New Atomizer Coil Shape

[Vaporer]

I'll try to have a materials and tools list posted this evening or tomorrow. With links.
I figure a week to get the pics and document started. Good idea on getting the mail order stuff on its way. I need to see the size of pdfs allowed here. With a lot of pics It may easily grow to large and I'll need to find a free web host to post it on.
It will be in its own new thread as it will be a tutorial and not necessarily use just this style coil.

Jason and Scott,
The picture is very similar to mine. I do see an important flaw though. Notice how tight the wire is on the wick? Jason is correct that the more wick the better. But if wound to tightly the air spaces in the wicking material prevent capillary acton to properly feed the wick inside the coil. This area really needs to be kept wet as the middle of the coil is actually the hottest area. The atomizer coil is actually shorting the positive and negative of the battery, Its resistance keeps it from from just melting away and results in heat being produced.

 

[roadkilldeluxe]

Nice progress. When you speak of the "carbon" are you talking about the black layer on the outside of the Nichrome? Or some sort of residue from the juice itself?

 

[Vaporer]

Thanks road,

I'm referring to the carbon buildup from the juice, not the oxidation of the nichrome wire.
I'll have to make a few and put one in a 5v mod maybe increase the resistance. The main idea is to vaporize the liquid in such a way that carbon won't form on the coil or ar least reduce it.

I was watching your thread with the glass bulb. Any new progress?

 

[Vaporer]

Here is what the atomizer ended up in.

http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...1-disposeable-e-cigar-rebuild.html#post731090

 

[roadkilldeluxe]

Cool! What do you suspect the main causes of buildup are due to? I always figured it was probably due to overheating of juice, which is worrisome because overheating VG produces Acrolein, which, according to Wikipedia, "tends to polymerize when left at room temperature, leaving a gummy yellowish residue with a putrid odor." Do you think it's possible at all that this "gummy residue" leads to the buildup we see?

I wasn't quite satisfied with my prototype (time-consuming to build, weak glass), but Ashhead is working with a glassblower and doing some experiments of his own. Now I am experimenting with Moktarino's design, which is essentially a "glass bulb" but much smaller and is made of borosilicate glass... looks pretty promising!

It's great to see everyone engineering atomizers and helping each other out. Can't wait till we start seeing results out of all these projects, but it sounds like you are just about there I completely agree with you about the need for lots of detailed "how-to's". PDF sounds like a good format because then everyone could store local copies; plus, images on the forums tend to disappear randomly, so it would be nice to be able to keep a copy!

 

[Vaporer]

Well, cooked PG and VG will thicken. Some vapor gets recycled in the atomizer body and sent back through as it condenses.
The brown stuff that comes out when you blow a well used atty clean.
The 4.5ohm, that is my biggest worry. It leans towards restriction but does clean rinse well, so all is good for now. Its also in a 510 atty with little clearence, but they (untested attys) have to go somewhere and work in many ways.

John at EcoPure did a test with VG since its thier new base and found no acrolein was produced. Check thier website for the report. It was a main concern with all the hotter temperatures with higher voltages.

The brown gummy crap is also flavorings , color ingredients and such. Many things don't volatize at 400*, get left behind and some get burnt and leave a lot of ash to start the buildup process. It can be a real balancing game. The condensed vapor drains back into the mesh actually rinsing the walls clean. So...garbage forms and being thicker , heavier it is much more prone to clog and carbon up.

Glad to hear yours is coming along. Borosilicate should be a good choice. Power requirements will be higher as we discussed to heat the non generating thermal mass (glass) but may clean very easy and protect the coil.

Always a tradeoff.................................

 

[gsa]

Edit:
Silica "fire wick" rope: My thanks to carlos49 for sending me some till I found it. It's the white braided rope used on wood stove doors.
From carlos49-"A word of advice if anyone is interested, get the loosley knitted type it's a lot easier to unknit without it breakinginto little pieces.

What dia silica rope do I need to get? I place a mcmaster order about once a week and would like to get a few feet of the right stuff. TIA

 

[Vaporer]

The 1/2" works well. Round braided.
Once you start unbraiding it goes a long way. I was given a foot and its hardly dented after 6 months.

I'm starting to work on the tutorial. My son will have to take some pics since I dont have 4 hands !

 

[gsa]

The 1/2" works well. Round braided.
Once you start unbraiding it goes a long way. I was given a foot and its hardly dented after 6 months.

I'm starting to work on the tutorial. My son will have to take some pics since I dont have 4 hands !

Thanks, just gathering my supplies and patiently waiting. I have a few burt out 510's and my 40 replacements have been stuck in customs for a week now

 

[gsa]

I got the wire you suggested too. $2 with free shipping is a good enough price to consider the added work to rebuild these things

 

[Vaporer]

gsa,

Do you know how to remove the threaded fitting from the atomizer?
I had considered starting the tutorial with an 801 high bridge as an example.
Its large internal area seems the easiest to work with.
I am aware that many don't own an 801 and 510's which are very popular have the smallest area.
The coil will be made the same for both with the same materials.
Not all cermaic cups are the same so as detailed as I can be, one will have to look at thier feed points as I cannot possibly own all models and styles.

