Nicotine Myth Busted - Nicotine does not cause adiction IMO

[kushka]

I am addicted to nicotine.

I do not have a very additive physiology in general. For years I was taking high levels of methadone and oxicodone, both highly addictive, but was able to drop them cold with no effects after an operation relieved my pain.

I drank every night for 5 years when married to an alcoholic, but when I divorced him (an no longer could afford it), I stopped cold, with no problem.

I can not get by for even four conscious hours without nicotine. I prefer to vape. If I can't vape, I will smoke, If I can't smoke I will chew nicrorette. I have been addictive to nicotine for 50 years now, and have tried many a time to stop.

I have been vaping for 3 and a half years, 30mg/ml. Before that the only time I was able to stop smoking, I was using 20-40 4mg nicorette a day for a full year and never could taper off (talk about cigarettes being expensive).

I hated smoking, and I hate vaping, I have never found an e-liquid I liked the flavor of (I vape unflavored). I would stop in a second if I could. But, I can't.

 

[Koman]

I think people can't get addicted to pretty much anything to be honest!

 

[mindmajick]

I think people can't get addicted to pretty much anything to be honest!

And that's the 100% truth. Anything you enjoy releases endorphins.

Endorphins are addictive.

The end. Time to close the thread

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[josie wales]

Put me down as one who thinks nic addiction is not as addictive as the process/ritual itself. I've been looking for an all day vape for two months and when I order, I order all kinds of different nic levels. I have not noticed any serious symptoms of withdraw from the various levels. I even did 0 nic for a few days with no problem. I am an ex smoker of 35 years.

 

[zaubara]

"Myth busted" and "IMO" don't really mix. There's zero citations, because, well, I think it's all your thoughts.

I guess the comparison with caffeine is reasonable, but as far as I know - nicotine is much more potent than caffeine; also, don't forget the dosage. It's usually higher with vaping than caffeine in a cup of coffee. Also, nicotine (as I've been told by a medicine student that's pro e-cigs) is part of what can cause vascular diseases, not tar.
Not going to cite anything, either.

I guess my point... be aware of what you're inhaling, even if it's way better than analogue smoking.

 

[YKruss]

snip...

Also, nicotine (as I've been told by a medicine student that's pro e-cigs) is part of what can cause vascular diseases, not tar.
Not going to cite anything, either.

snip...

But I can cite:

Dr Farsalinos said:
our study has shown no significant defects in cardiac function after acute use.

Source - Electronic Cigarettes Not Linked To Heart Damage

 

[ElectricalSocket]

We deal with two types of addiction, physical and psychological. This thread is about the physical. Nicotine is the main addictive substance in cigarettes. Yes, nicotine is addictive. BUT the MAOI's in cigarette smoke REINFORCE the nicotine addiction and make it stronger than it would be by ITSELF. This is a fact. Nicotine is not "highly addictive".

The psychological addiction that many of us have on top of the slight physical addiction to e-cigs might make it difficult to quit e-cigs completely, but that is mainly the psychological addiction.

Why do some people have a hard time going lower than...let's say 6-12mg/ml? Throat hit. Not because they want to kill someone if they can't get their 18mg juice...throat hit. Mental. If you've been using e-cigs for over 18 months, the only thing stopping you from stepping down to 0-2mg juice is mental (of course assuming you wanted to). You wouldn't have the insane physical withdrawals that cigarettes gave us.

Nic+MAOI's=Nicotine Crack
Nic by itself=Addictive, but it's possible to stop using. Just like caffeine.

Take it up with neuroscientists if you want to believe otherwise.

 

[BigBen2k]

...
Nic+MAOI's=Nicotine Crack
Nic by itself=Addictive, but it's possible to stop using. Just like caffeine.

Thank you for making this point; I think this ought to be a sticky.

I'm just finding out about this, and knowing what my wife's gone through, it explains many things.

The use of MAOI stands as a warning, in combination with other meds. Is there any information available about the dosage?

I'm ...... off (which is rare for me) about finding out that I've been on MAOI for the 20 years I smoked, before I switched to an e-cig.

 

[mindmajick]

We deal with two types of addiction, physical and psychological. This thread is about the physical. Nicotine is the main addictive substance in cigarettes. Yes, nicotine is addictive. BUT the MAOI's in cigarette smoke REINFORCE the nicotine addiction and make it stronger than it would be by ITSELF. This is a fact. Nicotine is not "highly addictive".

