet stuff, and VG contains sweet stuff.

Also, another tip is to hold the PV at different angles and change the angle now and then, so the vapor will hit different areas of your mouth.

I can vape two PVs at once now and get no mouth pain (using less VG and 18mg nicotine) (that is, vaping from a PV in the right side of my mouth and a PV in the left side of my mouth....great throat hits, by the way! lol). My liquids are 80pg/20vg with about 5% Glycerin from Walmart added. When I was getting gum pain, the liquid was 60pg/40vg with 30% Glycerin added.

 

[becky127]

When I started with the Blu, it came with Johnson Creek juice. I also really like their tobacco flavor. That is why I ordered from Johnson Creek (the red oak collection vg based). By the way.....I was drinking a ton of water and tried the biotene gum and mouthwash. Didn't help. I have no doubt that it is the pg I can't tolerate. Grrrrrrrrr

 

[sbphotog]

Maybe you should DIY? get yourself some 100% vegetable glycerin (I personally recommend Nature's Answer 100% VG available at the Vitamin Shoppe, or Lorann's Glycerin) Both are safe for internal use. And get yourself some good flavors from Lorann's or the Perfumers Apprentice and use the Ejuice Calculator.
You can get unflavored 100% VG nic at MyFreedomSmokes

 

[markfm]

Have you checked the places recommended in the VG only social forum area? In DIY people cut VG with a bit of distilled water or high proof alcohol (pure grain alcohol recommended, if you can get it), thins it nicely -- you might try that with some of your juice.

 

[DesiG]

have you narrowed down if the PG is one of the problems? what if you got a pure unflavored nic juice in the straight vg, straight pg and then the blend of pg/vg? unflavored so that you could at least figure out a base to use. Then once you have figured out which base is ok, you can begin to play with the flavors using the base that caused the least irritation. Velvet vapors has this on their site- you can get all of these options in small 3 ml bottles. You just need to limit your variables, start with the base (with the nic) so that you at least can get off the yuck sticks. Good luck!

 

[dormouse]

I'm not a VG-only vaper and I'm a noob but...

Is it possible you could vape less with a stronger nicotine (only you would know).

Or would the combination of a less powerful PV with stronger nicotine (16-18mg) be able to satisfy you while cutting down the amount of VG (or even PG/VG) you're vaping?

I was a 1.5 pack/day smoker of analogs that were .9 mg of nicotine each. I'm using a small PV with PCC to recharge batteries during the day and 18mg ejuice and not vaping more often or for longer sessions than I smoked. I do have to fiddle with topping off the tiny carts, but I am feeling sated. I did find that part of "sated" was feeling like a smoked - some undefined combination of TH, vapor, flavor, aroma. When I tried a flavor that had very little TH, I never felt sated. It had the other 3 qualities in abundance but did not satisfy and left me feeling more like I had eaten and now wanted an analog (weird), so vaped more of it (too much actually). Since VG is the big vapor maker and PG is more known for TH, you may need to search more for a liquid that will satisfy you. A good satisfying liquid sates me with fewer puffs.

 

[deback]

Maybe you should DIY? get yourself some 100% vegetable glycerin (I personally recommend Nature's Answer 100% VG available at the Vitamin Shoppe, or Lorann's Glycerin) Both are safe for internal use. And get yourself some good flavors from Lorann's or the Perfumers Apprentice and use the Ejuice Calculator.
You can get unflavored 100% VG nic at MyFreedomSmokes

Or you can get Glycerin at Walmart for $3 for 177mL (6 oz) in the pharmacy section on the shelf above the rubbing alcohol products. This is about the cheapest you can get it for, unless you buy it in bulk size. It is vegetable glycerine and is safe for vaping. There are many threads about it here.