This is one reason for the delay. I want to do it right and making the coil is simple, but it's worthless if the user cannot disassemble the atomizer and install it.
I realize not everyone will be able to do this. Something that I and they will have to understand. Whats tedious to one person can be simple for another.

The one unique thing I have found with the 510 is that Janty seems to follow the 3.4ohm resistance coil as all other models I've measured except Joye. Ones I've recently ordered claiming to be a Joye 510 Atomizer (thin brass band) are 2.3ohms. These will use more power and run hotter. The user needs to be aware of this also so performance is the same. Making the coil will just be a shorter length of nichrome wire.

 

[gsa]

to remove the fitting from the 510 atty, I soaked the atty in acetone for 10 minutes, screwed it on to a battery and then jiggled it back and forth, it came right off and confirmed my suspicion of superglue being the bonding agent.

 

[Vaporer]

Good deal. The thin brass ones do come off pretty easy.
Normally I dont reglue them back together. The press fit is enough to hold well enough.
Makes them much easier for the next tear down too.
Janty wide brass baned ones seem a little tougher. For the Titan I think.
I boil mine for 15min, put it on a battery and insert a drill bit that just fits inside the atty tube and wiggle the tube off with a pair of gas pliers. I put a wrap of thin rubber to prevent scratching around atty.

The tubes are SS and there is a pretty good vid on You Tube on making all your attys with the platinum finish. Auto batteries can be done the same way and the platinum finish looks good on many mods. Makes old atty look at least decent.

 

[rickou812]

I have a question Vaporer.
What is the mesh material covering the nichrome and where can you get it?
What are you using for the ceramic base on home made atty's, not the refurbs?

Thanks,
Rick

 

[Jason365]

I have a question Vaporer.
What is the mesh material covering the nichrome and where can you get it?
What are you using for the ceramic base on home made atty's, not the refurbs?

Thanks,
Rick

These, maybe.....

Ceramic Wire Nuts on Keystone Industries

 

[Vaporer]

I just do refurbs on my stuff. If it comes apart once without breaking, its a breeze from then on. Very little chance of breakage. No need to stock many though when you can rebuild. I've rebuilt 3 many times , at least 10-15 ea making test models and they still rebuild just fine.

The metal mesh covering the ceramic cup is called nickle metal foam. Someone found it on this forum somewhere. You can search it out with the thread tools.

If you are wanting to make your own ceramic cups, carlos49 has an article on here for that I believe.

 

[Vaporer]

I actually considered using the ceramic wire nuts for a cup replacement if ever needed. I used a ceramic fuse casing and a dremel cuttoff wheel barely dents it.
If the nuts are that same material and density you'll play heck getting a hole in them.

 

[jxmiller]

I actually considered using the ceramic wire nuts for a cup replacement if ever needed. I used a ceramic fuse casing and a dremel cuttoff wheel barely dents it.
If the nuts are that same material and density you'll play heck getting a hole in them.

I found he ceramic wire nuts, porcelain wire nuts, and porcelain sockets(for halogen bulbs). Where can I find ceramic fuse casings?

Like these?

 

[Vaporer]

jxmiller,
Thats the style I had laying around here. They were abt 1/4" in dia 1" long. Really tough to cut.
The dremel sand cutoff wheel barely scratched them. Unless you have very small diamond bits (possibly carbide), I have no idea how you will ever get feed holes in them.

Mine were so old I feared lead solder in the metal cap so I never finished that project. I didnt trust JB Weld or anything like it not to leach something into the eliquid after being constantly soaked.

If you do it sucessfully, I'd start a thread on "Atomizer Cup Creation" and feel free to post a link in this thread to it.

I've had a minor set back in health and got a little slow in getting my tutorial done on the coil building, but its coming. It will be in a seperate thread as this one mainly applies to a new non-cylindrical coil shape. Not the rebuilding/creation of the coil itself.

 

[Kate51]

Nice work, sir, I wish I would have kept all of my 801 attys, I would for awhile and get sick of looking at them and throw them out. No more. Will take a plunge at re-wiring mine now too, at $9 for new atty may be worthwhile.
I was really surprised to see how easily (?) they were to take apart, the ones I've disected were in ruin by the time I got everything out (the threaded ends).
There has been a definite lacking in the original design, some I've had go bad were the ones that scorched after a day or so of use. Nasty. And all too frequent.
I think it is the correlation between air flow and heating to produce heavy enough vapor. I still have a problem understanding the purpose of the mesh surrounding the pot. It fills with liquid that kind of just stays there. Which explains rapid drawing of liquid from the cart in a new atty, even when you 'prime' with juice before using it. Soaking in ethanol will clean it, but same thing happens, soaks up and stays that way; ??? Sometimes there's as much condensation on the outside of the casing as on the inside. Maybe cannot be helped. Reason for wet battery/atty connection.
Another question is how many winds of the nichrome is most efficient for heat production. I would love to see a no-harm self-cleaning enclosed heater!!
I hope your health problem is not serious and under control, take care, and keep up the good work.