The psychological addiction that many of us have on top of the slight physical addiction to e-cigs might make it difficult to quit e-cigs completely, but that is mainly the psychological addiction.

Why do some people have a hard time going lower than...let's say 6-12mg/ml? Throat hit. Not because they want to kill someone if they can't get their 18mg juice...throat hit. Mental. If you've been using e-cigs for over 18 months, the only thing stopping you from stepping down to 0-2mg juice is mental (of course assuming you wanted to). You wouldn't have the insane physical withdrawals that cigarettes gave us.

Nic+MAOI's=Nicotine Crack
Nic by itself=Addictive, but it's possible to stop using. Just like caffeine.

Take it up with neuroscientists if you want to believe otherwise.

And here is a reputable reference:
http://m.psychologytoday.com/conditions/nicotine

And the exact lines:

"Using advanced neuroimaging technology, research is beginning to show that nicotine may not be the only psychoactive ingredient in tobacco. Scientists can see the dramatic effect of cigarette smoking on the brain and are finding a marked decrease in the levels of monoamineoxidase (MAO), an enzyme responsible for breaking down dopamine. The change in MAO must be caused by some tobacco smoke ingredient other than nicotine, since nicotine itself does not dramatically alter MAO levels. The decrease in two forms of MAO, A and B, results in higher dopamine levels. The need to sustain the high dopamine levels results in the desire for repeated drug use."


--
Sent from my mind to your screen.

 

[ziggytrix]

I'm seeing a lot of anti-government paranoia in this thread, but the people who make the addiction claims are not bureaucrats, they are scientists (and sociologists, too).

Blakeslee, Sandra (1987-03-29). "Nicotine: Harder to Kick Than *censored*". The New York Times.

"Division of Periodontology: Tobacco Use Cessation Program". umn.edu. Retrieved 2012-12-19.

 

[stevegmu]

I smoked the same type of RYO as you and can say without a doubt it is every bit as addictive as more processed Camels or Marlboros. I now use snus as my main source of nicotine and can say without a doubt that it is certainly addictive. The only difference between the two is that smokeless tobacco hits slower then smoking, which took me a few months to adjust to.

It is a common myth that tobacco companies are manipulating cigarettes to be more addictive. This was started by the ANTZ and is little more then propaganda with little to no facts to back it up. Tobacco is addictive and needs little to no help from tobacco companies to make it more so. Many vapors, including the OP have found it convenient to play along with the myth of big bad tobacco companies manipulating cigarettes to make them more addictive. It's bogus.

Tobacco companies manipulate cigarettes, not to make them more addictive, as it really doesn't need any help with that, but for flavor and consistency. Smoking a cigarette gives an almost instant hit of nicotine to the brain. There is little that BT could do to improve on it. Some percentage of people who vape have found it possible to cut down on nicotine, but others have not cut down and find it is not reasonable to do so. Others like me have found that the straight nicotine in e-liquid to be very unsatisfying and needed to go to snus and WTA to get off of cigarettes.

Peoples reaction to tobacco/nicotine is very individual with a lot of variance. You cannot use your own situation and draw large conclusions. It simple doesn't hold up.

Yeah, the last 3 years I smoked, I stuffed my own with Kentucky Select USDA certified organic. Nothing added, no preservatives, etc. I was no less addicted than when I smoked standard cigarettes for the prior 17 years. The ones I stuffed did smell less bad than regular cigarettes, though. I believe that tobacco had far more nicotine than a standard cigarette, as when I bummed them out, most people either said they were too strong to smoke, or got a nicotine buzz from them.

 

[gayhalo]

I am sure I read a new study not yet published but presented at a meeting on nicotine... I can't find it now I have read too many things lately.
The jist was that nicotine on its own was not addictive. It talked about the MOAs in cigarettes. It went like nicotine releases dopamine in the brain then the MOAs help the brain get rid of it so the smoker feels the lack od dopamine and reaches for another cigarette. The other experts at the meeting were sceptical but the person doing the research was going to complete it and publish. I wish I could find it again.

 

[Aaron1100us]

I smoked for 20 years. Started using e cigsthree weeks go today. Smoking an analog dosn't even sound good. I vape all day long though so for me, it is the nicotine. But I'm cutting myself off nicotine and will eventually go for no nicotine.