 

[becky127]

Now I'm really confused. Decided to try just one small puff from my ego that contained 100% organic vg juice. I've been smoking analogs the last 24 hours. The one spot that the puff hit my tongue immediately burned. So dug out my old Blu with the Johnson Creek e juice cartridge (dpg/vg base). Puffed on it and there was no sensation on my tongue at all !!!!!! I've been vaping on the blu with JC juice the last hour. All I've noticed is that my tongue feels a bit dry. Guess it's possible that the vg has been the problem. Not the first time I've barked up the wrong tree. As far as the vegetable glycerine goes, I did buy organic food grade vegetable glycerine a while back and would sometimes add a bit to whatever e juice I was vaping in order to settle some of the flavors down. I'm beginning to connect dots now. I honestly thought deback (Deb in Michigan) was way off track. My apologies. It may well be that I am very much like you and can't tolerate too much vg in the mix. I'm going to continue vaping the JC juice the rest of the day to see what happens. Hopefully, I'm onto something here. Thanks to all.

 

[deback]

Now I'm really confused. Decided to try just one small puff from my ego that contained 100% organic vg juice. I've been smoking analogs the last 24 hours. The one spot that the puff hit my tongue immediately burned. So dug out my old Blu with the Johnson Creek e juice cartridge (dpg/vg base). Puffed on it and there was no sensation on my tongue at all !!!!!! I've been vaping on the blu with JC juice the last hour. All I've noticed is that my tongue feels a bit dry. Guess it's possible that the vg has been the problem. Not the first time I've barked up the wrong tree. As far as the vegetable glycerine goes, I did buy organic food grade vegetable glycerine a while back and would sometimes add a bit to whatever e juice I was vaping in order to settle some of the flavors down. I'm beginning to connect dots now. I honestly thought deback (Deb in Michigan) was way off track. My apologies. It may well be that I am very much like you and can't tolerate too much vg in the mix. I'm going to continue vaping the JC juice the rest of the day to see what happens. Hopefully, I'm onto something here. Thanks to all.

No apology is necessary, Becky. I just respond with my own experiences when I think they might be helpful to others. I really don't know what caused your tongue sensitivity, but I can tell you that when I used to eat Sweet Tarts (the big, round ones) all the time, my gums on the top got so sore that I had to quit eating them. The gum pain finally went away a few weeks later, but I'm positive that all that sugar was too much for my sensitive gums.

So, in the first month or so after I started vaping, I was having gum pain, and sometimes throat, roof, and tongue pain (due to a different problem). After experimenting with more PG, less PG, more VG, less VG, more nicotine, and less nicotine, I believe that some of my pain was due to the sweet stuff that's in VG (causing gum pain). The other pain in my throat, roof, and tongue was due to the warmer vapor when using 5V passthroughs (because the pain was like the pain you get when eating food that's too hot, so the warmer vapor was gradually burning the inside of my mouth). After I reduced the VG to about 10% (or no more than 20%) and quit using the passthroughs, I haven't had any mouth pain since.

Also, some of the mouth pain could have been due to quitting smoking and the normal healing effect that occurs in different parts of the body when toxins are exiting those areas. I had pains in both cheeks (not at the same time) at the back of my teeth that took about 5 or 6 days for each to go away. That pain felt like canker sores inside my cheek.

Anyway, this vaping experience really takes a lot of experimenting to figure out the things that don't work right. I wasn't saying that too much VG was your problem. It could have been too much heat hitting your sensitive tongue. It could have been something else. I just wanted to let you know my experience with mouth pain and what I determined to be the cause, in my case.

I hope you figure it out, and I'm sure you will!

 

[becky127]

How funny you mentioned Sweet Tarts !!!! I cannot eat them now because I overdosed on them and about killed my tongue a year or so ago. LOL I simply take a strong liking to particular foods and overdo it for a week or two. If you don't mind, may I run a few things past you? Is the ego (in your opinion) creating too much heat? I'm not a constant vapor (with the exception of the first half hour in the morning) and don't use a passthrough. I'm used to very low nicotine levels, so the e juice has always been low (6 - 11). May I ask which e juice you use and the name of the supplier? I'm also a very heavy tea drinker and I like it strong. I'm very addicted to it. Please don't ask me to stop. Tea has the tendency to numb my tongue somewhat, but I'm used to it. At least it isn't painful.
Any suggestions you have are greatly appreciated. Thanks so much.

 

[deback]

How funny you mentioned Sweet Tarts !!!! I cannot eat them now because I overdosed on them and about killed my tongue a year or so ago. LOL I simply take a strong liking to particular foods and overdo it for a week or two. If you don't mind, may I run a few things past you? Is the ego (in your opinion) creating too much heat? I'm not a constant vapor (with the exception of the first half hour in the morning) and don't use a passthrough. I'm used to very low nicotine levels, so the e juice has always been low (6 - 11). May I ask which e juice you use and the name of the supplier? I'm also a very heavy tea drinker and I like it strong. I'm very addicted to it. Please don't ask me to stop. Tea has the tendency to numb my tongue somewhat, but I'm used to it. At least it isn't painful.
Any suggestions you have are greatly appreciated. Thanks so much.

Amazing! My overdose of Sweet Tarts (which I definitely overdid a few years ago and several times in my life) about killed my upper gums, but they did heal eventually, except they're sensitive to anything sweet that I overdo. I also overdo foods and other things (like this forum, for example, and eating oliveburgers every day for the last 3 1/2 months). Back in 2001-2002, I ate strawberry shortcake every day (sometimes 3 times a day) for 9 months straight. That caused inflammation (and a lot of pain) in the walls of my bladder (interstitial cystitis) that I still have -- and I still have to avoid certain foods, like anything citrus, most fruits and fruit juices, spicy foods, and a few other foods.

No, none of my eGos create too much heat. 3.7 or 3.2 volt batteries (eGos) work well for me, but anything 5 volts is too much heat for my mouth. I'm only using eGo batteries now and no passthroughs. My nicotine level is 18mg and is perfect. I finally found what I had to avoid to eliminate the mouth pain.

The juice I use all the time is listed in my signature (all mixed together, 100%PG, 18mg), along with almost everything else about my vaping supplies, except for the Boge 510 and KR808D-1 cartomizers that I use most of the time.

The only suggestion I can think of at the moment is: don't eat strawberry shortcake every day for nine months! lol

 

[becky127]

This really is insane. At Christmas I eat popcorn balls for breakfast, lunch, snack, dinner, and dessert. I've been through the taco stage which lasted a month (my family was ready to commit me). There was the lemon pie 3 week binge, and let's not forget the pecan pie binge. I've gone through the Baby Ruth candy bar phase, Sweet Tart phase, and honey roasted peanut stage. When I overdo these foods I do get to a point where my body (generally my mouth) gets into trouble. Then I find that I have to avoid the foods to avoid the pain. I'm 5'5" tall and weigh 120 lbs. The list above is just the tip of the iceberg. I thought I was the only one out there that went through this. When it happens, there is no such thing as moderation. It's crazy time. Somewhere I read that if you're allergic to something, you sometimes crave it. Who knows???? As for health issues...I'm healthy as a horse. 2 years ago I developed a sudden allergic attack from taking two ibuprofin pills. Laid me up for 6 weeks. Hives, swelling, every joint ached, together with every muscle group. Two trip to the ER, allergist, blood samples out the roof only to find out I had a hypersensitive reaction. If I take anything with ibuprofin/aspirin in it now, I'm a gonner. Pass the Tylenol please. OK, so let's see...FSUSA 100% pg Ry4, Apple, Caramel, Nut Mix..all combined...with a touch of Glycerin. I like the idea of mixing all those together. Sounds great. I was mixing flavors before too and would like to have one mix for all the time. Will still stay with the 11mg nicotine though. I'm off to order. You're a gem Deb. Thanks so much !!!!!!!

 

[becky127]

Problem Deb. Went to FSUSA and their Ry4 is a 50/50 pg/vg blend, the caramel can be 100pg, the nut mix doesn't state what the blend is, and I didn't check on the apple. You stated that you mix all 100%pg with a touch of glycerine. I think I'm lost here. Would you kindly help me out a bit? Thanks.

 

[DesiG]

Hello, I just went and looked, and everything but the ry4 can be purchased in the 100% PG, so I would contact the owners of FSUSA and see if they could either mix up a batch of ry4 without the VG, or if you were planning on a splash of VG anyway, just put the smallest amount of the ry4 in your mix- the other PG stuff with dilute the VG- so just don't add the extra splash of VG at the end. Also, you wrote that you bought 100% organic food grade vg- not an expert , but I thought I read somewhere that you should use pharmaceutical grade vg.