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[StormFinch]

I'm seeing a lot of anti-government paranoia in this thread, but the people who make the addiction claims are not bureaucrats, they are scientists (and sociologists, too).

Blakeslee, Sandra (1987-03-29). "Nicotine: Harder to Kick Than *censored*". The New York Times.

"Division of Periodontology: Tobacco Use Cessation Program". umn.edu. Retrieved 2012-12-19.

Hate to tell you this ziggy, but Sandra Blakeslee isn't a scientist (she's a science writer, whatever that means) and U of M is quoting a handful of studies paid for by Big Pharmaceutical, who also happens to donate funds toward most medical schools. If you want to know someone's agenda, follow the money. For example, the brunt of the FDA's budget comes from pharmaceutical companies, not the taxpayers. When a drug is shown to be dangerous, the last thing the FDA does is pull it off the market, and sometimes it takes a whistle blower to get that done. Who then are they really protecting?

 

[realitykid]

Honestly, I believe that nicotine is addicting. In fact, I ended up writing a paper about it for my verbal communications class. So, from my own research and experience, nicotine is highly addictive. It may not effect everyone equally, but that doesn't change the facts that it is a highly addictive substance to many.

In fact, here is a link to that very same paper: https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/11302011/nicotine_presentation.docx

 

[chips]

Honestly, I believe that nicotine is addicting. In fact, I ended up writing a paper about it for my verbal communications class. So, from my own research and experience, nicotine is highly addictive. It may not effect everyone equally, but that doesn't change the facts that it is a highly addictive substance to many.

In fact, here is a link to that very same paper: https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/11302011/nicotine_presentation.docx

Nicotine is addictive for sure and thanks for sharing your paper, thats good work.

The OP I think was pointing out that it is not ONLY the nicotine in tobacco smoke that causes dependency. There are many other ingredients (harmine for example, a powerful MAOI antidepressant) that make quitting smoking so difficult. Ecig vapour on the other hand, does not contain all the other harmful chemicals that tobacco smoke does. Most e liquid contains nicotine and so people still have to deal with a dependency on nicotine, IF they feel it is a problem for them.

It has to be remembered though. that there are many addictive substances that people ingest, caffeine, alcohol, even sugar etc, that in moderation do not do any harm. It is not addiction that is a problem, it is if whatever you are addicted to is causing some harm, only then is it a cause for concern.

An addiction to caffeine for example, is not the same as an addiction to class a drugs ..........if you see what I mean.

 

[realitykid]

Nicotine is addictive for sure and thanks for sharing your paper, thats good work.

The OP I think was pointing out that it is not ONLY the nicotine in tobacco smoke that causes dependency. There are many other ingredients (harmine for example, a powerful MAOI antidepressant) that make quitting smoking so difficult. Ecig vapour on the other hand, does not contain all the other harmful chemicals that tobacco smoke does. Most e liquid contains nicotine and so people still have to deal with a dependency on nicotine, IF they feel it is a problem for them.

It has to be remembered though. that there are many addictive substances that people ingest, caffeine, alcohol, even sugar etc, that in moderation do not do any harm. It is not addiction that is a problem, it is if whatever you are addicted to is causing some harm, only then is it a cause for concern.

An addiction to caffeine for example, is not the same as an addiction to class a drugs ..........if you see what I mean.

I'm glad you enjoyed my paper. Thank you for taking a look at it.


I felt that the OP was trying to completely dismiss nicotine as addictive. But, looking at it now I can see what you mean and how I may have been wrong. So thank you for the clarification.

However, I still stand behind my understanding of nicotine as being highly addictive, even though the OP tries to play it off as simply mildly addicting. His research may very well have lead him to that conclusion, and I'm not going to bash his researching methods. But I don't think everything that his research has led him to conclude is entirely accurate.

For me, if you take away a cigarette and just give me an ecig with nicotine juice, then I'll be fine with little to no withdrawals. That in itself leads me to believe that the OP isn't 100% correct, or at least that what he found doesn't apply to everyone.

 

[WarHawk-AVG]

Here is my take on it

http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...iscussion/465485-its-not-nicotine-stupid.html

Nicotine ha NEVER been the problem!

 

[realitykid]

Here is my take on it

http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...iscussion/465485-its-not-nicotine-stupid.html

Nicotine ha NEVER been the problem!

Any references?

 

[zoiDman]

Yeah... Nicotine is Not Addictive.

That is why Everyone has such an Easy time using 0mg e-Liquids.