 

[deback]

Hello, I just went and looked, and everything but the ry4 can be purchased in the 100% PG, so I would contact the owners of FSUSA and see if they could either mix up a batch of ry4 without the VG, or if you were planning on a splash of VG anyway, just put the smallest amount of the ry4 in your mix- the other PG stuff with dilute the VG- so just don't add the extra splash of VG at the end. Also, you wrote that you bought 100% organic food grade vg- not an expert , but I thought I read somewhere that you should use pharmaceutical grade vg.

RY4 can't be changed. It's pre-mixed, and they won't make any changes to it.

The splashes they add are flavor, not VG or PG.

VG - use food grade VG, with the USP on the label.

I'm responding to Becky now....with more details about my mixture.

 

[deback]

Problem Deb. Went to FSUSA and their Ry4 is a 50/50 pg/vg blend, the caramel can be 100pg, the nut mix doesn't state what the blend is, and I didn't check on the apple. You stated that you mix all 100%pg with a touch of glycerine. I think I'm lost here. Would you kindly help me out a bit? Thanks.

Sorry, that detail required a lot more details, which I didn't include because I didn't know you would interested enough to order them all.

My current "combined" mixture is actually 80pg/20pg. I'm still experimenting with how much Glycerin (from Walmart) to add. I'm currently adding about 5 to 10% Glycerin to this mixture.

There are a lot of details with my experimentation in the last six weeks, and I was trying to spare you all of that, but here goes:

I originally bought 60pg/40vg of the apple, caramel, and nut mix (and 50/50 for the RY4). I had bought 100%PG when ordering liquids before that from other suppliers, because I had planned on adding my own VG. I had sore gum problems off and on with the 100%PG from the other liquids, because I was adding about 33% Walmart Glycerin with them. When I ordered the first 4 bottles of this mixture, I decided to go with 60/40. I added about 20 to 25% Walmart Glycerin to this mixture. My gums were still hurting off and on, so after some thought, I decided it might be too much VG (from both the pre-mixed liquid and the Walmart Glycerin).

So I ordered 4 more bottles, all at 100%PG, mixed them with the first four bottles that were 60/40 -- to make my final mixture of 80PG/20VG (not counting the fact that the RY4 was 50/50). Since then, I've gradually reduced how much Walmart Glycerin I'm adding to this mixture. I started with 33%, then down to 25%, then 20%, then 2%, then 5%, and now about 10% or a little less.

Lately, my gum pain has been very little to none, and I'm sure it's because I've been adding less Walmart Glycerin lately, and probably because I lowered my overall liquid mixture from FSUSA to 80/20.

Yesterday, I got out all of the liquids I bought from other suppliers and dripped them all for about 3 hours or so. Most of those liquids are 100%PG, I think, and contain an average of 33% Glycerin that I had added to them. My gums were a little sore last night and they feel a little numb this morning, so now I know for sure that the VG is causing my sore gum problems -- specifically, the Glycerin bought from Walmart.

Yes, the RY4 is 50/50; I couldn't change it, so I just went with it.

No, they won't change the RY4 mixture, but that little bit of VG doesn't bother me when mixed with the other flavors.

Splashes of extra flavor can't be added to RY4 or any of the pre-mixed specialties.

 

[deback]

On Monday, I ordered two more bottles each of Caramel and Apple during FSUSA's 120mL sale. I bought them at 90/10, because I need some VG for the vapor, and I've already decided to add a lot less Glycerin from Walmart.

I'm not sure what I'll do with these bottles, but I think I was gonna just make up a mixture with these two flavors to see if I like it without the RY4 and Nut Mix. If not, I might add these to the original mixture of four flavors, to add more caramel and apple taste. I really don't know at this time.

Becky - You'll just have to experiment, because you might not like any of these flavors, or you might not like FSUSA's liquids, or the lower amount of VG might not fix your tongue problems. There are so many details concerning all of this that it gets overwhelming, especially when typing it all out -- and especially when you just woke up (which I did, so I'm still trying to focus.)